Post-Game Talk: The Curious Case of Benjamin Hutton -- Canucks win 1-0 (Yes we McCann.)

[Powder]

Still pretty troubling logic on Desjardins part though. He's been tried in an offensive role so many times already. Kenins does have a very deceptively good snapshot, IMO. I think the style of game is way more important than pure overpowering shot.

I know he was put in an offensive role early last season, and I'm sure Willie knows that too, but I guess this is more or a "let me double check just to make sure" kind of experiment. I don't doubt that this won't work, but still, when your boss spends a 2nd round pick on a player, you need to do your best to have him succeed before you tell your boss that he's useless. That's just reality.

I simply disagree about Kenins' shot, but I agree that the style of game is more important. Still, line chemistry isn't science and although most lines are predictable, some just click for no apparent reason. I mean, Kenins has had opportunities with the Sedins a few times and I don't recall anything special. We'll see.

 

[MS]

On that note...



This just goes to show how Willie is admitting that Vey isn't performing well in a bottom-6 role. I essentially read this as "well, that didn't work... umm... maybe he can play in an offensive role? I don't know what else to do..."

Not really sure of the point of this, since there is clearly (you'd hope) absolutely no way Vey is one of the top 3 centers on the team coming out of camp.

Trying him at wing on a scoring line might make a bit of sense (especially given how Baertschi has struggled) but unless they drop Horvat to the 4th line - which should be grounds for a coach firing - the only spot for Vey is with Prust and Dorsett.

 

[FroshaugFan2]

On that note...



This just goes to show how Willie is admitting that Vey isn't performing well in a bottom-6 role. I essentially read this as "well, that didn't work... umm... maybe he can play in an offensive role? I don't know what else to do..."

Took him until now to realize what we here were saying all summer.

Now where's our real 4th line center?

 

[Knight53]

If Vey never played for medicine hat he would not be given these opportunities probably would not even be with the organization

 

[Powder]

Not really sure of the point of this, since there is clearly (you'd hope) absolutely no way Vey is one of the top 3 centers on the team coming out of camp.

Trying him at wing on a scoring line might make a bit of sense (especially given how Baertschi has struggled) but unless they drop Horvat to the 4th line - which should be grounds for a coach firing - the only spot for Vey is with Prust and Dorsett.

That also came to my mind. Hypothetically, let's say on the off-chance that line works to Vey's strengths (which are...?), that would leave Sutter and Horvat as your 3rd and 4th line centres, since you won't play Vrbata on anything lower than your 2nd. In the end, this is a preseason game and experimenting/double-checking is what these games are for.

 

[tantalum]

On that note...


This just goes to show how Willie is admitting that Vey isn't performing well in a bottom-6 role. I essentially read this as "well, that didn't work... umm... maybe he can play in an offensive role? I don't know what else to do..."

We saw that already last season. It's why he ended the season in the pressbox when healthy bodies returned after starting the year in the top 6 and first unit PP. 10 pounds of muscle isn't going to change the fact that every forward not named Prust is better than him when it comes to offense (and honestly similar number of players better than him on the defensive side of the puck).

If this was a fair competition Vey should be fighting tooth and nail right now to keep from getting waived next week. I would much rather they give McCann his 9 games and see what he can do or give Gaunce a shot at it and if those don't work find a different solution. Either way I don't think Vey is on my team. I look for a different solution.

I want to go back to Stockholm where I basically ignored this team for a week....

 

[VanillaCoke]

Vey need to get atleast a point tonight. That line needs to look like its an offensive threat.

 

[MS]

That also came to my mind. Hypothetically, let's say on the off-chance that line works to Vey's strengths (which are...?), that would leave Sutter and Horvat as your 3rd and 4th line centres, since you won't play Vrbata on anything lower than your 2nd. In the end, this is a preseason game and experimenting/double-checking is what these games are for.

I'm all for experimenting, but it should be experimenting with a purpose.

Giving Vey a shot at the #2 wing spot to create some competition with Baertschi and possibly light a fire under him makes sense.

Dropping guys into positions they have no chance of filling really does nothing. Same as putting Grenier with the Sedins.

 

[m9]

I'm all for experimenting, but it should be experimenting with a purpose.

Giving Vey a shot at the #2 wing spot to create some competition with Baertschi and possibly light a fire under him makes sense.

Dropping guys into positions they have no chance of filling really does nothing. Same as putting Grenier with the Sedins.

Putting numbers on lines (aside from the 1st) doesn't really matter on this team.

Sven-Vey-Vrbata would likely be a pseudo 4th line that gets their minutes buoyed by PP time. That likely puts Sutter with Prust and Dorsett, and maybe Burrows/Horvat/Hansen. Or Burrows bumps back with the Sedins and whichever LW wins the job plays with Horvat and Hansen until Higgins gets back.

I'm more about the combos than the numbers - if Vey is in your top 12 I am fine with trying him on a line with Sven and Vrbata. Whether you call it the second line or the fourth line doesn't matter.

 

[Billy Kvcmu]

If Vey can't be effective with skill linemates, then it's the end of his NHL career.

 

[fancouver]

I always thought Virtanen's playing style was like Booth or Torres. North-South players who don't cycle very well. Not sure how it'll compliment the Sedin game.

 

[Pip]

Lines from Twitter;



Of note - Sutter not skating with Baertschi and Vrbata. Although Vey is hardly an upgrade.

McCann getting an interesting look on a possible checking line with Sutter and Burrows is also intriguing.

EDIT:

D-Pairs;

On the backend it'll be interesting to see Hutton without Tanev.

 

[MS]

Putting numbers on lines (aside from the 1st) doesn't really matter on this team.

Sven-Vey-Vrbata would likely be a pseudo 4th line that gets their minutes buoyed by PP time. That likely puts Sutter with Prust and Dorsett, and maybe Burrows/Horvat/Hansen. Or Burrows bumps back with the Sedins and whichever LW wins the job plays with Horvat and Hansen until Higgins gets back.

I'm more about the combos than the numbers - if Vey is in your top 12 I am fine with trying him on a line with Sven and Vrbata. Whether you call it the second line or the fourth line doesn't matter.

That makes no sense and is grasping at straws and turning your entire forward group upside-down just to accommodate one crappy fringe player and put him in a ridiculous position to succeed - Vey.

However, given our coach I wouldn't bet against it happening.

 

[Mr. Canucklehead]

On the backend it'll be interesting to see Hutton without Tanev.

Truth. I also suspected they would pair these two together as they will form a likely combo in Utica.

 

[Nucker101]

I would be absolutely shocked if Virtanen had the hockey IQ and positional sense to keep up with the Sedins.

Fully agree. He'll need speedy/playmaking center, not two guys who rely on the cycle game/positioning and hockey sense to score goals.

 

[canuckking1]

Matthews would be perfect for Virtanen he has such unreal playmaking ability

 

[Tinhorn1]

I was trying to be sanguine about this season, giving the benefit of the doubt, etc., and it's still too early for anyone to be making strong conclusions about this team, coaching, all the rest. But I have to say even I am a bit concerned how it appears as though many of Benning's acquisitions might come to stand in the way of a better team (Vey, maybe Sutter, Sbisa, Prust/Dorsett, Miller). Yes, Vey would obviously be best served in an offensive role. But is what's best for Vey what's best for the team?

Also, since we now have a clear need for a proper 4c, wouldn't it have made sense to look a few months down the road and give Gaunce a bit of time at centre last year? I remember many posters stating this obvious fact.

What can you say except... oh, well! Hope it works out somehow in a results-oriented fashion. That would be swell.

 

[MS]

I was trying to be sanguine about this season, giving the benefit of the doubt, etc., and it's still too early for anyone to be making strong conclusions about this team, coaching, all the rest. But I have to say even I am a bit concerned how it appears as though many of Benning's acquisitions might come to stand in the way of a better team (Vey, maybe Sutter, Sbisa, Prust/Dorsett, Miller). Yes, Vey would obviously be best served in an offensive role. But is what's best for Vey what's best for the team?

Also, since we now have a clear need for a proper 4c, wouldn't it have made sense to look a few months down the road and give Gaunce a bit of time at centre last year? I remember many posters stating this obvious fact.

What can you say except... oh, well! Hope it works out somehow in a results-oriented fashion. That would be swell.

Sbisa/Miller/Prust/Vey are literally $13 million in replacement level garbage that could easily be replaced by 4 journeymen making the league minimum. Or young players with upside.

Sutter is at least a useful player, but is again a huge waste of assets and money.

 

[Bad Goalie]

I'm confused with the number of posters concerned with Baertschi's struggles. When he was playing without Sutter his efforts were supported. Since Sutter became his center his play has fallen off just as with most of the wingers he's ever played with. Place him with Bo and Vrbata/Virtanen as I suggested before preseason and the concerns about Sven are likely to disappear.

Good coaches pair up players with linemates who's styles mesh. Putting Sven with Sutter is just more of JB/WD forcing square pegs into round holes.

 

[m9]

That makes no sense and is grasping at straws and turning your entire forward group upside-down just to accommodate one crappy fringe player and put him in a ridiculous position to succeed - Vey.

However, given our coach I wouldn't bet against it happening.

Sure, Vey wouldn't be in my top 12 either. But if he is there and the lines end up:

Sedin-Sedin-Burrows
Higgins/replacement-Horvat-Hansen
Baertschi-Vey-Vrbata
Prust-Sutter-Dorsett

Then I don't think it's a big deal. The order I list them is irrelevant, those lines are going to be rolled and the ice time discrepancies will be in who is on the PP and PK units.

 

[tantalum]

If Vey can't be effective with skill linemates, then it's the end of his NHL career.

Even if he can be he has to be MORE effective than others to hold onto that position and the evidence thus far is that he just isn't.

 

[MS]

Sure, Vey wouldn't be in my top 12 either. But if he is there and the lines end up:

Sedin-Sedin-Burrows
Higgins/replacement-Horvat-Hansen
Baertschi-Vey-Vrbata
Prust-Sutter-Dorsett

Then I don't think it's a big deal. The order I list them is irrelevant, those lines are going to be rolled and the ice time discrepancies will be in who is on the PP and PK units.

It's paying Brandon Sutter almost $5 million to be a 4th line center and putting your two best non-Sedin skill wingers with an AHL scrub.

Yeah, the lines are going to be rolled but again - it's turning your roster upside down just to give a ridiculous unearned opportunity to Linden Vey.

 

[Aphid Attraction]

Even if he can be he has to be MORE effective than others to hold onto that position and the evidence thus far is that he just isn't.

I dont know if he needs to be MORE effective... He is older and can play a full nhl season tbat counts for somethimg

 

[m9]

It's paying Brandon Sutter almost $5 million to be a 4th line center and putting your two best non-Sedin skill wingers with an AHL scrub.

Yeah, the lines are going to be rolled but again - it's turning your roster upside down just to give a ridiculous unearned opportunity to Linden Vey.

Again, the line number is irrelevant. Sutter will get 10-12 minutes even strength and be out there for every kill and probably a bit on PP2.

I guess I'm just trying to figure out what happens next if Vey does well with these guys tonight, however low those odds are.

 

[tantalum]

I dont know if he needs to be MORE effective... He is older and can play a full nhl season tbat counts for somethimg

I wouldn't say it counts for much and I'm not sure that being older is in his favour to be honest. It just means that if there is someone younger who is close to him in ability that that is who you focus on developing.

If a 24 year old player doesn't have to be more effective than another player to win a spot then there is something wrong with how they are handing out spots.