Seriously. You can't blame Benning for injuries sustained by a grinder signed long-term into his 30s! It's just a flukey thing that happened to Roussel. Well, okay Roussel and Ferland. Well, okay Roussel and Ferland and Sutter. Well, okay Roussel and Ferland and Sutter and Dorsett. The point is, Jim Benning is a master scout who just can't outrun karma.
The Antoine Roussel thread
- Thread starter Canuck16
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Seriously. You can't blame Benning for injuries sustained by a grinder signed long-term into his 30s! It's just a flukey thing that happened to Roussel. Well, okay Roussel and Ferland. Well, okay Roussel and Ferland and Sutter. Well, okay Roussel and Ferland and Sutter and Dorsett. The point is, Jim Benning is a master scout who just can't outrun karma.
I agree that his first year pre-injury was fine value. But bottom six players at his age generally decline (whether injury related or not) so the term and cap hit was unquestionably stupid at the time because it was likely that Roussel’s play would deteriorate throughout his contract (which it did) given his age and skill set. The flat cap isnt overly relevant since the contract was on its face a bad contract at the time of signing. None of this is hindsight and was well documented at the time.
Yes, who would have thought a bottom six grinder’s play would deteriorate in that player’s 30s. Chance in a million really.
And if Benning had signed him to a 1-2 year deal, great!
But when you sign a smallish energy player to a 4-year contract running deep into his 30s and he suffers an injury limiting his effectiveness at some point, that's incredibly predictable. As it was for Dorsett, but they learned nothing there.
Same thing for the 3rd year on Baertschi. Or the last couple years on Sutter.
Injuries happen, but when you give depth players overly long contracts and those injuries happen, you get screwed. And it isn't 'bad luck' when that happens, it's bad planning. If Roussel/Baertschi/Sutter were on appropriate deals, their contracts would have been expiring right at the time the injuries mounted up and their careers went in the toilet.
I get that and one can even make a case not to essentially sign anyone past the age of 30, especially forwards.
I don't think the comparison to Dorsett is a fair one though. Roussell was historically a much better player who often played higher in the lineup and his contract also ends a year earlier (age wise).
He was buoyed entirely by 2nd line ice time with Horvat.
15GF 5GA with Horvat
15GF 26GA without.
I was actually trying to remember Roussel's fantastic first year and then realized he scored half as many goals in that year as Virtanen did last year; I guess it remains a matter of context.
| 2018-19 |  Vancouver Canucks | NHL | 65 | 9 | 22 | 31 | 5 | 118 | | |
PG Canuck
Registered User
- Mar 29, 2010
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The knee bone is connected to the brain bone, apparently.
This guy plays dumb and the antics aren't worth it.
Next.
This guy plays dumb and the antics aren't worth it.
Next.
True, but to his credit he also did mesh well with Horvat that year and played good hockey in that role - surprisingly - and does deserve credit for that. Tanner Pearson ain't getting goal differentials like that with Horvat right now.
I actually like Roussel and find the white hot hatred for him here curious but this statement is right on the money. I like to say he gets 2 minutes for being Antoine Roussel almost every game. Annoying as hell but we need a guy like him in our lineup. Still plays a solid defensive game from where I sit and has sneaky offence. Admittedly he is close to being done...
Both suck.I was actually trying to remember Roussel's fantastic first year and then realized he scored half as many goals in that year as Virtanen did last year; I guess it remains a matter of context.
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
2018-19 NHL 65 9 22 31 5 118 |
Virtanen’s fluke season is comparable to Antoine’s.
They’re both bad value. Neither should be in the lineup.
Roussel is a smarter player. Let that sink in.
And who was Horvat's best winger at the time? Roussel. This article has quick summary. Horvat's points per 60 with Roussel was better than with anyone else by a good margin (at the time of the article).
Yeah there was a nice hot streak there. Was never sustainable. A sign of a flawed team is Roussel in the top 6.
Granlund scored 18 once.
Roussel’s deal was terrible. Players of his ilk and style rarely age well and lose hunger once on big contracts.
He’s embarrassing.
He was signed to a 4 year contract that carried him to age 32. It's kind of weird that the same posters who criticize Benning for letting a 30 year old Brad Richardson go to Arizona on a 3 year contract would say it's stupid to sign a 28 year old Roussel to a 4 year contract (by the end of their first year Richardson was 31 and Roussel was 29).
Actually Roussel's underlying numbers were similar to what he was able to put up in Dallas.
But this is just proof of why Greener would never consider playing them together again.
https://en.meming.world/images/en/6/67/Roll_Safe_meme_4.jpg
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krutovsdonut
eeyore
- Sep 25, 2016
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except for his periodic badly timed shenanigans, i think roussel is ok as a bottom 6 grinder. i'd like more but cannot say he's terrible and normally he's not on my radar. he's overpaid without question but he's an nhl quality player and some of the premium we pay is for the agitator stuff which he does deliver most games, he has a few notable missteps which seem to be par for the course for guys like that.
and in his defence, being an agitator is hard when the team does not appear to have a coherent goal of winning hockey games to guide your behaviour. it seems pointless.
and in his defence, being an agitator is hard when the team does not appear to have a coherent goal of winning hockey games to guide your behaviour. it seems pointless.
I think a good case could be made that if Roussel was just waived or retired and there were no other additions or subtractions other than this, the team would be better.
Nucker101
Foundational Poster
- Apr 2, 2013
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I liked him before the injury, he’s lost a step now and it’s hurt his forechecking ability and overall effectiveness big time.
Maybe if he was rotated in and out of the lineup, we’d see some more juice in his legs.
Maybe if he was rotated in and out of the lineup, we’d see some more juice in his legs.
sting101
Registered User
- Feb 8, 2012
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Yep this market is toxic for anything related to JB that doesn't outplay expectations.
He's a guy that typically drags the team into the fight and that is an important element to have unfortunately he's lost a step and as you say he's maligned by the officials. 1st year was a great pick up. Since the ACL not so much.
4yrs for an almost 29yr old in his role was a bad gamble
You never know with knee injuries. Look at how Leivo is doing. He's not the same player.
Hit the post
I have your gold medal Zippy!
He played more than well for us up to his injury. Don’t recall injuries being that much if any of any issue in regards to him unlike Ferland. Much like David Booth was playing as your typical 2nd line winger before that Avs player gave him a knee-to-knee hit.
I give Benning a complete pass on this.
