*The All-Purpose Sean Monahan Thread*

[MarkGio]

Monahan wants to go. Every kid dreams of a gold medal, a Stanley Cup, an Art Ross, and every other accolade available. They want to be the best and prove it at every level. Now you're just being argumentative Hudlinator. Obviously its a great experience.

Id argue it would teach him how to play with different players of different skill levels and in turn, that teaches him in how to learn the game. Schroedinger's cat: once you've read a book, you're no longer the same person.

 

[TheHudlinator]

Monahan wants to go. Every kid dreams of a gold medal, a Stanley Cup, an Art Ross, and every other accolade available. They want to be the best and prove it at every level. Now you're just being argumentative Hudlinator. Obviously its a great experience.

Id argue it would teach him how to play with different players of different skill levels and in turn, that teaches him in how to learn the game. Schroedinger's cat: once you've read a book, you're no longer the same person.

Looking at past teams it seems most would agree with me as only those that were struggling were released. I didn't realize asking why the WJC was better for him was being argumentative.

 

[fallsviewafro*]

Taking his NHL experience and applying it to a leadership role in the most elite competition in his age group? That's growth. Just because the NHL is the highest level of competition possible doesn't mean he has nothing to gain by participating in a lesser level in a different role.

You simply cannot use logic like that, as it ignores many major factors that play into a growing player's development. The level of competition is a major factor, but not the only one. What about ice time? What about his aforementioned leadership development? His capacity for mentoring others? You can't understate the effect of being a big fish in a small pond on a player's psyche and confidence, and its not like the WJC is beer-league competition either. Playing for Canada is a big deal. Big-game experience is a big deal. I can't possibly fathom how keeping him out of the WJC would be doing him any good.

Its two weeks. The only way it would be a detriment is if he came back with an injury (knock on wood), which is arguably more likely to happen in the NHL anyways. If he stays up, he's got plenty of NHL games to play in... I don't doubt he's going to get a big enough taste of the big show for one year.

 

[MarkGio]

Looking at past teams it seems most would agree with me as only those that were struggling were released. I didn't realize asking why the WJC was better for him was being argumentative.

Its philosophy from outer space. Prove how its a greater experience or better for one's development? How can we quantify abstract principles like development and experience? We're talking from planet earth on how WJC is great for a guy because I'm sure everyone here who's ever played hockey would love to play for gold.

But since we're on this, how do we know player's are sent because they're struggling, using deductive reasoning? Maybe that's an assumption?

 

[Beats By CoRD]

Taking his NHL experience and applying it to a leadership role in the most elite competition in his age group? That's growth. Just because the NHL is the highest level of competition possible doesn't mean he has nothing to gain by participating in a lesser level in a different role.

You simply cannot use logic like that, as it ignores many major factors that play into a growing player's development. The level of competition is a major factor, but not the only one. What about ice time? What about his aforementioned leadership development? His capacity for mentoring others? You can't understate the effect of being a big fish in a small pond on a player's psyche and confidence, and its not like the WJC is beer-league competition either.

Its two weeks. The only way it would be a detriment is if he came back with an injury (knock on wood), which is arguably more likely to happen in the NHL anyways.

Thank you!!! Someone is always better at explaining things than I am.

Well said.

 

[TheHudlinator]

Its philosophy from outer space. Prove how its a greater experience or better for one's development? How can we quantify abstract principles like development and experience? We're talking from planet earth on how WJC is great for a guy because I'm sure everyone here who's ever played hockey would love to play for gold.

But since we're on this, how do we know player's are sent because they're struggling, using deductive reasoning? Maybe that's an assumption?

Almost every player that were released were playing low minutes and weren't producing well aka they were struggling. I know you can't prove it is better or worse that is why asked because so many feel it would be good for him and I was simply asking why they thought it would be, because most NHL teams don't feel that way unless the rookie isn't lighting up the NHL.

 

[Beats By CoRD]

Almost every player that were sent back were playing low minutes and weren't producing well aka they were struggling. I know you can't prove it is better or worse that is why asked because so many feel it would be good for him and I was simply asking why they thought it would be, because most NHL teams don't feel that way unless the rookie isn't lighting up the NHL.

Going to play in the WJC is by no means "being sent back", in fact it's an honour.

 

[TheHudlinator]

Taking his NHL experience and applying it to a leadership role in the most elite competition in his age group? That's growth. Just because the NHL is the highest level of competition possible doesn't mean he has nothing to gain by participating in a lesser level in a different role.

You simply cannot use logic like that, as it ignores many major factors that play into a growing player's development. The level of competition is a major factor, but not the only one. What about ice time? What about his aforementioned leadership development? His capacity for mentoring others? You can't understate the effect of being a big fish in a small pond on a player's psyche and confidence, and its not like the WJC is beer-league competition either. Playing for Canada is a big deal. Big-game experience is a big deal. I can't possibly fathom how keeping him out of the WJC would be doing him any good.

Its two weeks. The only way it would be a detriment is if he came back with an injury (knock on wood), which is arguably more likely to happen in the NHL anyways. If he stays up, he's got plenty of NHL games to play in... I don't doubt he's going to get a big enough taste of the big show for one year.

That is a decent argument. He could be a leader on that team but from the sounds of things he is learning to be a leader in the NHL from Hudler. He most likely isn't going to significantly gain or lose anything from going but if we are still in a fight for a playoff spot and he is still playing this well then I would keep him.

I don't think the WJC is good for development for players coming from the NHL as opposed to going from the CHL. The game is lower and players aren't as strong, while they are learning a different situation its not like Hartley is afraid to play him here in any situation so I don't think he will see anything there he wouldn't here.

 

[TheHudlinator]

Going to play in the WJC is by no means "being sent back", in fact it's an honour.

Sorry I meant released but it doesn't change my point.

 

[fallsviewafro*]

That is a decent argument. He could be a leader on that team but from the sounds of things he is learning to be a leader in the NHL from Hudler. He most likely isn't going to significantly gain or lose anything from going but if we are still in a fight for a playoff spot and he is still playing this well then I would keep him.

I don't think the WJC is good for development for players coming from the NHL as opposed to going from the CHL. The game is lower and players aren't as strong, while they are learning a different situation its not like Hartley is afraid to play him here in any situation so I don't think he will see anything there he wouldn't here.

You don't learn leadership from someone; you learn it by doing. He could talk to Hudler til he's blue in the face, but it wouldn't match the experience of firing up his team in the 2nd intermission of the gold-medal game while down 3-0. He knows all about 3 goal leads and how tricky they can be, anyways

I think he wouldn't get anything from going down to the OHL, because the 67's suck. That's certainly a good argument about the level of competition not doing him any good. In a world-elite class for his age group, I think there's a lot to be gained in a situation where you are out to prove that you are the baddest mother****ing 19 year old in the world. Its not so much that Hartley isn't afraid to play him in a multitude of situations; its the fact that he's going to be looked up to as the Iginla for the WJCs. Taking on that leadership role is a huge step for a young kid learning how to assert himself in a man's league.

 

[TheHudlinator]

You don't learn leadership from someone; you learn it by doing. He could talk to Hudler til he's blue in the face, but it wouldn't match the experience of firing up his team in the 2nd intermission of the gold-medal game while down 3-0. He knows all about 3 goal leads and how tricky they can be, anyways

I think he wouldn't get anything from going down to the OHL, because the 67's suck. That's certainly a good argument about the level of competition not doing him any good. In a world-elite class for his age group, I think there's a lot to be gained in a situation where you are out to prove that you are the baddest mother****ing 19 year old in the world. Its not so much that Hartley isn't afraid to play him in a multitude of situations; its the fact that he's going to be looked up to as the Iginla for the WJCs. Taking on that leadership role is a huge step for a young kid learning how to assert himself in a man's league.

He most likely wouldn't be captain and while he may get looked up to the fact of the matter is the better teams and players are in the NHL and unless he really slows down I see no reason to shake up his routine.

 

[MarkGio]

He most likely wouldn't be captain and while he may get looked up to the fact of the matter is the better teams and players are in the NHL and unless he really slows down I see no reason to shake up his routine.

I think the level of competition at the WJC is equal to or greater than the NHL for Monahan because its more concentrated hockey. In the NHL, every team will have 5 really lazy games over the course of an 82 game season. But in a global, gold medal tournament, its intense for every shift, except in games against France or whoever.

Plus he'll get more ice time there. He won't get sheltered minutes like he's getting here, and he's facing quality competition, not an NHL team's 3rd or 2nd line.

 

[TheHudlinator]

I think the level of competition at the WJC is equal to or greater than the NHL for Monahan because its more concentrated hockey. In the NHL, every team will have 5 really lazy games over the course of an 82 game season. But in a global, gold medal tournament, its intense for every shift, except in games against France or whoever.

Plus he'll get more ice time there. He won't get sheltered minutes like he's getting here, and he's facing quality competition, not an NHL team's 3rd or 2nd line.

I disagree that the teams top lines are better than what Monahan is play against especially at defense.

He may get a few more minutes of ice time but that really isn't that much.

Hartley will not allow a shift to go by without giving 100% this is no longer an old boys club.

 

[MarkGio]

I disagree that the teams top lines are better than what Monahan is play against especially at defense.

He may get a few more minutes of ice time but that really isn't that much.

Hartley will not allow a shift to go by without giving 100% this is no longer an old boys club.

Its only for like a week?! What's the biggy?

 

[TheHudlinator]

Its only for like a week?! What's the biggy?

Its for 3 weeks or so counting camp, he will probably miss 6 games and after what happened to Columbus last year and us in the past I doubt they give him up for that long.

 

[MarkGio]

Its for 3 weeks or so counting camp, he will probably miss 6 games and after what happened to Columbus last year and us in the past I doubt they give him up for that long.

6 games? That's nothing. Hell we lose Backlund 6 games a month at least! I'm sure he'll remember it when the Flames low-ball the hell out of him during contract negotiations

 

[Calculon]

In terms of development, the WJC is vastly overrated by its fans. Monahan would be better off in the NHL, but it really depends on how the he and the team are faring. If Monahan and/or the team are struggling and his ice time is at 10 or less minutes a night, then it'd be better for his confidence if he gets the chance to dominate the tournament. If on the other hand, he's solidified his position and averages at least 13 or more minutes a night, then it's not a big deal if he stays with the club.

 

[TheHudlinator]

6 games? That's nothing. Hell we lose Backlund 6 games a month at least! I'm sure he'll remember it when the Flames low-ball the hell out of him during contract negotiations

More reason to keep him. I think there is a reason that most players don't get released for the WJC.

 

[TheHudlinator]

In terms of development, the WJC is vastly overrated by its fans. Monahan would be better off in the NHL, but it really depends on how the he and the team are faring. If Monahan and/or the team are struggling and his ice team is at 10 or less minutes a night, then it'd be better for his confidence if he gets the chance to dominate the tournament. If on the other hand, he's solidified his position and averages at least 13 or more minutes a night, then it's not a big deal if he stays with the club.

This is what I was trying to say.

 

[tmurfin]

It's not just the level of competition, it's the experience he would gain, leading, winning or losing, playing big time games with huge amounts of pressure.. Don't forget, this tourney is like the Olympics for these kids, and they don't get a crack every 4 years,

 

[Lunatik]

I see both arguments.

NHL is great experience for him, so is the WJC. I am not so sure one of better than the other. While on one hand Monohan could be a leader at the WJC, the competition at teh NHL level is much higher.

There is also 1 question that should be asked. What if Monahan goes to the WJC and struggles? That has to be harder on the confidence than struggling in the NHL.

 

[Hand of Gaudreau]

I see both arguments.

NHL is great experience for him, so is the WJC. I am not so sure one of better than the other. While on one hand Monohan could be a leader at the WJC, the competition at teh NHL level is much higher.

There is also 1 question that should be asked. What if Monahan goes to the WJC and struggles? That has to be harder on the confidence than struggling in the NHL.

Then I think we have more to worry about than just his confidence, he should be dynamite in the WJC. I don't foresee him staying with the Flames though, so I don't know if it will be an issue.

 

[InfinityIggy]

Sending a player to the WJC from their NHL team is usually only done when a player is playing small minutes, and a small role for their team. Monahan is not that player so far. Hes become a key cog in the Flames machine so far and if they keep playing him with the minutes they have, he won't be going to the WJC, and im glad. If they decide he can only play sheltered minutes, but still want to keep him up, then sending him to the WJC could be a good thing.

 

[Lunatik]

Then I think we have more to worry about than just his confidence, he should be dynamite in the WJC. I don't foresee him staying with the Flames though, so I don't know if it will be an issue.

Wait, so of Monahan has a cold stretch that coincides with the World Juniors we have more to worry about his confidence? Hockey is an up and down game, players of every calibre have hot and cold stretches.

 

[Akipa]

An article on why Monahan's fate is no easy decision for the Calgary Flames:

http://lastwordonsports.com/2013/10/18/monahans-fate-no-easy-decision/