The All Purpose "Jack Johnson Sucks" Thread

[Empoleon8771]

It was a response to another poster's comment that JJ was a defensive defenseman on par with Scuderi and Gill for us and the numbers were probably comparable because they were just as good or bad as he was and he'd therefore probably help the Pens as much as they did...and this poster looked at the numbers and said no way....that's all I know...

Outside of their GF% stats, they are similar stats with Johnson and Scuderi. The original poster's comment was a fair one, I don't know how you can look at those stats and say "no way" to that claim.

If their claim was that it was ridiculous that Johnson and Scuderi are mentioned in the same category, that's a crap take and the stats don't even support their claim. If their claim is that Johnson is worse than 2009 Scuderi but 2009 Scuderi also sucked, I'd buy it.

 

[ZeroPucksGiven]

View attachment 189551

Hope you don't mind me using as my avatar

 

[Randy Butternubs]

From the Mackey chat:

Randy B
2:02
Rutherford has seemingly criticized every player this year with the exception of Crosby, Letang, and Jack Johnson. How and why is Johnson excluded from criticism?

Jason Mackey
2:05
Not quite sure, Randy. I found Rutherford's comments yesterday odd. The media was not rude when Jack signed here, nor was the question I used in my story verbatim out of line. Completely fair. ... It's funny, we heard from fans that we're not hard enough on Rutherford and others for Johnson being in the lineup. Then we heard from Rutherford that we've been too hard on the trade.



LN
2:11
do you think one of the reasons the Pens gave Johnson 5 years is because he cannot make above a certain dollar amount per year due to his bankruptcy issues, so the pens gave him more years even if they have to eat the last one or two years? meaning they are getting him cheaper now than maybe they would have otherwise been able to due to his personal situation.

Jason Mackey
2:13
It's my understanding that Jack needed to make a certain dollar amount total on what he views as likely his last NHL contract. Basically the money he needs to get out of it, get back to where he was, something like that. Other teams -- Detroit and Anaheim were the main two the Penguins competed against -- got there in fewer years. The Penguins wanted less of a yearly hit and were comfortable going to five.



guest
2:14
I am one who is rooting for Johnson, he seems like a nice guy, seems excited to be here, and you can't help but feel bad for the personal issues he has had to deal with. I assume he is also a good locker room guy? Sounds like an underdog that is the type of person Pittsburgher's get behind.

Jason Mackey
2:15
Yes, Jack is tremendous to deal with. Very nice guy. I also think he can be an affective player when used right. While I understand the frustration over giving a 31-year-old coming off a down year a five-year deal -- it's too long -- I don't think he's been unplayable over the past 40 games or so like some people. Beginning of the season was rough, yes, but the whole team stunk.

 

[Turin]

Johnson has been bad for over 20 months straight now. Please Detroit or Anaheim...

 

[Empoleon8771]

LN
2:11
do you think one of the reasons the Pens gave Johnson 5 years is because he cannot make above a certain dollar amount per year due to his bankruptcy issues, so the pens gave him more years even if they have to eat the last one or two years? meaning they are getting him cheaper now than maybe they would have otherwise been able to due to his personal situation.

Jason Mackey
2:13
It's my understanding that Jack needed to make a certain dollar amount total on what he views as likely his last NHL contract. Basically the money he needs to get out of it, get back to where he was, something like that. Other teams -- Detroit and Anaheim were the main two the Penguins competed against -- got there in fewer years. The Penguins wanted less of a yearly hit and were comfortable going to five.

If this is true, I'm contacting Detroit and Anaheim to see if they'd trade for Johnson. Maybe if they were willing to do $4 million a year for 4 years (just a guess on my part, that would come close to equaling the money that Johnson got with the Penguins), they would be happy to acquire Johnson for $3.25 million a year after this year.

I don't really know why Johnson took extra years and no extra money, though. That just seems like a bad financial decision for him.

 

[Coach Travis]

Those stats just tell me that Dumoulin and Johnson are about equal in terms of PKing ability, which really isn't much of a shot against Johnson

I get criticizing his puck moving, offense and decision making, because those are valid things to criticize. But to criticize his PK ability because his advanced stats are not as great as Letang's PKing advanced stats? Those stats tell me Letang and Maatta are fantastic PKers and Johnson and Dumoulin are both good PKers, not that Johnson is a bad PKer (which is what Jesse is pushing).

Jesse isn't pushing that JJ is bad on the PK, just that any narrative pushing the idea that JJ somehow makes up for his 5v5 warts by being a fantastic player on the PK is false.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Jesse isn't pushing that JJ is bad on the PK, just that any narrative pushing the idea that JJ somehow makes up for his 5v5 warts by being a fantastic player on the PK is false.

Oh okay, that's fair then. I think the idea that he's this PKing god is totally inaccurate, but I wasn't sure if he was saying "Johnson is bad on the PK" or "Johnson isn't nearly as good as the Penguins try to say he is".

 

[Fogel]

Part of the argument for him was that he was good at clearing out the area around the net, but it doesn't really show up in terms of shot location. I'd argue that the Pens are better at suppressing close shots without him on both PK and 5v5.

 

[FunkySeeFunkyDo]

I hope GMJR can get over his denial and anger and get to acceptance and some bargaining in the next few days else we'll be stuck in depression for the rest of the season.

 

[PensPlz]

He sucks

 

[Turin]

Part of the argument for him was that he was good at clearing out the area around the net, but it doesn't really show up in terms of shot location. I'd argue that the Pens are better at suppressing close shots without him on both PK and 5v5.

They have access to all these stats and more. Pretty sure the coaches even go over a lot of them during meetings and practice. Something is absolutely rotten and it feels like JR’s ego.

 

[Malkinstheman]

They have access to all these stats and more. Pretty sure the coaches even go over a lot of them during meetings and practice. Something is absolutely rotten and it feels like JR’s ego.

JR may be forcing JJ into the line-up but that doesnt mean Sully has to play him 20 mins a game. Shelter him or stop playing him behind our stars. Both JR and Sully are at fault here.

 

[MetalheadPenguinsFan]

How did this f***ing clown make it to the NHL???

 

[EightyOne]

How did this ****ing clown make it to the NHL???

He called Kessel a dirtbag in a draft combine interview.

Won him points or some shit because management hates introverted people like Kessel?

 

[Peat]

If this is true, I'm contacting Detroit and Anaheim to see if they'd trade for Johnson. Maybe if they were willing to do $4 million a year for 4 years (just a guess on my part, that would come close to equaling the money that Johnson got with the Penguins), they would be happy to acquire Johnson for $3.25 million a year after this year.

I don't really know why Johnson took extra years and no extra money, though. That just seems like a bad financial decision for him.

I can see why he liked the stability of a long contract at his age.

That and if the money is the same in the end, Pittsburgh vs Anaheim & Detroit is easy for a guy that wants to win.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I can see why he liked the stability of a long contract at his age.

That and if the money is the same in the end, Pittsburgh vs Anaheim & Detroit is easy for a guy that wants to win.

The 3 offers were probably all long contracts, though. If Mackey said that all of the offers got Johnson the money he needed in fewer years, my guess is that they were at least 3-4 years at $4 million. Taking a 5 year at $3.25 million deal is better than 3 years at $4 million, but 4 years at $4 million is better. I think it largely depends on what that "certain dollar amount" that Mackey was referring to. Was it like $10 million and everyone hit that, and Johnson just took the most money/longest term? Or is it like $16 million, where the Penguins hit on a 5 year deal but Detroit hit on a 4 year deal?

 

[Peat]

The 3 offers were probably all long contracts, though. If Mackey said that all of the offers got Johnson the money he needed in fewer years, my guess is that they were at least 3-4 years at $4 million. Taking a 5 year at $3.25 million deal is better than 3 years at $4 million, but 4 years at $4 million is better. I think it largely depends on what that "certain dollar amount" that Mackey was referring to. Was it like $10 million and everyone hit that, and Johnson just took the most money/longest term? Or is it like $16 million, where the Penguins hit on a 5 year deal but Detroit hit on a 4 year deal?

Even the extra year helps.

In any case, I think we'd have had to be seriously outbid to lose that one. His interview made it clear he was really excited to be here - and why wouldn't he? The one time treating our players great/having a winning team/Sid works in our favour...

 

[Beauner]

Can we talk about his play on SJ's 3rd goal last night? On the PK and the puck was at the blueline...... McCann was battling and Cullen was on his way to help. What does JJ do? FLY's up to the blue line to do... what exactly? who knows. But suddenly the puck is still in our zone and we have THREE players WITHIN A FOOT OF EACH OTHER. What the actual f***? Why does he think it's okay to be at the blue line when the puck is still in our zone and there's not a guarantee he'll be able to get the puck out?

Ruhwedel played it poorly too but he never ever should've been in that situation to begin with. Such a stupid play.

 

[MrBrightside]

Last night at 5-on-5, the Pens were outshot 15-6 with Johnson on the ice. Shot attempts were 21-11 in favor of SJ.

The prior game against NJ at 5-on-5 the Pens were outshot 19-6 with Johnson on the ice.

Just sayin.'

 

[Andy99]

Lol....

 

[Gurglesons]

Last night at 5-on-5, the Pens were outshot 15-6 with Johnson on the ice. Shot attempts were 21-11 in favor of SJ.

The prior game against NJ at 5-on-5 the Pens were outshot 19-6 with Johnson on the ice.

Just sayin.'

He is literally going to cost us a playoff spot which many users around here said wasn’t possible or now want to blame Sully for playing him.

 

[Empoleon8771]

He is literally going to cost us a playoff spot which many users around here said wasn’t possible or now want to blame Sully for playing him.

No he's not. Saying stuff like this underrates the very serious problems on this team. He's one of about 5 problems that is going to cost them a playoff spot.

 

[Gurglesons]

No he's not. Saying stuff like this underrates the very serious problems on this team. He's one of about 5 problems that is going to cost them a playoff spot.

If we miss by six or so points I can easily bring up three games JJ lost single handidly

Hell, last night’s game was basically put out of reach by two bad plays by him.

 

[Empoleon8771]

If we miss by six or so points I can easily bring up three games JJ lost single handidly

Hell, last night’s game was basically put out of reach by two bad plays by him.

And I can bring up a ton of games that Sullivan, Kessel, Malkin, the 2nd pair, the goaltending and the bottom-6 blew for the Penguins. The point is that pinning the Penguins missing the playoffs on Johnson is ridiculous, it delegitimatizes the actual problems on this team.

You either have to seriously hate Johnson or be absolutely deluded about the rest of the team to think that Johnson alone is why the Penguins wouldn't make the playoffs. He's not even the biggest reason, I blame Sullivan and Kessel way more.

 

[Gurglesons]

And I can bring up a ton of games that Sullivan, Kessel, Malkin, the 2nd pair, the goaltending and the bottom-6 blew for the Penguins. The point is that pinning the Penguins missing the playoffs on Johnson is ridiculous, it delegitimatizes the actual problems on this team.

You either have to seriously hate Johnson or be absolutely deluded about the rest of the team to think that Johnson alone is why the Penguins wouldn't make the playoffs. He's not even the biggest reason, I blame Sullivan and Kessel way more.

Difference is we can point to games that Kessel and Sully won us. Please provide me an example of JJ doing anything but breaking even at any point this season.

Sullivan’s adjustments to the breakout led to our win streak and Kessel and Malkin carried this team the first couple weeks.