Speculation: The all-purpose Claude Noel job security discussion thread

[garret9]

Well, then ...I'm sure you'd agree that our forecheck was better, no? Do you think it had anything to do with the switch from a 2-1-2 strongside attack to the 2-3 / weak side lock? How about that new flip play that they tried a few times, to use our speed and gain possession and/or hem the opposition in their end. The transition game in the NZ was much better, having the center swoop across to the weak side winger, and the puck support in the D zone was improved by approximately 100%.

BUT NOPE! No credit for your Claudey boy! Any player-coach / chimp would've made those adjustments. He's a weak leader and poor motivator and his team has obviously quit on him.

Good eye. I didn't notice those things.

With the transition game, I did notice that the Caps weren't really forechecking much *especially in the first period*... part of the reason why the Jets did so well breaking out.

 

[Positive]

I was going to mention the cap as prospects hold much more value than they did back in the day

True, with the tiny amount of cap space all teams possess in this new era, the likelihood of a 'prospect for superstar' trade isn't as likely anymore.

 

[scelaton]

A bit high. Howabout say, someone statistically like Ryan Getzlaf? Centre, captain, 28 years old, cup winner, 521 pts in 556 games.

I don't think the Noel-bashers are listening to you Wings, but others are. I am with those who believe we are a marginal playoff team at best and are a 1G and possibly a 1C away from contention. There is enough talk about Pavs on other threads, so lets talk Centres.
I had the fortune to see a San Jose game, up close and live, and marvel at their finesse--Pavelski, Couture, Thornton (not to mention Marleau and Hertl who could play C) have the ability to take their O to a level of creativity mostly unseen around these parts. If we had a lineup like that, Noel would not have to preach a North-South mantra...but he doesn't.
If we are to get that #1 C, however, we will have to give up a REAL VALUABLE ASSET, not marginal pieces. Since the only area of strength we have is at RHD, that's where I would look first:Trouba, Bogo, or Buff. Of those, Buff probably has the least value in trade for a true 1C.
IMO, it's time we stopped hearing so much Noel talk after every loss (rather than at season's end) and reconciled ourselves to either the five year plan (my preferred choice) or a catalytic trade that's gonna take a lot more courage than yelling "fire the coach!"

 

[Kane9Swag]

This team isn't "fueled by passion" anymore. It needs something to really up it. It doesn't mean a coach firing or anything like that, but just motivation is needed. Especially for Pavs. I think he can be a great goalie but he needs some help staying together when he controls the puck. He needs to find a way not to repeat the same mistakes over and over again.

 

[kasps]

Look. Cheveldayoff has had enough time and has added enough pieces to this team to not have them be considered the "same old Thrashers." Half of this team has never played a minute for a team called the Thrashers but a large majority of the ones who are actually good were from Atlanta. Whatever is going on with this team is a Jets thing not an Atlanta hold over. If Chevy didn't agree, he wouldn't have re-signed all the Atlanta players.

The roster has improved, results have only marginally. That is a Winnipeg Jets coaching issue, has nothing to do with Atlanta.

It has improved but not at the point of being a contender in the very tough West conference. Chevy just can't trade for Crosby and Malkin, he needed a few prospects in the organization. When he took over, there was not one prospect that a impact player. Noel may not be the guy, who knows? The players that have been weeded out have been replaced by rookies and prospects that will take time to mature in to NHL players.

 

[surixon]

Well, then ...I'm sure you'd agree that our forecheck was better, no? Do you think it had anything to do with the switch from a 2-1-2 strongside attack to the 2-3 / weak side lock? How about that new flip play that they tried a few times, to use our speed and gain possession and/or hem the opposition in their end. The transition game in the NZ was much better, having the center swoop across to the weak side winger, and the puck support in the D zone was improved by approximately 100%.

BUT NOPE! No credit for your Claudey boy! Any player-coach / chimp would've made those adjustments. He's a weak leader and poor motivator and his team has obviously quit on him.

I liked how we played last night, but I want to see more of this before Noel gets back into my good books!

You are correct in that Noel changed up his system to one that more emphasizes the strengths of this team but the begets the question as to why he changed it?

Did he realize that he didn't have the horses to effectively utilize his 1-2-2 system or was this something that was brought up by the players in the meetings the other day?

I guess we shall see in the coming weeks if Noel has found a scheme to match the players here and if they will buy in. I myself have not been a fan for the last year or so but if he shows that he can adapt to the team he's given then I'm all for him riding out the year.

I would still like to see improvement in his goalie usage though.

 

[Jets4Life]

IMO, it's time we stopped hearing so much Noel talk after every loss (rather than at season's end) and reconciled ourselves to either the five year plan (my preferred choice) or a catalytic trade that's gonna take a lot more courage than yelling "fire the coach!"

I have a feeling you will not have to wait long for your wish..

 

[Jet]

Well, then ...I'm sure you'd agree that our forecheck was better, no? Do you think it had anything to do with the switch from a 2-1-2 strongside attack to the 2-3 / weak side lock? How about that new flip play that they tried a few times, to use our speed and gain possession and/or hem the opposition in their end. The transition game in the NZ was much better, having the center swoop across to the weak side winger, and the puck support in the D zone was improved by approximately 100%.

BUT NOPE! No credit for your Claudey boy! Any player-coach / chimp would've made those adjustments. He's a weak leader and poor motivator and his team has obviously quit on him.

I give Claude and co. big props for making adjustments, and getting the players ready for last nights game. I've put out my torch but make no mistake, I have my lighter in hand. We will see how this team sustains it

 

[Jets4Life]

Are Bombers fans just pure football fans, or is it possible that a few of them take up the odd hockey game when they aren't thinking about the Bombers 24/7/365? Cause my post was about hysterical reactionary sports fans from Winnipeg who want their coaches fired, not whether or not the Jets should be going for a rouge on the forecheck. Mmmm-k?

You obviously have never seen a Canucks forum.

 

[surixon]

I don't think the Noel-bashers are listening to you Wings, but others are. I am with those who believe we are a marginal playoff team at best and are a 1G and possibly a 1C away from contention. There is enough talk about Pavs on other threads, so lets talk Centres.
I had the fortune to see a San Jose game, up close and live, and marvel at their finesse--Pavelski, Couture, Thornton (not to mention Marleau and Hertl who could play C) have the ability to take their O to a level of creativity mostly unseen around these parts. If we had a lineup like that, Noel would not have to preach a North-South mantra...but he doesn't.
If we are to get that #1 C, however, we will have to give up a REAL VALUABLE ASSET, not marginal pieces. Since the only area of strength we have is at RHD, that's where I would look first:Trouba, Bogo, or Buff. Of those, Buff probably has the least value in trade for a true 1C.
IMO, it's time we stopped hearing so much Noel talk after every loss (rather than at season's end) and reconciled ourselves to either the five year plan (my preferred choice) or a catalytic trade that's gonna take a lot more courage than yelling "fire the coach!"

Well if there was a way to get a Getzlaf type without creating a bunch of new holes on the team than you should at least entertain it. I just don't think we are in a position to go for the jugular and make such a move just yet. The team still needs upgrades at a number of positions that I would like to see upgraded first. I think next summer Chevy should address the goaltending situation first. I legit starter would have the biggest net effect on this team. I would then try to round out the third line and maybe tinker with the defense a bit.

 

[JetsFan815]

Noel in today's press conference: "Our goaltending has been superb"

Look I used to be an unshakable Noel supporter. I'm not some "blame the coach" Noel hater. The biggest thing that has shaken my confindenc in Noel is how he's handled the goaltending situation. This might be the one thing that is Noel's ultimate downfall

 

[peter sullivan]

^ i was driving on the highway when i heard him say that...i almost went into the ditch.

 

[scelaton]

Noel in today's press conference: "Our goaltending has been superb"

Look I used to be an unshakable Noel supporter. I'm not some "blame the coach" Noel hater. The biggest thing that has shaken my confindenc in Noel is how he's handled the goaltending situation. This might be the one thing that is Noel's ultimate downfall

Yeah, that's the one thing I can't justify either.

 

[Blue Shakehead]

Noel in today's press conference: "Our goaltending has been superb"

Look I used to be an unshakable Noel supporter. I'm not some "blame the coach" Noel hater. The biggest thing that has shaken my confindenc in Noel is how he's handled the goaltending situation. This might be the one thing that is Noel's ultimate downfall

See, I can easily get behind these criticisms of Noel. Having Jokinen quarterback the leagues worst PP for 15 games last year was comical. Over usage of Pavelec combined with what appears to be blind faith in him, is also dubious. I've heard him criticize Pavs too - he said something along the lines of "pavelecs play is represented by his numbers, and he needs to be better". Criticizing Noel when he's being obviously out-coached or doesn't seem to have any answers for a prolonged losing skid (5 games last year), are completely legitimate.

The criticisms I find that are unfair are the "AHL systems" or "not a leader, can't motivate" BS. The systems criticisms tend to come from posters who don't appear to understand them, while the "not a leader" stuff is pure speculation as none of us know what is going on in the room. In fact, I would argue that the evidence so far on the leadership question is that this team is very much behind him, based on their compete level on games that he's challenged them publicly.

 

[Jesus Christ Horburn]

He's done IMO.

 

[meedle]

Noel in today's press conference: "Our goaltending has been superb"

I heard that as well and it explains why he plays Pavelec so much and not give Monty a chance. He needs to clean his koolaid glasses off and take a more objective look at whats going on around him. I would like to hear his opinion on the jets defensive game allowing almost 3 goals against every game.

 

[JetsFan815]

I heard that as well and it explains why he plays Pavelec so much and not give Monty a chance. He needs to clean his koolaid glasses off and take a more objective look at whats going on around him. I would like to hear his opinion on the jets defensive game allowing almost 3 goals against every game.

Noel must have a really low opinion of our defense than. Pavelec fans aways use the argument that "bad Jets defense is responsible for poor save %" but what if Pavelec is making our D look worse than it is?

 

[garret9]

Noel must have a really low opinion of our defense than. Pavelec fans aways use the argument that "bad Jets defense is responsible for poor save %" but what if Pavelec is making our D look worse than it is?

We know Noel tracks scoring chances; he has said the make decisions on them from time to time. We know that they aren't too bad at tracking them (I've compared some of the things they've said to my own).

So, they should know that we're not some terrible team being outchanced like crazy all the time (meaning since Jets 2.0 started in 2011; Jets aren't doing so hot this season... not Buffalo bad but not so hot).

Ya we get some nuclear threats once in a while, but if they know those two things above, there is only so much blame you can place on the d for the past few games.

 

[Guerzy]

Not sure if this was posted or mentioned, but if not here's a tidbit from Sportsnet re; Noel and possible replacements. Interesting that they bring Mike Haviland's name up, as he was the runner up to Noel when he got hired. Also, obviously Hawerchuk's name comes in the mix again. Honestly, not sure how I'd feel about Hawerchuk given his inexperience. We see Roy doing well in Colorado, as Kypreos mentions, but Roy coached 8 years in the QMJHL where as Hawerchuk has just 3 years under his belt coaching the Colts. While Hawerchuk was a player, which can be a plus (though it doesn't always work), I'm just not sure I want another inexperienced NHL coach if we do ever make a change.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/nhl-rumours-hawerchuk-jets-next-coach/

Here is the quote,

Oct. 23. After Winnipeg Jets coach Claude Noel's brutally/wonderfully honest press conference this week in which he called out his entire team and expressed his desire to bench more players, it became loud and clear that his job in on the line.

Hockey Central's insider panel is hearing that Dale Hawerchuk (currently head coach of the OHL's Barrie Colts) is the top candidate to replace Noel. Mike Haviland is another name being floated out there. True North Sports, however, has a reputation for being patient and might wait until later in the season to make the call.

Here is the video clip,

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/hc-writing-on-the-wall-for-gardiner/

 

[Howard Chuck]

I would love to see Hawerchuk *Howard Chuck* given the job and have him be successful at it ala Roy, but I don't know if that is a chance we need to take. He obviously knows the game, but seems pretty 'nice'.

 

[cbcwpg]

I'm not sure how I feel about Hawerchuk being the coach of the Jets.

There is the experience factor of having never coached at the pro level, but then again other coaches have gone from juniors to the pros. You have to start somewhere I guess.

Just might be better to look at someone with some NHL experience.

If we really start to tank Noel will be gone by Christmas, but given the "patience" the Jets seem to have, if the Jets stay hovering around the .500 mark I could see Noel lasting the whole season.

 

[YWGinYYZ]

I would love to see Hawerchuk *Howard Chuck* given the job and have him be successful at it ala Roy, but I don't know if that is a chance we need to take. He obviously knows the game, but seems pretty 'nice'.

I've sat behind the Colts bench at many games - Hawerchuk is VERY vocal and animated. Definitely not Mr. Nice Guy behind the bench.

That said, his inexperience would worry me, and he's made some questionable decisions in game and with his line-up from time to time (as have most coaches, so I guess that's neither here nor there)

 

[Howard Chuck]

I've sat behind the Colts bench at many games - Hawerchuk is VERY vocal and animated. Definitely not Mr. Nice Guy behind the bench.

That said, his inexperience would worry me, and he's made some questionable decisions in game and with his line-up from time to time (as have most coaches, so I guess that's neither here nor there)

Thanks for the first hand info! I'm completely split on something like this. I love Ducky, but have no idea how he would perform as an NHL coach.

 

[Huffer]

Well, then ...I'm sure you'd agree that our forecheck was better, no? Do you think it had anything to do with the switch from a 2-1-2 strongside attack to the 2-3 / weak side lock? How about that new flip play that they tried a few times, to use our speed and gain possession and/or hem the opposition in their end. The transition game in the NZ was much better, having the center swoop across to the weak side winger, and the puck support in the D zone was improved by approximately 100%.

BUT NOPE! No credit for your Claudey boy! Any player-coach / chimp would've made those adjustments. He's a weak leader and poor motivator and his team has obviously quit on him.

I asked a question in a thread about our 1-2-2 and how other teams use it. At the games live, I don't think I had ever seen a team with their two forwards standing still in the neutral zone like ours were.

If changing to a 2-3 weak side lock was what happened in the last game, I would welcome that. It seems to play better with the talent on this team.

I did like the fact that they flipped the puck a few times and put it into open spaces for guys like Kane and Wheeler to retrieve.

I'll have to take your word on the NZ move by the centres as I didn't watch for that (were you watching for that, or did it just jump out at you?), but I did notice some better support in our own zone.

 

[Analyst365]

Regarding firing the coach, Am I the only one who'd like to see a major trade first, to shake this team to the core and get things going?

Personally, I am not in love with this core, or the lineup in general. Gaining the line and firing 40 ft. wrist shots at the net is not beast mode. Showing up 1/4 of the time is not beast mode.

I know 'major trade' is ambiguous, but so is firing the coach.