Prospect Info: The 2023-2024 Prospects Thread Pt. 3

[Tables of Stats]

Bains looks overwhelmed out there and getting called up when the Canucks weren't in top form might just be plain bad luck.

I just don't see him as having any sort of NHL career.

I think Bains looks less overwhelmed and more just a little physically overmatched. It's fair to question how much extra strength and explosiveness he'll be able to add this offseason but I think with his skills and smarts he won't need much to be a NHL level player. I'm 60/40 that he's good enough for a regular NHL spot next season.

 

[wetcoast]

I think Bains looks less overwhelmed and more just a little physically overmatched. It's fair to question how much extra strength and explosiveness he'll be able to add this offseason but I think with his skills and smarts he won't need much to be a NHL level player. I'm 60/40 that he's good enough for a regular NHL spot next season.

the thing is that he is 22 not a guy still growing so I dunno so hard to say and it's the same problem with Raty.

At this stage of their careers one would like to see more progress, although Raty just seems older than he really is.

 

[Tables of Stats]

the thing is that he is 22 not a guy still growing so I dunno so hard to say and it's the same problem with Raty.

At this stage of their careers one would like to see more progress, although Raty just seems older than he really is.

Generally peak strength is reached around 25 so he should naturally get stronger and more explosive with age. Given that Bains has demonstrated that he has a good motor and good hockey IQ it seems as if he could easily put it all together next season. If he doesn't he's already shown himself to be a plus level AHL asset and is valuable in that role regardless.

 

[RobertKron]

the thing is that he is 22 not a guy still growing so I dunno so hard to say and it's the same problem with Raty.

At this stage of their careers one would like to see more progress, although Raty just seems older than he really is.

Bains is a non-blue chip second year pro getting his first taste of the NHL; it'd be surprising if he just walked in an didn't look at all out of place. Now he'll have a benchmark for what he needs to work toward.

Obviously pretty much everyone fails to make it, but a guy who has progressed as quickly as he has in the AHL and lacks any specific really glaring deficiencies is a decent bet to find himself in and around the NHL for at least a couple years.

 

[wetcoast]

Bains is a non-blue chip second year pro getting his first taste of the NHL; it'd be surprising if he just walked in an didn't look at all out of place. Now he'll have a benchmark for what he needs to work toward.

Obviously pretty much everyone fails to make it, but a guy who has progressed as quickly as he has in the AHL and lacks any specific really glaring deficiencies is a decent bet to find himself in and around the NHL for at least a couple years.

Don't get me wrong I hope he does make it and I've been critical of the Canucks drafting for years about not drafting centers, EP40 aside.

Rule needs to changed. Think it works against Canadian teams as most college players remain American and Canadian taxes higher.

Truscott is looking at a lot more development time no matter where he goes IMO.

Tax rates are different too but what rule is going to going to be put in place?

Sometimes solutions are worse than the perceived problem.

Teams like Edmonton and Winnipeg have worse problems with FA and western teams compared to eastern ones in terms of travel.

 

[Wry n Ginger]

I think you could also include Podkolzin and Tolopilo to this list. They've both improved significantly playing in Abby this season.

Agreed, add Sasson from what I read/hear as well.

Bains looks overwhelmed out there and getting called up when the Canucks weren't in top form might just be plain bad luck.

I just don't see him as having any sort of NHL career.

That has been Bains modus operandi at every level and every league he has played in.

 

[wetcoast]

Agreed, add Sasson from what I read/hear as well.


That has been Bains modus operandi at every level and every league he has played in.

Sure I agree with that but that last jump is the huge one that most players don't make.

Like I said I hope he is the exception but given his age and skillset ect... I don't see it.

All that being said I hope they resign Lindholm as the centers in the system aren't very exciting and we traded away our first rounder.

 

[David Bruce Banner]

It will indeed, however, being physical playing teenagers is LOT different than when playing against men.

He plays the same way against men in the Swedish League, from all reports

 

[krutovsdonut]

i thought bains was painfully unready but i did like the confidence he showed and i liked that he did show a willingness to just play his game in the nhl and try to make it work. the way they were trying to spoonfeed him on the pp was borderline bizarre.

 

[Tables of Stats]

Sure I agree with that but that last jump is the huge one that msot players don't make.

Like I said I hope he is the exception but given his age and skillset ect... I don't see it.

All that being said I hope they resign Lindholm as the centers in the system aren't very exciting and we traded away our first rounder.

What specifically are you scouting that suggests he won't make it? Please be specific, because anybody can say "Just a gut feeling" and be right about prospects busting more often than they're wrong.

 

[andora]

22yrs old matters far less for a player like bains than it does say.. a scorer

All around guys with work ethic can be later

 

[Blue and Green]

Bains is 23.

 

[wetcoast]

What specifically are you scouting that suggests he won't make it? Please be specific, because anybody can say "Just a gut feeling" and be right about prospects busting more often than they're wrong.

There is nothing specific and honestly I don't go to every game or watch every game either but it comes down to a % play.

He is 22 years old and basically in what should be 3 years removed from junior but he played as an overager and obviously became a prospect that year.

He is a January birthday so it's not like he was young for his draft year but some guys develop past that I get it but.

his skating is his biggest issue especially the first couple of steps, his IQ and passing ability are good enough to get past his skating in the AHL but like I said the NHL is a huge step and most guys don't make it.

It's also a numbers game and he is a winger.

Skipping handedness he is behind Podkolzin and Lekkerimaki as a prospect at wing in the Canucks system.

The only 2 wingers that come off the books next year is Lafferty and Joshua who are both better players and likely will be retained by if one or both of them aren't resigned and Bains makes gains on his first step, which could happen but once again at his age it's very unlikely, he could get a longer look.

But there are alot of "ifs" and moving parts here and more players will be drafted and or acquired and that's my basis.

Heck I'm not even sure how Podkolzin gets a shot next year, maybe Lafferty isn't resigned.

In a nutshell he isn't that great of a skater, not very big or strong and getting old as a prospect and the % games says that he probably won't make it.

But I'll put it another way if he was a prospect on another team and we were trading for him would anyone get excited?

Like I said I hope he is the exception but the odds are against it.

 

[MarkusNaslund19]

What specifically are you scouting that suggests he won't make it? Please be specific, because anybody can say "Just a gut feeling" and be right about prospects busting more often than they're wrong.

I disagree with the guy you're quoting. I see smarts and hockey sense that will lead to a good middle six winger whom you can plug and play with anyone.

 

[krutovsdonut]

There is nothing specific and honestly I don't go to every game or watch every game either but it comes down to a % play.

He is 22 years old and basically in what should be 3 years removed from junior but he played as an overager and obviously became a prospect that year.

He is a January birthday so it's not like he was young for his draft year but some guys develop past that I get it but.

his skating is his biggest issue especially the first couple of steps, his IQ and passing ability are good enough to get past his skating in the AHL but like I said the NHL is a huge step and most guys don't make it.

It's also a numbers game and he is a winger.

Skipping handedness he is behind Podkolzin and Lekkerimaki as a prospect at wing in the Canucks system.

The only 2 wingers that come off the books next year is Lafferty and Joshua who are both better players and likely will be retained by if one or both of them aren't resigned and Bains makes gains on his first step, which could happen but once again at his age it's very unlikely, he could get a longer look.

But there are alot of "ifs" and moving parts here and more players will be drafted and or acquired and that's my basis.

Heck I'm not even sure how Podkolzin gets a shot next year, maybe Lafferty isn't resigned.

In a nutshell he isn't that great of a skater, not very big or strong and getting old as a prospect and the % games says that he probably won't make it.

But I'll put it another way if he was a prospect on another team and we were trading for him would anyone get excited?

Like I said I hope he is the exception but the odds are against it.

to the eye test he looks completely out of step physically and mentally with an nhl roster. like an imposter. maybe he's that kind of player who runs against the grain, but if he is a normal player then he needs to get stronger and more polished and decisive to play in the nhl.

 

[drax0s]

...the way they were trying to spoonfeed him on the pp was borderline bizarre.

I wonder if they were actually trying to showcase him and boost his value? There's still lots of talk that we are in on some of the big names at the deadline that would cost some combination of picks and prospects so maybe they're trying to boost his value.

It'd suck for fans for him to get moved since he's a local kid and a good story but if it helps us get Guentzel or something and keep Lekk / Willander...

 

[Hodgy]

to the eye test he looks completely out of step physically and mentally with an nhl roster. like an imposter. maybe he's that kind of player who runs against the grain, but if he is a normal player then he needs to get stronger and more polished and decisive to play in the nhl.

I'm kind of shocked someone could watch Bains and come to the conclusion that mentally he is completely out of step.

I think the only fair criticism of Bains is that he's a bit slow out there, but otherwise, I think his puck skills, positioning, passing and general reads have been pretty good.

 

[Aqualung]

I'm kind of shocked someone could watch Bains and come to the conclusion that mentally he is completely out of step.

I think the only fair criticism of Bains is that he's a bit slow out there, but otherwise, I think his puck skills, positioning, passing and general reads have been pretty good.

Agreed. Any rookie is going to be overmatched physically, but he’s showing good NHL qualities in other areas which is what you want to see. One or two good off-seasons of strength training is the right prescription for him.

 

[LemonSauceD]

Bains is a mentally strong player. You don’t go from WHL overager fodder scoring up against kids to where he’s at right now without sheer determination and willingness to improve. I honestly can’t remember a player who’s come into the league for us and been as poised as him. Maybe Quinn Hughes.

Not suggesting he’s going to be this star player but I’ve been impressed with how he’s carried himself. He seems like a real motivated kid and I expect him to be a regular next year. Clearly Tocchet loves the guy and sees immense potential.

For now, once were a bit more healthy, he should be sent down and play the rest of the season in Abby and help them secure a playoff spot.

 

[VanJack]

Bains is a mentally strong player. You don’t go from WHL overager fodder scoring up against kids to where he’s at right now without sheer determination and willingness to improve. I honestly can’t remember a player who’s come into the league for us and been as poised as him. Maybe Quinn Hughes.

Not suggesting he’s going to be this star player but I’ve been impressed with how he’s carried himself. He seems like a real motivated kid and I expect him to be a regular next year. Clearly Tocchet loves the guy and sees immense potential.

For now, once were a bit more healthy, he should be sent down and play the rest of the season in Abby and help them secure a playoff spot.

Agreed. If Bains doesn't make it, it won't because he isn't determined enough or doesn't work hard enough.

Apparently he's rink rat they have to chase off the ice surface after every practice. He's basically willed himself into winning a scoring title in WHL and to becoming an AHL all-star. Now he's trying to get to the top of mountain.

And like Alex Burrows before him--who simply didn't know the meaning of word 'quit'.....I have a feeling Bains will eventually get to the promised land.

 

[sting101]

i think he's very much a NHL player in his future but he's in a tough spot right now. He is struggling with where to be and when and where to send pucks when he doesn't have a play. Also needs to shoot the damn puck and be assertive. That open net to end up behind with no shot was embarrassing.

Yes first steps could use some improvement but he's close just needs to have familiarity with his linemates as he's more of a playmaker

 

[VanJack]

I think a lot of posters underestimate how hard it is to come up from the AHL and make an immediate impact as the NHL season reaches the home stretch.

Undoubtedly Bains is finding how much faster the players are and how quickly the decisions that need to be made with the puck. But he'll return to Abbotsford much wiser and better prepared for the future.

These games are critical as a learning tool. And my guess is he'll apply what he's learned to the rest of the AHL season. He'll definitely be a guy to watch in training camp next season.

 

[IComeInPeace]

Just before he was called up Tochett was interviewed (regarding Woo at the time) and said something to the effect of “they called him (Woo) up to get him used to the pace of the game and how much faster it is and that they’d also like to do the same with Bains because he deserves it too.”

Bains went from getting rewarded with a call up just to expose him to NHL speed, to actually getting a handful of games in.

I’m not sure it would be wise to expect a whole lot more than what we’ve seen from him at this point.
There was some good but also a lot of things that need to be worked on.

But, while he’s 23 YO he has now shown very significant improvements in his game 3 seasons in a row.

I don’t know if “he wasn’t good enough to show me he was ready for a full time NHL role” is the best way to assess a guy who’s only been a pro for such a short time.

I would say that by this point next season it’s reasonable to expect significantly more from him though.

 

[tradervik]

I think we have some evidence that Bains might be one of those outliers who develop later than usual. I'm not giving up on him just yet.

 

[Blue and Green]

Undoubtedly Bains is finding how much faster the players are and how quickly the decisions that need to be made with the puck. But he'll return to Abbotsford much wiser and better prepared for the future.

I don't think that the problem lies with Bains' decision-making abilities. I think he is already smart enough for the NHL. The problem is that he doesn't have enough NHL-level skills. Acceleration, agility, balance, deceptiveness of puckhandling, shot velocity, strength... none of these are good enough. Unless he has an immediately viable passing opportunity he's a sitting duck when NHL players close in on him, which they can do quite easily.