Prospect Info: The 2020 Entry NHL Draft Thread: Part II

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Brisson is also from Manhattan Beach, California.... Perhaps our early contender to replace Long Beach Native Matt Nieto?

 

[John Mandalorian]

I’d be happy with Barron assuming he’s ok medically. Quite honestly he’d go a lot higher if not for the lost time and blood clots, but at 25, I’d think he’s worth the risk. For some reason I had been under the impression that he missed time from a concussion. Hopefully whatever problem he has isn’t as problematic.

 

[John Mandalorian]

If Amirov and Reichel are off the board, Brisson is who I want. He's a smart player with a lot of skill. If Button is right that Brisson will continue on a steep developmental upswing, he'd be a great pick.

He’s on a stacked team and half of his goals are from the power play. The average skating is also a big concern.

 

[John Mandalorian]

I don't know who Yanic St Pierre is and I'm not about to watch a 20 min video on Brisson but there are plenty of people who speak highly of him. Button, Pronman, and the people at Hockey Prospect to name a few. The latter two have Brisson in their top 15.

His dad is a big time agent. It doesn’t occur to you that there could be something transactional behind it?

 

[Papa Francouz]

He’s on a stacked team and half of his goals are from the power play. The average skating is also a big concern.

You're not going to get a perfect prospect at 25th overall. He's going to a good college program and his skills, including his skating, will continue to develop. He's a longer-term guy, but one that could pay dividends quite handsomely if/when he's ready for the NHL.

 

[John Mandalorian]

I don't know who Yanic St Pierre is and I'm not about to watch a 20 min video on Brisson but there are plenty of people who speak highly of him. Button, Pronman, and the people at Hockey Prospect to name a few. The latter two have Brisson in their top 15.

Right. Blurbs are easier. He watches 10 games of each player and provides video examples of his observations.

His evaluation of Grans is totally different than Buttons.

 

[henchman21]

On Brisson:

Prospect Info: - The 2020 Entry NHL Draft Thread: Part II

 

[John Mandalorian]

You're not going to get a perfect prospect at 25th overall. He's going to a good college program and his skills, including his skating, will continue to develop. He's a longer-term guy, but one that could pay dividends quite handsomely if/when he's ready for the NHL.

Right but poor skating, on the Avs especially, can be problematic. Look at Jost and Jost was supposed to be a good skater prior to his draft. If you watch that video, he makes the point that Brisson’s skating is likely a finished product because he most likely has already worked with skate coaches.

 

[Avsboy]

Dater's site seems to think that most of the Avs picks will be forwards, and has Roni Hirvanen at 25.

 

[Papa Francouz]

Right but poor skating, on the Avs especially, can be problematic. Look at Jost and Jost was supposed to be a good skater prior to his draft. If you watch that video, he makes the point that Brisson’s skating is likely a finished product because he most likely has already worked with skate coaches.

You're not wrong, but the system the Avs run can cover up for poor skating. Kadri isn't a great skater, Graves can be wobbly at times. Having MacKinnon and Makar mask a lot of the skating deficiencies of other players. EJ is good "for his size." With Brisson, he only needs to be good enough to fit in with the current identity of the Avs.

With regards to Jost, like a lot of people have said his skating doesn't work at center. He's fine on the wing, but doesn't play on the wing all that often because the Avs have better wingers than him. If Brisson is meant to become a center, then he'll need to continue working on his skating, sure, but every player should be doing that anyway, in my opinion.

 

[S E P H]

Please NO!

Why Gabe? Brisson is a fantastic player and someone I believe in much more than Jarvis. Brisson has strong skating, fantastic IQ, can stickhandle close around the net, and is a brilliant goalscorer. People will say he had consistency issues, but he had one of the second best half of the years compared to any prospect for this draft. My only negative on him is that he had many points on the powerplay and junior PP points don't really translate to the pros. However, he has all the makings of being a very solid second liner and suggest that his hockey IQ and ability to carry the puck on the rush will put him as an excellent eventual replacement for Kadri.

Pronman has him ranked 15th and Button threw out a PLD comparison:

He most definitely NOT ever be like or play like PLD. That's a really bad comparison, Brisson plays more like Zetterberg, but is more of a goalscorer or William Karlsson.

 

[S E P H]

I’d be happy with Barron assuming he’s ok medically. Quite honestly he’d go a lot higher if not for the lost time and blood clots, but at 25, I’d think he’s worth the risk. For some reason I had been under the impression that he missed time from a concussion. Hopefully whatever problem he has isn’t as problematic.

Barron is a good player, but I suggest him falling is also due to him not having a lot of talent either. I don't think I would like his selection, but not because he's terrible, but because other players have just outplayed him. He'd be more along the lines of drafting someone like Guhle or Schneider - high floor but not high ceiling players. He has great puck-rushing ability, but I don't really see a lot of IQ in terms of being able to make plays out of nothing like Makar nor very good puck distribution skills like Seth Jones. He looks very similar to Brendan Guhle for me, extremely good skater who does a lot of good, but has zero finish product.

 

[Balthazar]

Re: Brisson

I hate when I read complete opposite reports on the same player.

Some say he's undersized and has below average skating (which gives me Jost PTSD)...THW, however, says he has good acceleration and speed and uses his speed to backcheck and help the D.

Same thing happened last year with Newhook...some people said skating was his strength, others said that his poor skating was holding him back.

PS: @tigervixxxen is Brisson on your "nepotism" list? His dad and Joe are good friends aren't they?

 

[John Mandalorian]

You're not wrong, but the system the Avs run can cover up for poor skating. Kadri isn't a great skater, Graves can be wobbly at times. Having MacKinnon and Makar mask a lot of the skating deficiencies of other players. EJ is good "for his size." With Brisson, he only needs to be good enough to fit in with the current identity of the Avs.

With regards to Jost, like a lot of people have said his skating doesn't work at center. He's fine on the wing, but doesn't play on the wing all that often because the Avs have better wingers than him. If Brisson is meant to become a center, then he'll need to continue working on his skating, sure, but every player should be doing that anyway, in my opinion.

Jost is routinely devoured by the speed of the game regardless of playing at W or C.

Also, it’s been established by sound reasoning that Brisson’s skating might be as good (or close to it) as it’s going to get.

 

[Papa Francouz]

Jost is routinely devoured by the speed of the game regardless of playing at W or C.

Also, it’s been established by sound reasoning that Brisson’s skating might be as good (or close to it) as it’s going to get.

Agree to disagree. From the clips I've seen of Brisson his skating doesn't look noticeably worse than most kids his age. It's not like we're looking at a Timmins here. He doesn't appear to have breakaway speed, but he gets around the ice fine. If they draft him as a winger, I think he'll be perfectly capable of a middle-6 role at some point in his career.

And that's without mentioning the mixed reports on his skating. I'm not sure which resource to trust on this, but from what I've seen myself he doesn't appear to be at a detriment due to his current skating ability. The guys on this board that watch a hell of a lot more of prospects than I do are saying he'd be a good pick at 25, and that there is room for improvement in his skating. I trust them in their analysis because they've been right on a lot of guys before.

 

[John Mandalorian]

Barron is a good player, but I suggest him falling is also due to him not having a lot of talent either. I don't think I would like his selection, but not because he's terrible, but because other players have just outplayed him. He'd be more along the lines of drafting someone like Guhle or Schneider - high floor but not high ceiling players. He has great puck-rushing ability, but I don't really see a lot of IQ in terms of being able to make plays out of nothing like Makar nor very good puck distribution skills like Seth Jones. He looks very similar to Brendan Guhle for me, extremely good skater who does a lot of good, but has zero finish product.

Quite honestly, if we had a defensive group that consisted of six Makars, we wouldn’t be able to afford them. And honestly, we need to have some diversification in the defensive pairings. Consequently, I’d be thrilled with Schneider, Guhle, or Barron.

I’ve seen limited video of Barron. Unfortunately highlight videos show predominantly scoring plays. But the guy has a huge shot and scored several goals from the blue line. I’ve also seen that he’s a great skater. But in terms of the defensive end, I have to rely on written analysis and/or quotes. According to what I was able to read, he’s quite good defensively and uses his size/physicality. How is a RD with the defense, skating, and shot not what the Avs need?

 

[Avs_19]

Re: Brisson

I hate when I read complete opposite reports on the same player.

Some say he's undersized and has below average skating (which gives me Jost PTSD)...THW, however, says he has good acceleration and speed and uses his speed to backcheck and help the D.

Same thing happened last year with Newhook...some people said skating was his strength, others said that his poor skating was holding him back.

PS: @tigervixxxen is Brisson on your "nepotism" list? His dad and Joe are good friends aren't they?

@ him. It's @henchman24. He's the one.

 

[S E P H]

Consequently, I’d be thrilled with Schneider, Guhle, or Barron.

My entire post is that there are better defenders available, now I am still watching games but one of the last ones I've seen is Grans and I would easily draft him over those three. Superior offensive alien weaponry to the triad you listed above.

How is a RD with the defense, skating, and shot not what the Avs need?

It depends on where you draft who and why, again Barron is a solid prospect but as of now he's more of a second rounder that you'd hope rebounds to his hyped potential of one/two years ago. Him getting injured is unfortunate, but before that he dropped like a lead balloon in the rankings is because Halifax was bad and he wasn't necessarily good either. I think there's a legit question that he was a product of Mooseheads beast team, which could've exacerbated his talent level like Stefan Elliott did to Duncan Siemens. Now, for me personally, you don't draft defenders like Siemens, Guhle, and Fleury as high as teams did and there is a good chance the triad will be the next line of defenders who might not necessarily be busts per se, but ones who got drafted higher than their talent says. You draft either pure offensive defenders or all-around worldly defenders high because their talent level dictates that appropriation. You don't draft defenders just because of defence and skating high because that's what we did with Siemens.

 

[henchman21]

@ him. It's @henchman24. He's the one.

People will see what I mean when he enters the NHL... but context is important, skating as it applies to a center and playing both ends of the ice well. Smaller centers need to have a certain level of skating to translate to the NHL at a high level there. Moving to wing mitigates those skating issues, also throwing caution to the wind on one side of the ice. Newhook has NHL level skating at wing for sure, I remain cautious at center.

The concern on Brisson's skating translating at center is a real risk and he needs to improve that area of his game to keep being a center in the NHL. I have no qualms about it holding him back from the NHL.

 

[John Mandalorian]

My entire post is that there are better defenders available, now I am still watching games but one of the last ones I've seen is Grans and I would easily draft him over those three. Superior offensive alien weaponry to the triad you listed above.
It depends on where you draft who and why, again Barron is a solid prospect but as of now he's more of a second rounder that you'd hope rebounds to his hyped potential of one/two years ago. Him getting injured is unfortunate, but before that he dropped like a lead balloon in the rankings is because Halifax was bad and he wasn't necessarily good either. I think there's a legit question that he was a product of Mooseheads beast team, which could've exacerbated his talent level like Stefan Elliott did to Duncan Siemens. Now, for me personally, you don't draft defenders like Siemens, Guhle, and Fleury as high as teams did and there is a good chance the triad will be the next line of defenders who might not necessarily be busts per se, but ones who got drafted higher than their talent says. You draft either pure offensive defenders or all-around worldly defenders high because their talent level dictates that appropriation. You don't draft defenders just because of defence and skating high because that's what we did with Siemens.

When you say “better” it seems like you’re talking about PMDs. I feel like the stay at home defensemen is the hedge to all these PMDs. I feel like if you don’t have quality at the former, you make yourself vulnerable. So it’s good to have complementary skills.

I saw the DD player evaluation on Grans. I almost got sucked in because it started off doting on his first pass. But then it went onto go into great depth about how he repeatedly uses poor judgment and is careless. Grans has tools but I’m not convinced he can be taught to use good judgment. It’s a huge red flag for me. Poor judgment, bad skating, and concussions are big red flags for me.

 

[S E P H]

People will see what I mean when he enters the NHL... but context is important, skating as it applies to a center and playing both ends of the ice well. Smaller centers need to have a certain level of skating to translate to the NHL at a high level there. Moving to wing mitigates those skating issues, also throwing caution to the wind on one side of the ice. Newhook has NHL level skating at wing for sure, I remain cautious at center.

The concern on Brisson's skating translating at center is a real risk and he needs to improve that area of his game to keep being a center in the NHL. I have no qualms about it holding him back from the NHL.

I suggest his hockey IQ will be more important to potentially making it as a centre compared to his skating. Point is a good example of someone who doesn't really have amazing skating but his smarts allows him to survive in the middle of the ice.

 

[The Abusement Park]

I suggest his hockey IQ will be more important to potentially making it as a centre compared to his skating. Point is a good example of someone who doesn't really have amazing skating but his smarts allows him to survive in the middle of the ice.

I mean his IQ is high but he's also one of the best skaters in the league currently.

 

[S E P H]

I saw the DD player evaluation on Grans. I almost got sucked in because it started off doting on his first pass. But then it went onto go into great depth about how he repeatedly uses poor judgment and is careless. Grans has tools but I’m not convinced he can be taught to use good judgment. It’s a huge red flag for me. Poor judgment, bad skating, and concussions are big red flags for me.

And he's well worth the risk compared to the three lads IMHO. For the record, my interpretation of him is when he has the puck he's a very good, has good decisions, and can quarterback the powerplay quite effectively. It's when he doesn't have the puck he tends to drift away and skate from where he's supposed to be - those issues you can fix though with constant coaching/reminders. I don't see bad skating within his game either, but I admit it's bit hard to evaluate when you have more room on international size.

I mean his IQ is high but he's also one of the best skaters in the league currently.

Who, Point? Compared to the best skaters in all positions I don't think he cracks the top 10 or 15 for me.

 

[Gigantor The Goalie]

He has drafting Commesso in 3rd round, Rempe in the 4th round, and Usau in the 5th.

We pick the 2nd best goalie 4th, I like it. The Barron pick is weird considering the altitude is not kind to medical issues like his. I don't see the Avs making the Barron pick. I haven't seen those other names brought up by people in here so no comment. He has us taking Aidan Campbell in the 7th round which is just...light the pick on fire territory as far as I'm concerned.

 

[henchman21]

I suggest his hockey IQ will be more important to potentially making it as a centre compared to his skating. Point is a good example of someone who doesn't really have amazing skating but his smarts allows him to survive in the middle of the ice.

Point is an elite skater. I'd easily put him in the top 10. Amazing burst, edges, and quick feet. He has incredible skating to create separation. I don't think this matters as much, but he can also flat out fly at full tilt. He's arguably the fastest skater in the NHL.

I certainly think IQ matters at center, but if you can't skate 200' well consistently and don't have size to lean on players, you can't play center. That's why we don't see many good 2 way under 6' centers. Some exist, but they are an exception and not the rule.