The 2019-20 Around the League Thread

[4Twenty]

Sometimes your best laid long term plans get thrown out the window. Jets with Trouba, when they didn't sign him for term off his ELC pretty much spelled the end of his time there. A year after reaching the WCF, they trade him. Compounding that is Buff comtemplating retirement. Myers and Chairot left as UFA. Now, they potentially are wasting one of the final best years of Wheeler, a steal of a contract that Scheiffle is on, Laine on a low cost bridge deal. Have to wait for their D to mature while the forwards in their prime get older.

You can't be either too impatient and rush things, but you also can't be waiting for everything to fall into place, because it rarely happens that way either.

So don't plan for the longterm?

I don't really see a problem with what Winnipeg has done. Hard to predict Byfuglien wouldn't show up to camp. I think it made perfect sense for them to let their UFA dmen walk versus long term commitments to them.

I think the Canucks will struggle to even reach the heights that Winnipeg group did because of a lack of flexibility and a lot of bad money committed long term and not just that either, they had a better base to start with and they knocked every first rounder they had from 2011 to 2016 out of the park: Scheifele, Trouba, Morrisey, Ehlers, Connor, Laine. That's 6 players, the Canucks have 4.

Sure I’d rather add elite talent. But how? Did Taveres want to sign here but the Canucks turned him down? Panarin was never coming here with a city like NY in the running and I’m glad we didn’t sign that contract in any event. EK? See Panarin.

As for them reaching heights...that is going to come down to how good Petey, Brock, Hughes, and Horvat are as well as how well our prospects turn out.

Trade? Cap space is an asset, Carolina got a 1st rounder for using it. I'd prefer the flexibility than spending it frivolously as they have (the players ernie mentioned).

Your last sentence sure puts a lot of pressure on 4 players. I don't think 4 players is enough. Neither does Benning, which is why he went out and spent 1st round picks and big time $$ and term. Since streethawk brought up the Jets, just look how short their window ended up being and they've got a lot more than 4 players.

 

[Orr4Norris]

Trade? Cap space is an asset, Carolina got a 1st rounder for using it. I'd prefer the flexibility than spending it frivolously as they have (the players ernie mentioned).

Your last sentence sure puts a lot of pressure on 4 players. I don't think 4 players is enough. Neither does Benning, which is why he went out and spent 1st round picks and big time $$ and term. Since streethawk brought up the Jets, just look how short their window ended up being and they've got a lot more than 4 players.

Well you said you’d rather spend the space on elite talent which is what I was responding to. A mid-late 1st is not what I thought you meant?

And if Petey and Hughes end up being 11+ mil players and Horvat and Brock get big raises... then yeah, the pressure will be on them to carry the team. And our prospects will have to replace the more expensive players like Sutter/Pearson/Tanev/Marky etc. Which is why I said in my second part that we’ll have to hope guys like Hoglander/Podkolzin/Tryamkin/Demko/Juolevi work out. But for now, we don’t have to worry about that as they aren’t 11+ mil yet.

Finally, it’s a pretty big assumption that this way of thinking is ‘short term’. Grab elite talent when you’re at the bottom. Surround them with solid vets while they are cheap. Draft well. Always. Say goodbye to vets one by one and replace with prospects as they become more expensive. Not really short term.

 

[StreetHawk]

So don't plan for the longterm?

I don't really see a problem with what Winnipeg has done. Hard to predict Byfuglien wouldn't show up to camp. I think it made perfect sense for them to let their UFA dmen walk versus long term commitments to them.

I think the Canucks will struggle to even reach the heights that Winnipeg group did because of a lack of flexibility and a lot of bad money committed long term and not just that either, they had a better base to start with and they knocked every first rounder they had from 2011 to 2016 out of the park: Scheifele, Trouba, Morrisey, Ehlers, Connor, Laine. That's 6 players, the Canucks have 4.
.

You plan as best you can. But, you will have to adjust on the fly if something drastically changes. Everything seemed lined up for the Jets to contend these next couple of years, but a couple of things went sideways on them.

Jets forward group is ready to contend now (age and cap wise), but their D without Buff isn't anymore. There's not much they can do about that now. Buff left them hanging too late to make a big move.

Jets would have expected to be able to keep Trouba, but he wanted to go back to the US so his GF could complete her medical degree/work experience. Not much you can do about that except get the best return you can for him. But, realistically, they had a sense he wouldn't come back once they went to arbitration last year and he was a year from UFA.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

Oilers with a commanding 4-1 lead in the the 2nd period.

 

[Hoghandler]

I have a very strong feeling this post won’t age well at all

It's certainly possible, and obviously a hot take. I proposed the same question about the Jets this past summer and it probably seemed a little absurd too. Looking at both teams today, I would still have to think long and hard about swapping spots with the Jets.

In terms of raw talent, the Leafs are clearly ahead of the Canucks. There are just a lot of question marks I think will be difficult for them to overcome. They come across as a bunch of individuals that don't play for one another, not a fan of how the back-end is constructed and it looks like a team that will once again be pushed around when the intensity ramps up come playoff time. They also didn't handle the contracts of their core group very well at all IMO. Not to mention how the contract status of the defense could really sink their chances at competing beyond this season.

Since the start of 2019, spanning 60 odd games, the Leafs are essentially a .500 hockey team. That's what the Canucks were last season with a rookie 1st line centre, a horrific blueline, while being one of the most injured teams in hockey.

The comparison may seem a little absurd today, maybe not so in a few months.

 

[Billy Kvcmu]

So don't plan for the longterm?

I don't really see a problem with what Winnipeg has done. Hard to predict Byfuglien wouldn't show up to camp. I think it made perfect sense for them to let their UFA dmen walk versus long term commitments to them.

I think the Canucks will struggle to even reach the heights that Winnipeg group did because of a lack of flexibility and a lot of bad money committed long term and not just that either, they had a better base to start with and they knocked every first rounder they had from 2011 to 2016 out of the park: Scheifele, Trouba, Morrisey, Ehlers, Connor, Laine. That's 6 players, the Canucks have 4.




Trade? Cap space is an asset, Carolina got a 1st rounder for using it. I'd prefer the flexibility than spending it frivolously as they have (the players ernie mentioned).

Your last sentence sure puts a lot of pressure on 4 players. I don't think 4 players is enough. Neither does Benning, which is why he went out and spent 1st round picks and big time $$ and term. Since streethawk brought up the Jets, just look how short their window ended up being and they've got a lot more than 4 players.

What height? Lost in the WCF once and multiple first round exit?
They lost two of their RHD excluding Byfuglien and their best plan was Nick Pionk+an 18 years old rookie. That is not what I call planning

 

[Fire Benning]

Draisaitl on pace for another 22+ minute game and has 3 points. 12 goals in 14 games, heckuva player.

 

[Billy Kvcmu]

Draisaitl on pace for another 22+ minute game and has 3 points. 12 goals in 14 games, heckuva player.

Second best player in under the age of 30

 

[Billy Kvcmu]

Devils lead 5-3 against Tampa in the third
Conceded 3 straight goals and trailed 6-5
Tied the game with 8 secs left, and then lost in OT.

Tank nation worst nightmare.

I want to give myself some credit for being one of the only few ppl on here who predicted the Devils will suck again because of goaltending

 

[WetcoastOrca]

Boy! I really liked Corey Schneider when he was here but he looks awful. 7 goals on 23 shots.
That trade looks like one of the teams best in a long time!

 

[MikeK]

Boy! I really liked Corey Schneider when he was here but he looks awful. 7 goals on 23 shots.
That trade looks like one of the teams best in a long time!

Was just coming here to post something similar. His first 4 seasons in NJ he established himself as a top #1 goalie in the NHL. Now he looks just about done as one. Injuries sure have taken away his movement. It happens to all players. I don't see him in the league 2 years from now.

 

[wetcoast]

I'm hoping at some stage here Edler gets the credit he's been due for a decade plus. Like he's still an absolute horse at 33....compare him to a guy who's been his contemporary for a decade plus (Seabrook) and it should show just how incredible the level he can still play at is. It's definitely taken for granted the level of play this organization has got out of this guy.

Edler looked on the verge of an elite breakout in 10-11 then has been a very steady #1 Dman sort of like a slightly lesser version than Ryan Suter.

This year looks like it could be his signature season and frankly he deserves it.

 

[Billy Kvcmu]

11 blown lead in 10 games
But they haven’t blown a 5-1 lead

 

[deckercky]

Don't look now, but the Canucks lead the league in goal differential!

 

[a Fool]

Was just coming here to post something similar. His first 4 seasons in NJ he established himself as a top #1 goalie in the NHL. Now he looks just about done as one. Injuries sure have taken away his movement. It happens to all players. I don't see him in the league 2 years from now.

Almost always a bad choice to trade #1 picks for players in their prime when you are not a contending team. You're giving up too much potential for a small window of value.

 

[MS]

Almost always a bad choice to trade #1 picks for players in their prime when you are not a contending team. You're giving up too much potential for a small window of value.

The kicker in the Schneider deal for NJ was that they got the player evaluation exactly correct, they just got the evaluation of their team and where their team was at horribly wrong.

Schneider basically gave them Vezina-calibre goaltending his first 3 years in NJ before his hips gave out ... but the team around him was so bad that all it did was ruined their high draft pick.

 

[4Twenty]

Edler looked on the verge of an elite breakout in 10-11 then has been a very steady #1 Dman sort of like a slightly lesser version than Ryan Suter.

This year looks like it could be his signature season and frankly he deserves it.

He was a darkhorse for the Norris IIRC in 2011-12. He was unreal that season until about January when Marchand submarined his partner, Sami Salo. He was on pace for 60 points January 1st, but faded down the stretch, which was impacted by another cheap shot against a Canucks: Keith elbow on Daniel.

 

[MS]

He was a darkhorse for the Norris IIRC in 2011-12. He was unreal that season until about January when Marchand submarined his partner, Sami Salo. He was on pace for 60 points January 1st, but faded down the stretch, which was impacted by another cheap shot against a Canucks: Keith elbow on Daniel.

That was his best offensive season but he was playing soft 2nd pairing minutes with huge o-zone starts and getting scored on a lot, given how good the team around him was.

 

[Billy Kvcmu]

Heinola assigned to the AHL
That Jets D core....

 

[StreetHawk]

Was just coming here to post something similar. His first 4 seasons in NJ he established himself as a top #1 goalie in the NHL. Now he looks just about done as one. Injuries sure have taken away his movement. It happens to all players. I don't see him in the league 2 years from now.

Schneider has straight salary of $6 million. So, it's a $2 million cap hit for 4 years to buy him out. Not ideal, but not unbearable. Not as if he has future SB and/or had $3-5 million of his remaining $12 million cap hit front loaded in prior years.

 

[StreetHawk]

Heinola assigned to the AHL
That Jets D core....

8 NHL games and as a European drafted player, he's eligible to go to the A. So, saves them an ELC year. Can still call him up later if they want, which if he plays 2 games will burn an ELC year, but as long as they keep him off the active roster for 40 games, he does not accrue a season towards free agency (ala Boeser, Meier, Connor).

 

[vancityluongo]

The kicker in the Schneider deal for NJ was that they got the player evaluation exactly correct, they just got the evaluation of their team and where their team was at horribly wrong.

Schneider basically gave them Vezina-calibre goaltending his first 3 years in NJ before his hips gave out ... but the team around him was so bad that all it did was ruined their high draft pick.

They also blew that first year of Schneider by having him continue to split starts/backup Brodeur.

 

[NoShowWilly]

man that byfuglien situation is bullshit

 

[Billy Kvcmu]

This dude used to be someone worth a follow on Twitter for some accurate take when the team had nothing to look forward to few years ago.
But now all he does is trying so hard to find ways to make fun of people who disagreed with his opinion, and he’s really forcing it like a 12 years old.
He keeps showing up on my timeline despite I unfollowed him a while ago, time to block him.

 

[krutovsdonut]

11 blown lead in 10 games
But they haven’t blown a 5-1 lead

that has to really hurt. shero's back is against the wall facuing the loss of hall and vatanan if he doesn't fix this. i wonder what they'd pay for demko right now.