Post-Game Talk (GBU): That one hurts

[littletonhockeycoach]

This team will not go anywhere until the forwards buy into playing defense and the defensemen stop losing containment in front of the net.

In OT, Jack can't take that shot...you just can't. Also if Dahlin was so gassed, he probably shouldn't have been down at the face-off dot... All hindsight but stuff they need to be aware of.

Lack of engagement by many (not all) of the forwards in their own zone was one of the biggest problems I saw all night long. Eichel was particularly lax in this.

Our D does not overall possess sufficient size, agility or quickness to handle the intense forecheck clinic that the Canes put on last night. This is the playbook for how to handle the Sabres and smart coaches are using it.

I'm not an analytics guy but I'm betting they will support my contention that it was obvious that we were manhandled in our own zone. Phil wanted a quick recovery and exit defensive corp and that's what he has. Problem is, they are not very good at handling a pressure forecheck - esp. with a lack of help from the fwds - and this negates Phil's desires. Carolina sent 3 guys deep at times with the deliberate intent to isolate our D man with the puck. No time, no space to work with. The Canes only problem was that they occasionally had to let up on the gas. And when they did, the Sabres showed some life.

Bogo was too slow reacting and recovering. McCabe simply is not athletic enough to handle it. Scandella plays a different style of game - wants to be a puck mover vs a battler, Pilut is skilled but too small to handle that kind of physicality, Risto has the tools but is just plain dumb, and Dahlin is still learning.

None of these guys are at Josi's, PK's or Ellis's, etc. level Phil. They can't do what you want them to do.

It's really simple basic hockey 101.

 

[littletonhockeycoach]

If I had to guess, it's that now this is probably going to come up in every media scrum the rest of the year. It'll amplify if the team continues to play poorly, or any night Ullmark/Reinhart struggle in particular. Which is at best, annoying. At worst, demotivating.

Not to mention the media tends to embellish or outright lie, so giving them ammo to do so is usually a bad decision. Depending on the severity of said lies, it can mess with a player/teams confidence... especially if they're already struggling, these people are human afterall trying to make it in the best league in the world... or worse their personal lives, their careers, etc. Just look at how twisted things got the last few years with Eichel and Murray/Bylsma, kids vs vets, Jack vs Lehner.

Pretty much what happened with Lehner in the locker room last season, right?

 

[SnuggaRUDE]

Pretty much what happened with Lehner in the locker room last season, right?

I think there were some other more dramatic, and well documented issues going on with Lehner last season.

 

[littletonhockeycoach]

How Phil handled this one or how Botts handled this one? If I am Eichel, Reinhart, Skinner I am wondering why Botts is sitting on his hands trying to figure out how to GM.

No, I'm thinking the players now know Phil doesn't believe in them any longer. Phil's been applauded for his positive psychological approach to coaching. If I'm a player, I'm now doubting if I should believe what he's telling me.

 

[littletonhockeycoach]

I think there were some other more dramatic, and well documented issues going on with Lehner last season.

True. But the tire tracks from being thrown under the bus leave marks all the same.

 

[SnuggaRUDE]

True. But the tire tracks from being thrown under the bus leave marks all the same.

Certainly you're correct. I have no study to cite how much better or worse that is when compared to, the effects of say, getting blackout drunk every night.

 

[old kummelweck]

True. But the tire tracks from being thrown under the bus leave marks all the same.

Or maybe it was a wake up call.

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

Housley's comments are overblown. He responded to a semi-loaded question about whether the D-corps can still play, and obviously it's Botterill's job to determine if they belong on the roster. Housley hasn't put together the best D combos and stuck with them enough, so no excuses for him, but he wasn't trying to blame Botterill there.

Reinhart's quote is understandable after a frustrating loss, but he's way out in left field if he think's the goalies have gotten defensive support (from FWs as well as Dmen) at an acceptable level. When you see the goals being given up lately, Hutton gets too damn scrambly but they are predominantly high quality chances given up. Others right above me have summed up the deficiencies well, so Reinhart needs a reality check and to get right with his goalies. Maybe more of the FWs need a reality check on defensive coverage. Ultimately the HC needs to get this right, but players have to take responsibility too.

 

[Icicle]

Lack of engagement by many (not all) of the forwards in their own zone was one of the biggest problems I saw all night long. Eichel was particularly lax in this.

Our D does not overall possess sufficient size, agility or quickness to handle the intense forecheck clinic that the Canes put on last night. This is the playbook for how to handle the Sabres and smart coaches are using it.

I'm not an analytics guy but I'm betting they will support my contention that it was obvious that we were manhandled in our own zone. Phil wanted a quick recovery and exit defensive corp and that's what he has. Problem is, they are not very good at handling a pressure forecheck - esp. with a lack of help from the fwds - and this negates Phil's desires. Carolina sent 3 guys deep at times with the deliberate intent to isolate our D man with the puck. No time, no space to work with. The Canes only problem was that they occasionally had to let up on the gas. And when they did, the Sabres showed some life.

Bogo was too slow reacting and recovering. McCabe simply is not athletic enough to handle it. Scandella plays a different style of game - wants to be a puck mover vs a battler, Pilut is skilled but too small to handle that kind of physicality, Risto has the tools but is just plain dumb, and Dahlin is still learning.

None of these guys are at Josi's, PK's or Ellis's, etc. level Phil. They can't do what you want them to do.

It's really simple basic hockey 101.

The defense pitch soft dumps along the boards expecting a forward to be there to pick it up and take it out of the zone. Except, 90% of the time our forwards are getting beat by some pinching defender. We only ever exit the zones when the particularly lazy guys are out there because the defenders went off for a change. The wingers are way too passive on their breakout.

Some of that can come from not trusting your defenders, but the defenders haven't been that bad, it's been the wingers not being in position.

Yes, sometimes the center can manpower the cycle on their own, but you can't rely on your centers to do all the breakouts for you. But these chumps do.

Any team who has forechecked us hard exposes this weakness immediately.

 

[debaser66]

Colorado has fallen just like the Sabres from the standings....they really aren't much different.

There top guys are scoring more consistently at elite level.
Its the best line in the league.
GF/GA Col 176/177 Buf 158/166
They have a bit worse goaltending.

 

[UnleashRasmus]

To be honest this is where most expected the team to be. On the playoff bubble. So for me, the expectations are about where they should be. They for sure were altered when we went on that prolific winning streak. However, that push was unsustainable. We're seeing great things from Reinhart, Eichel, Dahlin, and Skinner. We're also seeing at least a visible presence from Bogosian healthy which has been a nice sight. At this point: get rid of excess and TRY everything you can to move Okposo!

 

[debaser66]

I cant believe this fanbase actually are more hung up on Reinharts comments than Housleys.
I saw it live.
This guy needs to be gone.
He is not a leader.
He acted like a little sulking kid when asked critical questions.
There is a difference in being positive or being afraid to actually adress things or just sugar coating failure.

This guy is probably so diffuse and nebular that nobody knows whats going on.
The team is not responding.
They never had any consistent effort since he got here except that fluke of a winning streak.
This team needs a real leader as a HC.
They are too immature and inexperienced.

I forgive a young twenty year old easier for making comments in the heat of the moment than a 50 year old man who should know better.

 

[Aladyyn]

That Housley quote that everyone is outraged about is fine with the context of the question that was asked.

 

[debaser66]

I didn't actually feel that bad about this loss, getting the point makes it hurt less. The organization falling apart at the seams however, does not make me feel better. What the hell is up with everyone throwing each other under the bus?

Bad leadership does that

 

[Buff15Sabres]

I cant believe this fanbase actually are more hung up on Reinharts comments than Housleys.
I saw it live.
This guy needs to be gone.
He is not a leader.
He acted like a little sulking kid when asked critical questions.
There is a difference in being positive or being afraid to actually adress things or just sugar coating failure.

This guy is probably so diffuse and nebular that nobody knows whats going on.
The team is not responding.
They never had any consistent effort since he got here except that fluke of a winning streak.
This team needs a real leader as a HC.
They are too immature and inexperienced.

I forgive a young twenty year old easier for making comments in the heat of the moment than a 50 year old man who should know better.

I wouldn't call "Is your D corps good enough" a critical question. I would call it a loaded question.

The PC response would've been "Our players are great, we just have some work to do in certain areas". I'm not going to complain about Housley's actual response to that question. He's correct, ultimately it is up to the GM if the players are good enough and to make changes if they are not. The talent level of this roster is not good, and there's only so much a coach can do about that.

 

[debaser66]

To be honest this is where most expected the team to be. On the playoff bubble. So for me, the expectations are about where they should be. They for sure were altered when we went on that prolific winning streak. However, that push was unsustainable. We're seeing great things from Reinhart, Eichel, Dahlin, and Skinner. We're also seeing at least a visible presence from Bogosian healthy which has been a nice sight. At this point: get rid of excess and TRY everything you can to move Okposo!

Expectation change with that winstreak.
Its not like they had to beat the world.
A bit or around 0.500 would have been enough to get in the playoffs.
Instead they disintegrated completely
For one of the worst records in the league since December.
Just one more team in league history managed to miss the playoffs after leading the NHL in November.

 

[1point21Gigawatts]

Pretty sure that if i pointed a finger at my bosses, in any context, they would not be thrilled with me and there would be consequences.

 

[debaser66]

I wouldn't call "Is your D corps good enough" a critical question. I would call it a loaded question.

The PC response would've been "Our players are great, we just have some work to do in certain areas". I'm not going to complain about Housley's actual response to that question. He's correct, ultimately it is up to the GM if the players are good enough and to make changes if they are not. The talent level of this roster is not good, and there's only so much a coach can do about that.

Even Bysmla got more out of a worse d corp and a better record in both seasons (if they continue like that)
If the coach cant adjust his tactics to what he has he is not a good coach.
And if Botterill and Housley are not communicating on what is needed to make it better its not good either.
Obviously if I need something to achieve a goal I ask for it not say someone else is responsible to make that descicion.

 

[SnuggaRUDE]

Pretty sure that if i pointed a finger at my bosses, in any context, they would not be thrilled with me and there would be consequences.

At a minimum I would be doing my best to have my ducks in the rowyest row possible. To wit: not playing Scandella.

 

[1point21Gigawatts]

At a minimum I would be doing my best to have my ducks in the rowyest row possible. To wit: not playing Scandella.

My friend just texted me that tweet. If those lines are any indication of Housley's mindset - he clearly isn't concerned with getting his ducks in the rowyest row possbile.

 

[stokes84]

Pretty late to this, but I’m glad that Housley and Reinhart threw some shots. I am so sick of the people on this team accepting a low standard from their co-workers.

 

[SnuggaRUDE]

My friend just texted me that tweet. If those lines are any indication of Housley's mindset - he clearly isn't concerned with getting his ducks in the rowyest row possbile.

Sweet Jesus, I like the forward lines I guess, but what happened to the defense? It's almost not possible to take 6 defenders at random and come up with a less effective deployment.

 

[CrazyPsycho]

Pretty late to this, but I’m glad that Housley and Reinhart threw some shots. I am so sick of the people on this team accepting a low standard from their co-workers.

And then they both backpedaled to a ridiculous degree

 

[OkimLom]

And then they both backpedaled to a ridiculous degree

What "ridiculous" degree is that?

 

[Vito_81]

All things considered. I’ll take the point. Down 5-3 late, that should have been the end of it. Nice to see them rally.

Detroit needs to be a W.