OT: Teh Philadelphia Seventy Sixers are still searching.

[Jtown]

I have never heard this. The Spurs specifically wanting no part of Fultz under any circumstances was from Lowe, who’s as reliable as it gets.

They did supposedly like Saric.

what we know for sure was that the sixers were unwilling to part with Fultz for Leonard. Thats all we know. That mere fact makes me want to stab my brain.

 

[Sombastate]

How's the draft class overall Jojo?

There's a guy named Bol Bol. There's no way its a quality draft

 

[JojoTheWhale]

what we know for sure was that the sixers were unwilling to part with Fultz for Leonard. Thats all we know. That mere fact makes me want to stab my brain.

What we know is that they were unwilling to start there. The Lakers were unwilling to empty the vault for Davis. Boston wouldn’t put Tatum on the table. Both happened. This is usually how it goes.

Talks never had a chance to develop because Pop insisted on a win now piece and the Sixers didn’t have one to give.

 

[Jtown]

What we know is that they were unwilling to start there. The Lakers were unwilling to empty the vault for Davis. Boston wouldn’t put Tatum on the table. Both happened. This is usually how it goes.

Talks never had a chance to develop because Pop insisted on a win now piece and the Sixers didn’t have one to give.

what vault? tatum make sense. A trio of Tatum, irving and Davis is what you want. The fact that the sixers still held fultz in such high regard after faking an injury is astonishing.

 

[Embiid]

I have never heard this before. The Spurs specifically wanting no part of Fultz under any circumstances was from Lowe, who’s as reliable as it gets.

They did supposedly like Saric.

Yeah I never heard that package either..maybe the Sixers offered it along with the Miami pick but Raptors scoffed? Either way...Toronto made the gamble and hit the jackpot

 

[The Madrigal]

It really sucks the way things worked out but using 20/20 hindsight to second guess the Sixers over this is completely unfair.

 

[Jtown]

It really sucks the way things worked out but using 20/20 hindsight to second guess the Sixers over this is completely unfair.

its not. the post hinkie debacle was self inflicted.

 

[The Madrigal]

its not. the post hinkie debacle was self inflicted.

Blaming the Sixers for not trading for Leonard is 20/20 hindsight and completely unfair. Blaming them for trading up to draft Fultz, or completely missing on Korkmaz and TLC is a different story all together and I would agree with you on that. Also, I'm not sure what debacle you are referencing since they are coming off of back to back 50+ win seasons for the first time in something like 30 years. They've made some mistakes along the way but they are clearly headed in the right direction with an absolutely critical off-season facing them.

 

[Embiid]

In hindsight, yes. At the time NOBODY would have been ok with trading Simmons for Leonard. People expected Simmons to improve a lot more than he did this year, and nobody knew that Durant and Thompson would have a shredded achilles and ACL in the playoffs. I guess that's why sometimes you have to be willing to take risks in sports. The Raptors did and the stars aligned for them to win a championship. Even if Leonard leaves the trade is a massive all time win for them based on the championship.

Yes..in hindsight definitely. I would have not liked trading Simmons and who knows if the Sixers would have managed Leonard's minutes the way Toronto did and how it made him a menace MVP in the playoffs.

 

[Jtown]

i can see where you are coming from. Leonard had the health issues, extensions issues, as well as being a bit of an odd ball. However a competent gm recognizes that top 5 talents rarely become available and a team with the assets we had at the time should have been in discussions.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

what vault? tatum make sense. A trio of Tatum, irving and Davis is what you want. The fact that the sixers still held fultz in such high regard after faking an injury is astonishing.

Tatum was made available in the end per Shelburne and others. The narrative from the LA side was that they had to keep enough of their core to surround the two stars. In the end, they gave up every shred of value they had minus one future first and Kuzma. These talks evolve.

I know you have an obsession with the Fultz thing, but he was the most valuable spare piece they had in a futures trade last summer. It makes sense to not start there. It also makes no sense to put him on the table if the Spurs don’t value him unless you involve another team.

 

[Jtown]

Tatum was made available in the end per Shelburne and others. The narrative from the LA side was that they had to keep enough of their core to surround the two stars. In the end, they gave up every shred of value they had minus one future first and Kuzma. These talks evolve.

I know you have an obsession with the Fultz thing, but he was the most valuable spare piece they had in a futures trade last summer. It makes sense to not start there. It also makes no sense to put him on the table if the Spurs don’t value him unless you involve another team.

when a talent like that becomes available its not time to but out the shrewd move playbook. THe moment you're unwilling to have everyone other than simmons and embiid available is the moment you are not being taken seriously.

Kuzma and a future first is basically worthless.

 

[The Madrigal]

i can see where you are coming from. Leonard had the health issues, extensions issues, as well as being a bit of an odd ball. However a competent gm recognizes that top 5 talents rarely become available and a team with the assets we had at the time should have been in discussions.

By all accounts they were in discussions. There were so many reports about what they offered, were willing to offer, etc that it's difficult to know what was true and what wasn't. I just remember reading a report and I can't remember who it was from that SA insisted on Embiid or Simmons for Leonard. If they honestly refused to give up a package that included Fultz and their first round pick than obviously they deserve to be crucified. I seriously doubt that is the case though.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

when a talent like that becomes available its not time to but out the shrewd move playbook. THe moment you're unwilling to have everyone other than simmons and embiid available is the moment you are not being taken seriously.

Kuzma and a future first is basically worthless.

You won’t find anyone lower on Kuzma than me, but he’s an NBA player.

Ok, you’re the guy making the decisions for the Sixers in July ‘18. You approach Popovich and he tells you he has absolutely no interest in Markelle Fultz. We know this happened. What option is better than floating him to Woj as an untouchable?

 

[Jtown]

You won’t find anyone lower on Kuzma than me, but he’s an NBA player.

Ok, you’re the guy making the decisions for the Sixers in July ‘18. You approach Popovich and he tells you he has absolutely no interest in Markelle Fultz. We know this happened. What option is better than floating him to Woj as an untouchable?

true, that is logical. hint hint we love fultz and last year was an anomaly. If pop rejects fultz i have an honest discussion with myself about Simmons.

 

[Schwarbomb]

By all accounts they were in discussions. There were so many reports about what they offered, were willing to offer, etc that it's difficult to know what was true and what wasn't. I just remember reading a report and I can't remember who it was from that SA insisted on Embiid or Simmons for Leonard. If they honestly refused to give up a package that included Fultz and their first round pick than obviously they deserve to be crucified. I seriously doubt that is the case though.

I'm inclined to believe the no deal without Simmons/Embiid report. And I can't see any GM taking that kind of risk.

 

[jasonleaffan]

Serious question for everyone debating the Kawhi trade, with hindsight being 20/20, would you guys have not traded anything for a championship? Even knowing Leonard walks(which is yet to be determined) and leaving your cupboard bare for the next number of years?

Raptors threw a hail Mary and lucked out tremendously, but we could have easily been out in the second round against you guys.

 

[Schwarbomb]

Serious question for everyone debating the Kawhi trade, with hindsight being 20/20, would you guys have not traded anything for a championship? Even knowing Leonard walks(which is yet to be determined) and leaving your cupboard bare for the next number of years?

Raptors threw a hail Mary and lucked out tremendously, but we could have easily been out in the second round against you guys.

That's easy for me. f*** the future if it meant a championship now. For the Raptors though I didn't see trading DeRozan as some kind of massive gamble. He's a meh/overrated player on an expensive deal and past his prime. I loved the trade at the time for the Raptors. Go all in, then hit the reset button if it didn't work out.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

Raptors threw a hail Mary and lucked out tremendously,

I really don't think that's what happened. The price was so hilariously over the top cheap that they couldn't afford to say no. DeRozan shouldn't have had significantly positive trade value and they got what I thought at the time was the 3rd best player on the planet with upside left. You take that chance and make him say no to the money every single time.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

I'm just going to shut up and enjoy this.

 

[Chinatown88]

 

[DancingPanther]

I'm just going to shut up and enjoy this.

Burn Boston, burn

 

[Schwarbomb]

Nice. I wonder how much cap they would have to play with though if Al and Irving leave.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

Nice. I wonder how much cap they would have to play with though if Al and Irving leave.

~28MM if they renounce everyone and make all of their picks.

So the 32.7 threshold is achievable with some stashes or trades, but it would take more than one to get there.

*Edit*

Did they lowball Horford?! What the hell?

 

[Big Poppa Puck]

How's the draft class overall Jojo?

I know you were asking Jojo, but it's pretty much a 3 player class, with 1 of those 2 (Zion) being a tier above the other two (Morant and Barrett). I'm not as high on Zion as most, He's 6'7 and I think he looked small in college, which means he might be a man without a position in the NBA, too small for the 4 and doesn't really fit the mold of a 3. But who knows, Barkley was only 6'4 and he's still young enough to grow a few more inches, plus he's really athletic. But if I was a team who needed a Guard and had the 1st pick I'd really consider taking Morant over him.

I personally like Culver a lot too and if I'm the Pelicans (or whoever they trade that pick to) at #4 he's my BPA. Darius Garland would have had a lot a hype around him had it not been for his injury. I might have went back to school if I was him, but he's probably still going to be a Top 10 pick.


In the Sixers position, I really like Carsen Edwards, kids a player and I think we'll be great rotation player/6th man type. And I always hold the opinion, that if I'm picking outside they top 10, I'm almost always picking an upperclassman. Especially in a crap class like this. Although maybe not as talented as some other those Fr. and So. Those guys are more developed, polished and mature and I'd rather pick one of those guys than some under developed kid who either got bad advice and came out too early or is just chasing money.

I know this an extreme example, cause even I didn't expected him to this good, but IDK how Draymond Green lasted to RD2, always knew he was at worst going to be a glue guy 6, 7, 8th man on someones bench. So at 24 give me someone like Edwards, Cameron Johnson, Grant Williams or Thybulle rather than Tyler Herro, Kevin Porter or Horton-Tucker for example.