Confirmed with Link: [TBL/NSH] Lightning trade Ryan McDonagh for D Philippe Myers and F Grant Mismash

[Wester]

So if it was more about the 23/24 season and beyond, why didn't Tampa just trade him next summer? I honestly don't think his play is going off a cliff this season - he's far from done and is still a very solid defenseman. Rest during the off-season will do him well, just like everyone else on the team. And it's not as if the return would be at stake, and no, I don’t think we would have had to add to move him, just wouldn't have gotten much back like what happened yesterday.

We absolutely would have to pay more. This year we had the choice to not trade him, so we had more leverage. Next year when all those RFA-s come up, every team would know we must trade him, like the Johnson situation.

 

[Felonious Python]

So if it was more about the 23/24 season and beyond, why didn't Tampa just trade him next summer? I honestly don't think his play is going off a cliff this season - he's far from done and is still a very solid defenseman. Rest during the off-season will do him well, just like everyone else on the team. And it's not as if the return would be at stake, and no, I don’t think we would have had to add to move him, just wouldn't have gotten much back like what happened yesterday.

Palat likely figures in.

 

[Wester]

Palat likely figures in.

Yea it kills two birds with one stone, helps this year and next year, while trading killorn only would have helped this year.

 

[Todd1a]

If JBB buys out Myers I like the trade for cap purposes.

If he doesn't buy out Myers and we lose Rutta than its gonna cost them. No way they go on a deep run with the way the team is looking rn, with barely any if the cap relief from moving McD....WHICH WAS THE WHOLE f***ING POINT OF MOVING HIM

No way we go on a long run with these defenseman unless Hedman plays like a Norris god all season and then suddenly Sergachev looks like a Norris guy also

 

[Stammertime91]

Had a dream we went back to the SCF for a 4th year in a row.

Sadly we got swept by St Louis. It was bad guys.

 

[Five Alarm Fire]

Came to a realization this morning that could explain why Brisebois was so vague yesterday.

We don't know if we'll be able to keep Foote this year. There is an ongoing investigation from Hockey Canada and we have no clue what is going to come out. Myers provides us an option in a worst-case scenario.

 

[Crunchrulz]

Tampa is a team that needs cap space and depth and this trade helped with both. Is it the final answer; no. Did we have to give up quality to get something in return considering the contract clauses; absolutely. Key is we gave up NO young players or future picks. For that, we should be thankful given just how little actual depth we have in the system that is ready to step in at the NHL level of play.

 

[J T Money]

No, he had an NTC. Protecting him was a choice.

I thought and still think the better play was to protect Gourde and unprotect McD if Seattle would've given us something for him. Not sure that was available, though.

Then I would agree with you. Why protect him for just a year?

 

[BoltzManConstant]

Yeah....Even still. I wouldn't of made the deal to be honest then.

There comes a certain point where when you make the deal you need to look at the long term ramifications of it or the short term. Where does it help you? This gives us cap space to sign Palat, awesome. We should get him signed. Though I would of felt much more comfortable telling Killorn he needed to take a walk than Mcdonagh.

Killorn there was a 16 team trade list he would of had to submit if we asked him to do it. The real question is. Would we rather get rid of Mcdonagh for this crap return? Or Trade Killorn? The answer for me is simple.

This helps you long term and short term. Short term, we need money to re-sign Palat and Paul, and cover Point's raise. Long term, we need McDonagh and Killorn's money if we want to re-sign Cernak, Serg, Cirelli, Colton, and Foote next summer. It's really more of a question of who we move when, and if waited another year on McD it could've gotten really costly to move him.

 

[BoltzManConstant]

Then I would agree with you. Why protect him for just a year?

Eh, there are a lot of moving parts, a lot of potential reasons.

a) Perhaps JBB decided we couldn't afford either one -- Gourde or McD -- after this year, and perhaps McD had signaled willingness to waive his NTC and Gourde had not. The expansion draft overrode an NTC (but not NMC, as you pointed out), so that would then be the only way to move Gourde.

b) Perhaps JBB decided we couldn't afford either one, but the issue wasn't NTC's it was the value we'd get back. Maybe Seattle wasn't willing to give us anything to expose McD, and JBB thought we could get more for him on the open market than we could for Gourde when we had to make a move after this season. (If that's the case, I'm thinking he miscalculated.

c) Maybe JBB was thinking we'd keep McD through the rest of his contract and lose other guys instead, but has now decided McD's play has fallen off in a way he hadn't expected, and he changed course.

d) Maybe JBB was looking purely short-term at the threepeat, and felt like keeping McD and replace Gourde with a cheap forward (say, Bellemare) made us a better team this year than one where we keep Gourde and replace McD with a cheap D (say, Luke Schenn or equivalent quality).

e) [many other possibilities...]

In truth, the two big reasons I thought we should unprotect McD was that I thought Seattle would make it worth our while and I thought McD would hang tight to his NTC (meaning the draft was nearly our only chance to get clear of his contract before it went bad). I was wrong on the latter, and I wouldn't be surprised if was wrong on the former.

I do wonder why McD waived the NTC. Was McD just into moving on, or did JBB have to bring up the possibility of waivers, leaving McD zero control over where he ended up?

 

[The Gongshow]

Eh, there are a lot of moving parts, a lot of potential reasons.

a) Perhaps JBB decided we couldn't afford either one -- Gourde or McD -- after this year, and perhaps McD had signaled willingness to waive his NTC and Gourde had not. The expansion draft overrode an NTC (but not NMC, as you pointed out), so that would then be the only way to move Gourde.

b) Perhaps JBB decided we couldn't afford either one, but the issue wasn't NTC's it was the value we'd get back. Maybe Seattle wasn't willing to give us anything to expose McD, and JBB thought we could get more for him on the open market than we could for Gourde when we had to make a move after this season. (If that's the case, I'm thinking he miscalculated.

c) Maybe JBB was thinking we'd keep McD through the rest of his contract and lose other guys instead, but has now decided McD's play has fallen off in a way he hadn't expected, and he changed course.

d) Maybe JBB was looking purely short-term at the threepeat, and felt like keeping McD and replace Gourde with a cheap forward (say, Bellemare) made us a better team this year than one where we keep Gourde and replace McD with a cheap D (say, Luke Schenn or equivalent quality).

e) [many other possibilities...]

In truth, the two big reasons I thought we should unprotect McD was that I thought Seattle would make it worth our while and I thought McD would hang tight to his NTC (meaning the draft was nearly our only chance to get clear of his contract before it went bad). I was wrong on the latter, and I wouldn't be surprised if was wrong on the former.

I do wonder why McD waived the NTC. Was McD just into moving on, or did JBB have to bring up the possibility of waivers, leaving McD zero control over where he ended up?

I think D. I don't blame him for going all I'm on the 3peat. 2 wins away.

I feel like when alot of players get asked if they'd waive they do simply knowing that he isn't wanted or valued anymore and probably a little hurt. To say no, knowing they wanted you gone, would be a weird feeling playing for that organization still.

A bit of "fine, trade me here. If I don't feel wanted anymore I'll go somewhere else where I am" BUT also knowing its a business and it happens all the time

 

[JoVel]

I feel like when alot of players get asked if they'd waive they do simply knowing that he isn't wanted or valued anymore and probably a little hurt. To say no, knowing they wanted you gone, would be a weird feeling playing for that organization still.

This is McDonagh we're talking about. Not Drouin or DeAngelo or whoever. I'm sure he understands that it's not because he's not wanted.

 

[BoltzManConstant]

nm

 

[The Gongshow]

This is McDonagh we're talking about. Not Drouin or DeAngelo or whoever. I'm sure he understands that it's not because he's not wanted.

Yeup. Very true. He's a class act, but I'm sure he was probably a little saddened to here he'd be on the move considering the cups and his role and its probably never easy leaving a team and teammates you truly enjoy.

But it's a business both parties know this and I'm glad JBB worked with him to get him somewhere he wanted to go (besides the obvious fact thet he wouldn't only waive for said teams on the list)

When was the last time someone was asked to waive and they said no and stayed with the team?

 

[DarrylshutzSydor]

They should enact a rule that allows players to approve discounts on their salaries. Kuch, Point, and Vasi should all give up at least $500,000.....

 

[TheDaysOf 04]

They should enact a rule that allows players to approve discounts on their salaries. Kuch, Point, and Vasi should all give up at least $500,000.....

They already took that discount when they signed their contracts. Kuch and Vasy could have easily taken more at the time. Barkov and Bob both took $10M a year from the Panthers and they haven't done squat.

 

[Maelmoor]

It's easy to neglect the value of cap space, it's incredible valuable, especially when the cap isn't increasing. There is a limited amount of teams that can swallow lot of cap at this point and you have to be one step ahead or you will get screwed quickly. JBB is a master at this art and have kept us competitive despite lot of tricky situations, hence I trust him in this aspect going forward too.

 

[Point21]

They already took that discount when they signed their contracts. Kuch and Vasy could have easily taken more at the time. Barkov and Bob both took $10M a year from the Panthers and they haven't done squat.

Crazy to see Toronto have 3 of the 7 highest cap hits and still cant get out of the first round. Florida cant win anything past round 1, Chicago won their cups and now are over paying for Seth Jones and Toews , Rangers are at least competitive with Fox and Panarin (expect Shesty to hit double digits his next contract) , Dallas is a fringe playoff team, LA won their cups and havent really done much since, VGK is in a worse cap situation than we have ever had and is turning into a circus, SJ is a hell hole for overpaid dmen, MTL is paying price like hes in his Hart season, Boston actually has some good contracts, and Ovi has carried that Caps team for a long time.

 

[DarrylshutzSydor]

It's easy to neglect the value of cap space, it's incredible valuable, especially when the cap isn't increasing. There is a limited amount of teams that can swallow lot of cap at this point and you have to be one step ahead or you will get screwed quickly. JBB is a master at this art and have kept us competitive despite lot of tricky situations, hence I trust him in this aspect going forward too.

Looks like the Bolts are in a pickle.....

 

[Point21]

According to Nick Kypreos, If McDonagh didnt agree to a trade, they were gonna waive him and had a commitment from Columbus to claim him


Around 10:30 in

 

[DFC]

According to Nick Kypreos, If McDonagh didnt agree to a trade, they were gonna waive him and had a commitment from Columbus to claim him


Around 10:30 in

I really hope that's not true.

 

[Point21]

I really hope that's not true.

just gave me major Dan Boyle trade vibes

 

[TheDaysOf 04]

Crazy to see Toronto have 3 of the 7 highest cap hits and still cant get out of the first round. Florida cant win anything past round 1, Chicago won their cups and now are over paying for Seth Jones and Toews , Rangers are at least competitive with Fox and Panarin (expect Shesty to hit double digits his next contract) , Dallas is a fringe playoff team, LA won their cups and havent really done much since, VGK is in a worse cap situation than we have ever had and is turning into a circus, SJ is a hell hole for overpaid dmen, MTL is paying price like hes in his Hart season, Boston actually has some good contracts, and Ovi has carried that Caps team for a long time.

Colorado is in a good spot thanks to Makar, Rantanen, Landeskog, and MacKinnon's contracts.

Looking at Toronto, even if Matthews took 10.5, Tavares took 10 and Marner took 9.5 that would give Toronto another $3.5 M of cap space to work with.

 

[Sky04]

I really hope that's not true.

There is no way that got leaked even if it's true - I highly doubt that backup plan but then again, McD doesn't seem too thrilled about being moved.

 

[Zwui21]

Guy is a legit top pairing defenseman.....Your trying to tell me the most we could get for a top pairing defenseman was a cap dump? I mean I wasn't expecting a return like a Mortiz Seider or something unreasonable. Just get us something in return...either now or in the future. Hes mortgaged our future to go after a third cup to make us a legit dynasty. I can get behind that honestly. Though he failed to get us scoring depth in the process (Paul was the exception. Though with that said Rick Dudley found Marty St.Louis for us and no one would suggest he was a hockey genius.). Now we have no future, he's trading away really good core pieces from us and getting nothing in return.

Please prove me wrong JBB. Please.

McDonagh contract will be a nightmare very soon, and we dished him out just in time IMO. He's a warrior, but his play took a step back this season already. We'll look back to this thinking "thank god" in one year or two IMO