Switzerland: Swiss young guns

[stv11]

I totaly agree with duga on this... We miss the very good talent this year...

Again we have good scoring forwards in Christoph Bertschy, Julian Schmutz or Nicola Brandi who lack the size. Then we have othe good forwards who are still raw in their game like Dario Simion or Sandro Zangger.

Anthony Rouiller can be compared to Yannick Weber - small and hard working with a very good shot. But Rouiller is very injury prone, which gives him a huge question mark...

The 94s need an increadible u18 WJC, or even make it to the u20 (but that chance is so small and I don't see anyone make it as a double underager) to get more recognition... Like I said at the begining of the season, that our guys in NA have the best chances to get drafted and I still hold on to that quote...

I attended the U18 game against Sweden last Saturday. It was my first time seeing Rouiller live, and although he played a very smart, mistake free game, I expected him to be more dominant given the great things I had read about him.

I also was very impressed by Brandi, who I wasn't familiar with. Fast player with very good hands who tries to makes things happen. Luca Fazzini, one of the few 95 born on the team, was very good too, though his skating is suspect.

I know it's not a good idea to pass judgement on one game only, but I'd say that Bertschy and Simion are clearly ahead of the rest of the U18 in their development.

 

[croAVSfan*]

Will Nino play for Swiss U20 this year ?

and another question for swiss members, how far Swiss can go at this year's tournament ? Can they compete for medal ?

 

[Mattia Mei]

If Nino will make the nhl no.

The team seems to be very good. In the offense there are players like Bärtschi vermin simion hofmann bertschi grassi bertaggia tanner and others.

They indeed can win over latvia and slovakia and play the qf and then......

...they will play probably against us or maybe canada in the qf............................

 

[Mattia Mei]

On topic: i have a question for you wise men.

I mean..... Bärtschi, Simion, Vermin, Hofmann, Walser, Bertaggia, Grassi, Tanner Richard, Amstutz, Kuonen, Bertschi....4 lines.....The list is quite impressive.....You, do you think that all these guys could be in the WJC roster?

 

[torero]

On topic: i have a question for you wise men.

I mean..... Bärtschi, Simion, Vermin, Hofmann, Walser, Bertaggia, Grassi, Tanner Richard, Amstutz, Kuonen, Bertschi....4 lines.....The list is quite impressive.....You, do you think that all these guys could be in the WJC roster?

Oh my god !! a new problem !

too many good players !

 

[torero]

Bärtschi

is leading the points/game in the WHL. with a 2.36. 2nd is at 2.09, then 2.02 and the rest at 1.7 ... .

in the past 6 games, he had 5 games with 3 points ... this was the 4th game with 3 points in a row !

is their a record of streaks with 3 point per game ? ;-)

insane !

tu push the stats further,

he was absent from the team for many games.
Portland played 22 games so far.

8 without Bartschi. 4 losses 50 % wins.
14 with Bartschi. 4 losses 71% win.

interesting to note that when Bartschi was playing they scored 4.36 points/game
while they were at 4.25 points/game without him.
Yet they received 3.75 goals/game against without him. while only 3.36 with him.

Does that mean that he doesn't contribute that much in scoring goals ? hence the % wins are more due to poorer oponents ? Or that he is part of the structure of the game and the others benefit from him ? resulting into a team having less goals against in his presence ?
The relationship of assists/goals in his points would indicate the 2nd interpretation.

I guess that these results qualify him as an impact player !

But all these are only stats ... only a Portland Fan who sees them play can say if yes or not he is really such an impact player.

Another consideration : in 14 games he was 5 x 1st star, 1 x 2nd star and 3 x 3rd star should still indicate he brings seriously something to the team.

 

[jonas2244]

Very impressive.

Bertschy is on 8 p in 12 games, also quite good, and since he's playing with Plüss/Rüthemann they also started scoring again.

 

[stv11]

The NHL central scouting published its first draft list on Saturday. Here's the ranking of the Switzerland based players:

1. Joel Vermin (Bern)
2. Dario Simion (Lugano)
3. Christoph Bertschy (Bern)
4. Samuel Walser (Kloten)
5. Lukas Sieber (Davos Jun.)
6. Anthony Rouiller (Biel Jun.)
7. Julian Schmutz (Bern Jun.)
8. Sandro Zangger (GCK Lions)
9. Christian Marti (Kloten Jun.)
10. Samuel Guerra (Davos)
11. Jan Neuenschwander (Davos)
12. Lukas Balmelli (Lugano Jun.)
13. Nicola Brandi (GCK Lions Jun.)
14. Sämi Kreis (Bern Jun.)
15. Lukas Frick (Uzwil)
16. Alessandro Lanzarotti (Zug Jun.)

I'm surprised to see Vermin leading the list, and in a way it isn't really a good thing to have a guy in his third year of eligibility ranked first. No surprise then seeing Simion and Bertschy ahead of the rest, one having a skillset an NHL scout will like, and the other having taken the league by storm, but the fact that the fourth ranked player is an overager not playing a key role in his team certainly underlines the fact that there is few top end talent this year.

 

[Elverpond]

What about the young swiss players that are playing in North America?
I have no idea if they are even draft elligible or not but Baertschi and Nino both played in the CHL, I dont expect the NLA to actually produce a top prospect in the way maybe Eliteserien or SM-Liiga would.
Best hope for the future and I was talking to my friends about this the other day. The kids that are trained in North America but dont really 'make it' past that can at least go back to switzerland and use what they learned which makes the NLA stronger and does increase the possibilty of the Swiss having a 'homegrown' prospect in the future.

 

[jonas2244]

Some solid guys are in NA, but no first or second rounder. Bertaggia could be a late rounder.

Very interesting is that we a currently have a lot more offensive than defensive talent.

 

[stv11]

I think Bertaggia and Andrighetto were both ranked in the 20's. But being both in their second year of eligibility, they could be late round picks at best. And they still have that size issue.

 

[Belenos]

NHL Central Scouting Bureau's mid-season-ranking
(39 Tim Bozon)
58 Tanner Richard
186 Sven Andrighetto
122 Alessio Bertaggia

http://www.tsn.ca/draftcentre/feature/?id=56839

 

[stv11]

And Bertschy, Vermin, Kukan and Simion all ranked between 35 and 40 on the European list:

http://www.nhl.com/ice/page.htm?id=76672

No surprise here, I don't think we'll see more than one or two Swiss players drafter this year.

 

[torero]

Our U18 played Germany 3 times in Arosa

winning the 2 first bouts and loosing the third.

Was someone their ? or does someone have more informations than what is available ?

tks

 

[slovakiasnextone]

I guess it hasn´t been mentioned yet that F Kevin Fiala (1996 born) has moved from ZSC to Malmö in Sweden. It will be very interesting to see how he does there from what I remember he´s a prospect that got some attention pretty early on.

 

[Rafik Soliman]

Our U18 played Germany 3 times in Arosa

winning the 2 first bouts and loosing the third.

Was someone their ? or does someone have more informations than what is available ?

tks

Well, the Germans haven't brought their best 95-players with them, missing both Leon Draisaitl and Fredrik Tiffels, who are clearly the best forwards for them... That fore, these results are dangerous to missjudge...

Fabio Högger, Mirco Müller (who just played one game and then went to Arosa to play with the under-20 team) and Phil Baltisberger were the stand-outs... In the thrid game Celio and his crew called-up Kevin Fiala and he debuted with the under-18 team and showed a decent game...

The under-20 played in Arosa, but I only attended the first game against Denmark... the Danes were really weak and from the Swiss Tanner Richard and Christoph Bertschy had a dominant showing (allthough the Danes allowed it) and played well together...
The 2nd line was formed out of Alessio Bertaggia, Lino Martschini and Nolan Diem which you can clearly nick-name the "smurf-line"... None of them bigger than 5'9, but they sure were dangerous in the offensiv zone!

 

[J17 Vs Proclamation]

Well, the Germans haven't brought their best 95-players with them, missing both Leon Draisaitl and Fredrik Tiffels, who are clearly the best forwards for them... That fore, these results are dangerous to missjudge...

Fabio Högger, Mirco Müller (who just played one game and then went to Arosa to play with the under-20 team) and Phil Baltisberger were the stand-outs... In the thrid game Celio and his crew called-up Kevin Fiala and he debuted with the under-18 team and showed a decent game...

The under-20 played in Arosa, but I only attended the first game against Denmark... the Danes were really weak and from the Swiss Tanner Richard and Christoph Bertschy had a dominant showing (allthough the Danes allowed it) and played well together...
The 2nd line was formed out of Alessio Bertaggia, Lino Martschini and Nolan Diem which you can clearly nick-name the "smurf-line"... None of them bigger than 5'9, but they sure were dangerous in the offensiv zone!

Rafik, where do the age groups coming up rank with age groups gone past? As in, are the age groups significantly stronger now than they were 10 years ago?

Whilst clearly we have seen some top end talent from Switzerland recently, it's very difficult as an uneducated outside observer to know how the system is progressing (Or if indeed it is at all) and whether the talents on shown per age group are becoming consistently more solid and fruitful.

I am not really asking about this in relation to the NHL draft, rather, simply the relation to what we've seen in Swiss hockey in the past.

 

[stv11]

Fabio Högger, Mirco Müller (who just played one game and then went to Arosa to play with the under-20 team) and Phil Baltisberger were the stand-outs... In the thrid game Celio and his crew called-up Kevin Fiala and he debuted with the under-18 team and showed a decent game...

What do you think about Müller? I've heard good things about him, but never saw him live. Any chance he will be drafted?

 

[Rafik Soliman]

Rafik, where do the age groups coming up rank with age groups gone past? As in, are the age groups significantly stronger now than they were 10 years ago?

Whilst clearly we have seen some top end talent from Switzerland recently, it's very difficult as an uneducated outside observer to know how the system is progressing (Or if indeed it is at all) and whether the talents on shown per age group are becoming consistently more solid and fruitful.

I am not really asking about this in relation to the NHL draft, rather, simply the relation to what we've seen in Swiss hockey in the past.

I believe, that the skill level has gone up in Swiss Ice Hockey, but that is happening all over the hockey world IMO... Compared to the 94-class, the players this year are much bigger and stronger, other than that what is still missing in my eyes is the game breaking talent - the can't miss prospects....

We have a good hockey school in Switzerland for the basics, but we are not able to produce beyond that and that is a big problem and concern... The thing is, that Swiss Ice Hockey is getting a lot of money from the public hand and that fore is starting to develop players more and more for the public sport (in german Breitensport) and not for the professional sport (in german Leistungssport). Our Elite A-Level in Junior hockey contains 14 teams, but we only have 12 team in our Pro League and no where close that many players to fill 14 junior teams...
That way better players have it easier and are not challenged enough... Players, Parents and Agent are starting to realize this and taking the kids more and more out of the swiss hockey and are sending them to Sweden (Dean Kukan, Cedric Hächler (who is returning after one year), Luca Boltshauser and currently Kevin Fiala as example), or even to north America and the kids are making the bigger progress outside of Switzerland (of course that doesn't work for everyone as there are always exceptions)...

What do you think about Müller? I've heard good things about him, but never saw him live. Any chance he will be drafted?

Yes, I believe he is a serious candidate to get drafted... Has a nice cominbation of size and skill... Although he is a little bit prone in the defensiv zone to giveaways, but I hope that will stop with experience... Also a good leader on the ice, but more of a set-up man than shooter. Is he a top-100 player, I'm not sure yet, he sure will have to have a very good year in north america

 

[J17 Vs Proclamation]

I believe, that the skill level has gone up in Swiss Ice Hockey, but that is happening all over the hockey world IMO...

Well, i wouldn't agree with this, as some nations have clearly stagnated in development of youth players. Although it does feel like in European terms, the worst has happened, and nations are beginning to realise what they need to do to remain competitive.

Compared to the 94-class, the players this year are much bigger and stronger, other than that what is still missing in my eyes is the game breaking talent - the can't miss prospects....

From my relatively uneducated observations, it seems recent age groups have solid talents, but many of those talents have certain flaws/limitations that prevent them from being prospective NHL players. Alot of skilled smaller players, but not skilled enough to overcome those issues.

We have a good hockey school in Switzerland for the basics, but we are not able to produce beyond that and that is a big problem and concern... The thing is, that Swiss Ice Hockey is getting a lot of money from the public hand and that fore is starting to develop players more and more for the public sport (in german Breitensport) and not for the professional sport (in german Leistungssport). Our Elite A-Level in Junior hockey contains 14 teams, but we only have 12 team in our Pro League and no where close that many players to fill 14 junior teams...
That way better players have it easier and are not challenged enough... Players, Parents and Agent are starting to realize this and taking the kids more and more out of the swiss hockey and are sending them to Sweden (Dean Kukan, Cedric Hächler (who is returning after one year), Luca Boltshauser and currently Kevin Fiala as example), or even to north America and the kids are making the bigger progress outside of Switzerland (of course that doesn't work for everyone as there are always exceptions)...

Surely the fact that money is there must be considered a good thing long-term.

It's always seemed that Switzerland has been quite an insular hockey nation. A strong domestic league where many home players decide to remain instead of moving abroad. This definitely seems to be changing. Of course youngsters going abroad can be fruitful as they go to organisations with good history of development, but surely for the future, it's much more desirable if Switzerland can develop a system like other top nations where they keep most of their talent, instead of relying on other nations to finish their development.


Thankyou for the reponse Rafik. It can be difficult to truely understand what is happening within Switzerland.

 

[torero]

Our M20 selection did pretty well in the Füssen four nation tournament in Germany.

Beating Slovakia 3-1, Czechia 4-0 and Germany 6-1 this week end. 2-3-4 August.

Any qualitative comments or additional info or opinion to share ?

tks

 

[croAVSfan*]

I would like to know how good is Swiss squad that will play at this years edition of Ivan Hlinka Memorial ?

 

[slovakiasnextone]

Our M20 selection did pretty well in the Füssen four nation tournament in Germany.

Beating Slovakia 3-1, Czechia 4-0 and Germany 6-1 this week end. 2-3-4 August.

Any qualitative comments or additional info or opinion to share ?

tks

Do you know whether this Swiss selection was the best you have available? Looking over the names on the roster it seems that way to me, but I don´t know enough about the Swiss players at this level to be sure.

It should be said that the Czech team that played at this tournament was what the Czech federation calls U19 NT, though since there are usually also older players in it, it might be better to call it the U20 B selection. But definitely not the top team as the Czech U20 was actually busy getting their ass kicked in Sweden during this tourney. Slovak team was also missing the top players as Slovak coaches are currently preparing the team that will play in Slovak league and therefore no players who will play elsewhere (for example CHL) were there. Not sure about the Germans.

 

[torero]

Do you know whether this Swiss selection was the best you have available? Looking over the names on the roster it seems that way to me, but I don´t know enough about the Swiss players at this level to be sure.

It should be said that the Czech team that played at this tournament was what the Czech federation calls U19 NT, though since there are usually also older players in it, it might be better to call it the U20 B selection. But definitely not the top team as the Czech U20 was actually busy getting their ass kicked in Sweden during this tourney. Slovak team was also missing the top players as Slovak coaches are currently preparing the team that will play in Slovak league and therefore no players who will play elsewhere (for example CHL) were there. Not sure about the Germans.

I may be wrong but in all cases, the names of the scorers are part of the top team, this is sure yet i don't know about the rest of the roster.
And some top stars were missing like Niedereiter and Bartschi. (i saw no list of players, therefore ... since their names don't appear on the scoring list, i believe they weren't their !)

 

[croAVSfan*]

I may be wrong but in all cases, the names of the scorers are part of the top team, this is sure yet i don't know about the rest of the roster.
And some top stars were missing like Niedereiter and Bartschi. (i saw no list of players, therefore ... since their names don't appear on the scoring list, i believe they weren't their !)

Nino and Bartschi are too old for U20 team. U20 for 2012/2013 season is 1993. and younger.