Beauner
Registered User
I'm merely stating the fact that the same day Tocchet was named head coach he wrote and article about the Penguins trading Kessel, the same day Madden and others started to beat that drum. That's not a coincidence.
I'm merely stating the fact that the same day Tocchet was named head coach he wrote and article about the Penguins trading Kessel, the same day Madden and others started to beat that drum. That's not a coincidence.
Because he sucked.
And back to being scratched and demoted despite that.30+ point pace when he got to Anaheim. Sure, just awful.
No you haven't. you've presented 2 events and correlated them using your own narrative and jumping to conclusions. I'm ignoring it because it has no basis in realityI've presented actual evidence to how this isn't a coincidence. You ignore it because it doesn't fit your narrative. It's very different than this.
No you haven't. you've presented 2 events and correlated them using your own narrative and jumping to conclusions. I'm ignoring it because it has no basis in reality
I'm not positive I agree with everything you are dishing out, but I love this graphic.
That's totally ok. There's always gray area. Presenting theories and opinion as fact is when I take issueI'm not positive I agree with everything you are dishing out, but I love this graphic.
Then why did it take a whole 2 more years until he actually was traded? And you're seriously aguing Ron Cook was acting as a mouthpiece for the organization? On the list of Pittsburgh media the organization would use as a mouthpice he'd be somewhere between Mikey and Big Bob from KISS and myself. Madden I'll grant you, but even if it was being leaked to him, why are you placing the reasoning solely on Sullivan+the loss of Tocchet? Maybe Rutherford just wanted to re-tool using his most valuable, tradeable asset. Maybe he saw hints of deteriorating play (like what we witnessed this year) and wanted to capitalize while his value was sky high?There's a history of the Penguins feeding media talking points. It's an obvious trend through the years. The media has become their mouth pieces, doing their dirty work. The literal day Tocchet leaves the rumors of Phil Kessel trades begin swirling and statements of his lackluster issues in the locker room begin from multiple media sources. Yes, sure. It's all a coincidence and not yet another smear campaign orchestrated by a front office that has a long history of doing this very thing that continued for two years until he was traded.
Then why did it take a whole 2 more years until he actually was traded?
Why do you immediately point to Sullivan?
But isn’t that a negative on Phil? Kudos to Tocchet For being able to manage it. But I don’t think that makes the other coaches the scapegoats for Phils issues.Because Phil has control.
Because coaches have a problem with Phil. Because Tocchet said Sullivan didn’t know how to talk to Phil. Because Dupuis said Sullivan’s message wasn’t getting through to Phil. Because literally the DAY the guy that could control Phil was gone the media en masse started hit pieces.
30+ point pace when he got to Anaheim. Sure, just awful.
After listening to the Spittin Chiclets podcast, it's pretty clear Tocchet and Kessel have a unique relationship vs other coaches. The concern though is whether that can last with Tocchet as head coach where he can't spend as much time with individual relationships.
Anyway, I think it's fair to blame Kessel for being a tough player to manage, but it's also an indictment on Recchi IMO that he doesn't seem to know how to intervene with players the way Tocchet did. Not sure what that dude is still doing around.
Look at the poll man. It is ugly.Let's not overreact here. There's like 5 posters, tops, in this thread being super critical of the extension. I don't think that qualifies as a large % of this board, let alone enough to make a broad statement about Pittsburgher's.
Sully is an imperfect coach (who isn't?), but given his accomplishments with the team, you have to extend him. He has earned it. Now, this season is a big test for him as presumably he had a hand in reshaping this roster to his liking. If they fall flat on their face again, the pressure on him should rightfully mount.
Look at the poll man. It is ugly.
That’s my thing. He isn’t infallible, but the expectations are just insane.Holy crap . . .
BTW, I'm not pulling out the party balloons or anything like that, but how in the hell can anyone compare extending Sullivan to Jack Johnson feelings?
Sprong? Yuck. Sprong could have dealt with himself better.During the 2nd playoff run when Phil went off on the bench (Ott series) DK did a piece about the Tochhet and Kessel relationship. Basically saying Tochett knows how to manage him, talk to him, relates well, etc.
As much as I hated on Sully in this thread the Phil thing wasn't all on the head coach. I will however give him tremendous grief for the way he dealt with Cole and Sprong, essentially running THEM out of town
He could have dealt with Sprong & Cole better.
I'm sure Sully reached his breaking point w/ Phil; some justified (not giving 100% during the reg season) , some not (gambling?)
Sprong? Yuck. Sprong could have dealt with himself better.
Cole I agree 100%. I think we pissed away a chance at a 3rd cup with the Brassard deal.
Holy crap . . .
BTW, I'm not pulling out the party balloons or anything like that, but how in the hell can anyone compare extending Sullivan to Jack Johnson feelings?
If you would have said that Mike Sullivan was going to lead us to back to back cups the day he was hired, then you're a liar
If you would have said Dan Bylsma is going to beat the mighty Detroit Red Wings 4 months later, you're also a liar
Point is, Sully was a retread coach at that moment. Dan Bylsma's claim to fame was writing a few books
Successful coaches can come from anywhere. The only true miss you can say under Mario's tenure was Johnston, so it's not like this franchise doesn't know how to pick the right horse
But this franchise fails to know when the horse needs to be put out to pasture. They should have canned Bylsma after the Philly debacle, he lasted 1 more year
Johnston should've been fired in the offseason, again the signs were brutally obvious
Now we have people finally figuring out Sully has lost the room. Would not surprise me if 1 year from today we have a new coach
All of these examples are over 30 years old. Things aren't what they were 30+ years ago. I've already told you this. Scotty Bowman coached a capless Red Wings for eight years and didn't have a dynasty. Now the cap means they won't exist. Things aren't what they were. You need to adapt.
I never made any of those predictions so that’s a moot point. This franchise has had a ton of bad head coaches....Lou Angotti, Gene Ubriaco, Bob Berry, EJ, Mike Johnston to name a few.
That said, I’m curious to know who these “people” are who have figured things out. Are they in the room? Are they in the organization? Or (most likely), some drama queens on a message board who’ve never laced up a pair of skates....