TSN: Subban behind Boyle and Letang for Team Canada

[Camio]

It doesn't happen regularly. It's happened like twice thus far this year and one of the times the guy covering (Eller) made the mistake of staying flat footed instead of backchecking.

PK isn't perfect, neither are any of the Dman talked about as part of team Canada. But if PK isn't part of the best 6-7 Canadian Dman, then where does he rank when involving other Nations?? Does he even crack the top 15??? That's absurd.

Top 4 for Canada will most likely be Weber/Doughty and Keith/Seabrooks. 1st pair would be the shutdown pair (Doughty was dominant in 2010 and he was so young. With Crosby, he was TC's best player.) Seabrooks/Keith on 2nd pair in all likelyhood because they play together with the Hawks and the Olympics are a short tourny. Seabrook isnt as as good as the other guys in the top 3 but he'll likely play 2nd pair minutes for the same reasons Kunitz will likely play on the 1st line with Crosby. They had troubles finding the right wingers for Crosby in 2010, even having to ask him who he wanted as his wingers at some point because they hadnt found any good combinations after a few games. I doubt they wanna go over this again.

TC guys themselves discussed that in interviews during the summer camp so they have to be leaning towards that, otherwise they wouldnt even be bringing this up. Considering its a small tourny and the players this could affect (Kunitz, Seabrooks, possibly St-Louis for example) arent scrubs so its not like TC are shooting for bad players just to have some guys with chemistry.

That would leave PK/Letang for a spot on the 3rd pair and AP/Bou for the other spot on that 3rd pair. Then, they should dress the odd man out between Letang/Subban for the 2nd PP unit. Remember, its 13 forwards and 7 Dmen in the Olympics unlike the 12/6 from the NHL. They can afford a Letang/Subban type guy as 7th for PP duties. Bergeron started as 13th guy in 2010 and ended up in a much bigger role as the tourny progressed.

As a Habs fan, you might not like it, but this is very plausible. Green, who was the top points getter in 2010 (for a couple years) was left off the team for a reason. Many were surprised, yet it was the right decision. You could make an argument he'd have helped on the 2nd PP unit but really, TC is stacked with off talent so its not like they cant put 2 great (and more) PP units on the ice.

They have the luxury of being picking and choosing players based on what they want exactly. They were for a bit more size, while still having mobile guys in 2010. Chances are some of the bigger guys who made the team in 2010 wont be there in 2014. Thats also why Bou's name has been thrown around alot. He's a great skater.

If Subban was american, russian or a sweed, he'll play a much bigger role. Canada happens to have the most depth at forwards and Dman by a big margin compared to any other countries. Remember 2010, that game vs Russia: Canada 3rd and 4th lines utterly dominated Russia's 3rd-4th lines and their 3rd Dmen. Russia dont have the same depth Canada has and it showed big time. Dressing alot of KHL guys to make a political statement didnt quite worked out.

 

[417]

I don't need to get over anything, I'm sure PK will make Team Canada. Makes no sense that he doesn't. But denying that Racism exists (everywhere) is pretty naive.

I used to think this...but I don't anymore.

There's a very present and strong 'old guard' who do not want him to make the team...and there are already built-in excuses being leaked to mask the fact that they just don't want him on the team for reasons which have nothing to do with his ability on the ice.

 

[Lebowski]

Man, Kunitz is awful. I sure hope he won't make Team Canada because of his so-called chemistry with Sid... He's been nothing but a burden to Crosby this season and yet he's still PPG through 13 games.

 

[habtastic]

2nd Canadian Norris trophy winner in 8 years along with a lock for Canada D (Keith)?

Best D-man in the league. Great defensively, great offensively. Extremely quick. Terrific vision. Bomb of a shot. Yeah...he'll totally not make the Olympic team. Oh TSN, how I do not miss you.

 

[WhiskeySeven*]

Is Pietrangelo even that good? I know he's good but is he honestly better than Subban?

I feel like this is all hype because he's a quiet white kid with a high draft position - like JBo

 

[Smokey Thompson]

Man, Kunitz is awful. I sure hope he won't make Team Canada because of his so-called chemistry with Sid... He's been nothing but a burden to Crosby this season and yet he's still PPG through 13 games.

Yet he's somehow ahead of Duchene...

 

[Lebowski]

To be fair and honest with ourselves, Subban hasn't been "great" defensively this season. In the last few games, something seems off with him. I've haven't seen him play this bad in a while. This little cold stretch might have helped Dreger and co. with their senseless opinions... But in the grand scheme of things, Subban should be on Team Canada.

Yet he's somehow ahead of Duchene...

Exactly. For the same reason Boumeester and Seabrook appear to be ahead of Subban on the depth chart. It wouldn't be the first time TC screwed up with its selections.

 

[Avengers*]

It's all the same bullcrap coming out of toronto again to generate buzz and hits. they know if something negative is said about montreal it will create discussions.

I believe both PK Subban and Carey Price will be chosen for the olympics!

 

[habtastic]

Is Pietrangelo even that good? I know he's good but is he honestly better than Subban?

I feel like this is all hype because he's a quiet white kid with a high draft position - like JBo

Pietrangelo IS extremely good. I would say they're equal only because it would seem biased to say what I really think, which is that PK is the best overall D man in the league

But yes, AP should be on the team. Along with PK.

 

[Camio]

Is Pietrangelo even that good? I know he's good but is he honestly better than Subban?

I feel like this is all hype because he's a quiet white kid with a high draft position - like JBo

He's a big part of what St-Louis do on defense. St-Louis has, since Hitch arrived there, finished pretty high in the rankings for goals allowed (didnt they won the Jennings by a fair margin 2 years ago?). This is with several average goalies playing based on who's healthy. AP's been exceptionnal during the playoffs too. Hitch's also on TC.

 

[417]

Just a quick note...Shea Weber is incredibly overrated

In reality, Doughty, Pietrangelo and Subban are better dmen than Weber is...but Weber is the quintessential Canadian-bred defensman, so his spot is assured no matter how much he gets turned around playing D in Nashville.

 

[dmanfish90]

Just a quick note...Shea Weber is incredibly overrated

Huh? How?

 

[Lebowski]

Just a quick note...Shea Weber is incredibly overrated

Yes, yes he is.

Hard slapper, good hitter, big frame... Often leads to a player being overrated.

His defensive game isn't nearly as good as some people pretend.

 

[417]

Huh? How?

He's not the stalwart defensively that he's portrayed to be...he has a big shot and can lay massive hits and he's huge. But in his own zone, he's as much of an adventure as Subban is.

Again, Weber is the quintessential Canadian-bred defensman...this is why he basks in the reputation he has, even though for years, Ryan Suter was the best dman on that team.

 

[Smokey Thompson]

Hard slapper, good hitter, big frame...

Hence Phaneuf looking for $7m+

 

[Camio]

Yet he's somehow ahead of Duchene...

Crosby wants North-South type of linemates. He's the best player in the league. TC want Crosby at his best. This gives them the best chances at Gold.

They tought Nash would be the right winger for Crosby in 2010. It didnt worked. After they exhausted different combinations (didnt they tried Bergeron too? that WJ combination), it ended up with Crosby being asked who he wanted as his wingers, to which he replied Stall and Iginla.

Duchesne isnt that type of player. He's better than Kunitz, no question. Duchesne on a 2nd line or 3rd line will be just fine.

Kunitz goes to the net, has some size and does what Crosby wants him wingers to do. Thats why Dupuis fitted well also with Crosby. Neither are elites players, yet have been getting great results playing with Sid.

There isnt a 2 weeks training camp prior to the games starting so they want, preferably, chemistry from the get-go. Them saying in interviews they dont want some of the stuff that happened in 2010 to happen in 2014, when talking about some line combinations, kinda tells you where they are heading. Then, when asked about Kunitz making the team, they talk about chemistry and the Sid story from 2010.

1+1=2

 

[dmanfish90]

He's not the stalwart defensively that he's portrayed to be...he has a big shot and can lay massive hits and he's huge. But in his own zone, he's as much of an adventure as Subban is.

Again, Weber is the quintessential Canadian-bred defensman...this is why he basks in the reputation he has, even though for years, Ryan Suter was the best dman on that team.

I think you might be right...NSH hasn't been the same since Suter left

 

[Camio]

Just a quick note...Shea Weber is incredibly overrated

In reality, Doughty, Pietrangelo and Subban are better dmen than Weber is...but Weber is the quintessential Canadian-bred defensman, so his spot is assured no matter how much he gets turned around playing D in Nashville.

How you liked Weber when the Habs played the Preds last week? He was the best player on the ice.

Consider that he faced the EGG line all game, he didnt do too poorly. He was also playing with a rookie on his pairing and nobody as forwards (since they pretty much got nobody).

 

[Kriss E]

Top 4 for Canada will most likely be Weber/Doughty and Keith/Seabrooks. 1st pair would be the shutdown pair (Doughty was dominant in 2010 and he was so young. With Crosby, he was TC's best player.) Seabrooks/Keith on 2nd pair in all likelyhood because they play together with the Hawks and the Olympics are a short tourny. Seabrook isnt as as good as the other guys in the top 3 but he'll likely play 2nd pair minutes for the same reasons Kunitz will likely play on the 1st line with Crosby. They had troubles finding the right wingers for Crosby in 2010, even having to ask him who he wanted as his wingers at some point because they hadnt found any good combinations after a few games. I doubt they wanna go over this again.

TC guys themselves discussed that in interviews during the summer camp so they have to be leaning towards that, otherwise they wouldnt even be bringing this up. Considering its a small tourny and the players this could affect (Kunitz, Seabrooks, possibly St-Louis for example) arent scrubs so its not like TC are shooting for bad players just to have some guys with chemistry.

That would leave PK/Letang for a spot on the 3rd pair and AP/Bou for the other spot on that 3rd pair. Then, they should dress the odd man out between Letang/Subban for the 2nd PP unit. Remember, its 13 forwards and 7 Dmen in the Olympics unlike the 12/6 from the NHL. They can afford a Letang/Subban type guy as 7th for PP duties. Bergeron started as 13th guy in 2010 and ended up in a much bigger role as the tourny progressed.

As a Habs fan, you might not like it, but this is very plausible. Green, who was the top points getter in 2010 (for a couple years) was left off the team for a reason. Many were surprised, yet it was the right decision. You could make an argument he'd have helped on the 2nd PP unit but really, TC is stacked with off talent so its not like they cant put 2 great (and more) PP units on the ice.

They have the luxury of being picking and choosing players based on what they want exactly. They were for a bit more size, while still having mobile guys in 2010. Chances are some of the bigger guys who made the team in 2010 wont be there in 2014. Thats also why Bou's name has been thrown around alot. He's a great skater.

If Subban was american, russian or a sweed, he'll play a much bigger role. Canada happens to have the most depth at forwards and Dman by a big margin compared to any other countries. Remember 2010, that game vs Russia: Canada 3rd and 4th lines utterly dominated Russia's 3rd-4th lines and their 3rd Dmen. Russia dont have the same depth Canada has and it showed big time. Dressing alot of KHL guys to make a political statement didnt quite worked out.

I know that you don't consider PK elite, so I'm not gonna waste much time here.

Seabrook does not make my team. Nor does Kunitz. Really? Kunitz? Look at Dupuis. These guys are scoring because they're playing next to the two best players in the world. If the coach has trouble finding players to play with Crosby (the guy that can make any scrapper into a top6 guy) then the coach is the problem, not the players.

If they actually want to focus on getting Left Wingers, Kunitz might have a spot, but that would be Pejorative Slured. Half of the forwards they invited are centers, so they probably don't care about moving centers to the wing. I don't have Kunitz making the top 13.

Mike Green was left off because he played like a forward in Washington. That's why his numbers dropped when he was told to not forget to play defense too.

I doesn't matter what your three pairs are, we're talking about three top pairings and whoever matches the best will get the most minutes. But I don't understand how you have the most productive Canadian Dman since last season both at ES and on the PP play on your 2nd PP pairing. Explain that logic to me.

 

[Lebowski]

Crosby wants North-South type of linemates. He's the best player in the league. TC want Crosby at his best. This gives them the best chances at Gold.

They tought Nash would be the right winger for Crosby in 2010. It didnt worked. After they exhausted different combinations (didnt they tried Bergeron too? that WJ combination), it ended up with Crosby being asked who he wanted as his wingers, to which he replied Stall and Iginla.

Duchesne isnt that type of player. He's better than Kunitz, no question. Duchesne on a 2nd line or 3rd line will be just fine.

Kunitz goes to the net, has some size and does what Crosby wants him wingers to do. Thats why Dupuis fitted well also with Crosby. Neither are elites players, yet have been getting great results playing with Sid.

There isnt a 2 weeks training camp prior to the games starting so they want, preferably, chemistry from the get-go. Them saying in interviews they dont want some of the stuff that happened in 2010 to happen in 2014, when talking about some line combinations, kinda tells you where they are heading. Then, when asked about Kunitz making the team, they talk about chemistry and the Sid story from 2010.

1+1=2

I can see where you're coming from, but I think you're attributing too much of Crosby's success to Kunitz... Sid has always produced at an insane pace regardless of who he played with. Kunitz is legitimately horrible this season, along with Dupuis. Take a peek at the Pens' forum and you'll see what I mean.

I refuse to think there isn't any better option on the wings for TC than Kunitz. I'd try out Stamkos on LW with MSL on the RW. I'd consider giving a shot to Lupul as well (who's twice the player Kunitz is, even if he'd have to play on his off-wing). Taylor Hall or Evander Kane would also be much superior options, in my opinion.

 

[417]

How you liked Weber when the Habs played the Preds last week? He was the best player on the ice.

Consider that he faced the EGG line all game, he didnt do too poorly. He was also playing with a rookie on his pairing and nobody as forwards (since they pretty much got nobody).

I said he's overrated...I didn't say he's garbage.

Also saying he's overrated doesn't mean he can't have great games, i'll admit he looked very good vs. the Habs last week

Doesn't change what I thin about him...he's incredibly overrated because of his profile.

 

[Camio]

I can see where you're coming from, but I think you're attributing too much of Crosby's success to Kunitz... Sid has always produced at an insane pace regardless of who he played with. Kunitz is legitimately horrible this season, along with Dupuis. Take a peek at the Pens' forum and you'll see what I mean.

I refuse to think there isn't any better option on the wings for TC than Kunitz. I'd try out Stamkos on LW with MSL on the RW. I'd consider giving a shot to Lupul as well (who's twice the player Kunitz is, even if he'd have to play on his off-wing). Taylor Hall or Evander Kane would also be much superior options, in my opinion.

Kunitz isnt elite. Nobody said that.

I'm just saying after TC admitted to having problems finding right guys for Sid in 2010, they said they'd try to avoid that in 2014 and would consider other options. Yzerman himself, in an interview, kinda hinted at Kunitz as the front-runner to play with Sid.

There's no denying the start of this season will influence things too.

 

[Lebowski]

Kunitz isnt elite. Nobody said that.

I'm just saying after TC admitted to having problems finding right guys for Sid in 2010, they said they'd try to avoid that in 2014 and would consider other options. Yzerman himself, in an interview, kinda hinted at Kunitz as the front-runner to play with Sid.

There's no denying the start of this season will influence things too.

I know you weren't implying Kunitz was elite. And I know TC are currently considering him to play with Sid... And that's what I find utterly dumb, knowing the kind of options Canada has. Stamkos is pretty much guaranteed to play on the wings because we already have Toews, Tavares, Getzlaf, Bergeron and co for the next 3 lines. A line of Stamkos - Crosby - MSL would be absolutely ridiculous, especially on big ice. I just don't buy the chemistry thing. Crosby can adapt to any winger pretty easily.

 

[habsrock76]

Subban's personality would be the only reason he is left off the team because his play on the ice certainly indicates he should be a lock regardless of his questionable Hockey IQ which is prettly much the only flaw in his game at this point.

If he's disliked or is not respected by many of the the potential TC teamates then that may be reason enough to leave him off.

It'd certainly be a shame because I think he could dominate when surrounded by so much talent.

 

[JayKing]

Is Pietrangelo even that good? I know he's good but is he honestly better than Subban?

I feel like this is all hype because he's a quiet white kid with a high draft position - like JBo

He's not. At most he's as good as P.K. The fact that he plays for St Louis boosts his defensive stats. He's a very good player, but he's seriously overhyped by the media.