Starting A Franchise: Matthews+Marner VS McDavid

[Frank Drebin]

Well I can’t speak for other Leaf fans but obviously Mcdavid is the best regular season player in the Nhl right now. There really is no debate about it

"regular season player"

 

[Hischier and Hughes]

Well this is a blowout I wasnt expecting

 

[La Masse]

"regular season player"

Well at this point he hasnt played enough playoff games to proper evaluate( funny he’s played more rounds then Matthews yet Matthews is labeled by some as a playoff choker). I would personnally still take Sid for one playoff round ahead of Mcdavid

 

[Frank Drebin]

Well at this point he hasnt played enough playoff games to proper evaluate( funny he’s played more rounds then Matthews yet Matthews is labeled by some as a playoff choker). I would personnally still take Sid for one playoff round ahead of Mcdavid

I think the whole "playoff performer" thing is overblown. Either you're a good player or you're not. It was a 7 game sample size with Matthews vs the 140+ he's played.

 

[Oilers Propagandist]

It seems that Oilers fan are getting upset everytime Mcdavid gets compared to another player. He’s a generational player we get that but some fans make it seem like he’s the best thing since slice bread

It is not about Oilers fans getting upset as I and many others find it funny as it is the antithesis of what the OP wanted. The results came completely as expected.

Side note: McDavid >> Sliced bread. You only get to see a player of his caliber play for 20 years then he is done, kaput, retired. Bread will always be there.

 

[Lemontree]

Pastrnak
Gaudreau
Panarin
Tarasenko
Kucherov
Draisatl

I meant 2 players from each draft.....also Panarin wasn't drafted.

 

[Frank Drebin]

I meant 2 players from each draft.....also Panarin wasn't drafted.

?

Excluding the #1 and #2 picks, the #4 overall pick is the second best pick in the draft.

 

[Lemontree]

?

Excluding the #1 and #2 picks, the #4 overall pick is the second best pick in the draft.

A poster stated that Marner level players are available every draft in the top 5 or top 10. I proceeded to list every forward drafted in the top 10 from 2010 to 2016 and let them decide which players are better than Marner. The reality is that Marner level talent players are selected 1st or 2nd each year which shows how much talent he has. I said that excluding the top 2 picks there were only 2 players that I would take over Marner that was selected in those ranges over the past 7 drafts.

So the basis of down playing Marner is saying that he is nothing special of a player and that multiple players of his caliber are available each year, if there are players with similar talent they are chosen 1st or 2nd overall which means that all teams scouting departments would disagree with your assessment that Marner is not or will not become a special type of player.

 

[authentic]

Nah he’s right. Your fan base sucks. Only people left trying to push the narrative that it’s close are TML fans. Time to take the hint and piss off. Mcdavid always has been and always will be a better hockey player than Toronto’s golden boy, and the margin isn’t very slim either.

Did I say otherwise? You guys are whacky man, take a chill pill

 

[ohheyhemsky]

LMAO. What a load of crap this comment is. A tiny portion might have said something like this, but the vast majority do NOT do this at all.

LMAO LOL. Am I doing this right? You're doing a fantastic job of representing your fan base.

 

[PatriceBergeronFan]

A poster stated that Marner level players are available every draft in the top 5 or top 10. I proceeded to list every forward drafted in the top 10 from 2010 to 2016 and let them decide which players are better than Marner. The reality is that Marner level talent players are selected 1st or 2nd each year which shows how much talent he has. I said that excluding the top 2 picks there were only 2 players that I would take over Marner that was selected in those ranges over the past 7 drafts.

So the basis of down playing Marner is saying that he is nothing special of a player and that multiple players of his caliber are available each year, if there are players with similar talent they are chosen 1st or 2nd overall which means that all teams scouting departments would disagree with your assessment that Marner is not or will not become a special type of player.

You are reaching very desperately. No one has said Marner is nothing special; that is laughter worthy.

Why do you not include defensemen as well? I did, after all, say players not forwards of his level are generally picked in the top 5/10 of most drafts.

 

[Varan]

what a pitiful thread

 

[Lemontree]

Give me Connor Mcjesus, as getting a player like him is far far far more difficult then getting someone like Matthews or a Marner.

I get Mcdavid, and I am pretty much set. I will then depend on scouting and drafting, probably tank here and there to acquire my Matthews Marner tier players, which comes by every year. McDavid comes by every 10 years. You guys do the math yourself. You go after the guy that is rare to come by.

I get my Matthews Marner player, I can always get my Marners later on. What?! You guys think he's some sort of something special? get **** ing real.

Matthews Marner level players or that tier of player they are, comes every year. McDavid comes every 15 years. such a easy choice, only a Leafs homer will choose the Leafs combo.

You are reaching very desperately. No one has said Marner is nothing special; that is laughter worthy.

Why do you not include defensemen as well? I did, after all, say players not forwards of his level are generally picked in the top 5/10 of most drafts.

Well at least one person in here said that. How would you fairly compare forwards to Dmen or goalies? Again, unless I am reading what you are saying incorrectly you are saying that Marner level players are a pretty normal occurrence in the top 5 or 10 of most drafts...that is not true.

If most fans are of the opinion that their team holds the #3 to #10 pick in any given draft that they will be able to add a player like Marner they are going to be disappointed more often than not. Do you believe that Mitch Marner is near the top of the following list of players (#3-#10 draft picks)

2010: Erik Gudbranson, Ryan Johansen, Nino Niederreiter, Brett Connolly, Jeff Skinner, Alex Burmistrov, Mikael Granlund, Dylan McIlrath

2011: Jonathan Huberdeau, Adam Larsson, Ryan Strome, Mika Zibanejad, Mark Scheifele, Sean Couturier, Dougie Hamilton, Jonas Brodin

2012: Alex Galchenyuk, Griffin Reinhart, Morgan Rielly, Hampus Lindholm, Mathew Dumba, Derrick Pouliot, Jacob Trouba, Slater Koekkoek

2013: Jonathan Drouin, Seth Jones, Elias Lindholm, Sean Monahan, Darnell Nurse, Rasmus Ristolainen, Bo Horvat, Valeri Nichushkin

2014: Leon Draisaitl, Sam Bennett, Michael Dal Colle, Jake Virtanen, Haydn Fleury, William Nylander, Nikolaj Ehlers, Nick Ritchie

2015: Dylan Strome, Noah Hanifin, Pavel Zacha, Ivan Provorov, Zack Werenski, Timo Meier, Mikko Rantanen

2016: Piere-Luc Dubois, Jesse Puljujarvi, Olli Juolevi, Matthew Tkachuk, Clayton Keller, Alexander Nylander, Mikhail Sergachev, Tyson Jost

None of the forwards listed above have had a better 2 seasons to start their career than Marner has (Keller is entering his 2nd season this year along with other 2016 draftees).

 

[Frank Drebin]

A poster stated that Marner level players are available every draft in the top 5 or top 10. I proceeded to list every forward drafted in the top 10 from 2010 to 2016 and let them decide which players are better than Marner. The reality is that Marner level talent players are selected 1st or 2nd each year which shows how much talent he has. I said that excluding the top 2 picks there were only 2 players that I would take over Marner that was selected in those ranges over the past 7 drafts.

So the basis of down playing Marner is saying that he is nothing special of a player and that multiple players of his caliber are available each year, if there are players with similar talent they are chosen 1st or 2nd overall which means that all teams scouting departments would disagree with your assessment that Marner is not or will not become a special type of player.

Leafs are fortunate to have grabbed Matthews with the 4th OA pick. I just think you're setting out very specific and peculiar criteria

Marner is great, but players like him are picked every year with picks outside of the top 2 picks. Not often, but it happens.

 

[Lemontree]

Leafs are fortunate to have grabbed Matthews with the 4th OA pick. I just think you're setting out very specific and peculiar criteria

Marner is great, but players like him are picked every year with picks outside of the top 2 picks. Not often, but it happens.

So it happens every year but not often?

 

[Frank Drebin]

So it happens every year but not often?

Yes.

2x in 2010 (tarasenko, Kuznetsov)
1x in 2011 (Kucherov, Scheifele)
1x in 2012 (Forsberg)
0x in 2013
1x in 2014 (Draisatl)
1x in 2015 (Boeser)

2016-18 Too early to tell.

 

[ACC1224]

So it happens every year but not often?

All the time it sometimes happens....

 

[PatriceBergeronFan]

Well at least one person in here said that. How would you fairly compare forwards to Dmen or goalies? Again, unless I am reading what you are saying incorrectly you are saying that Marner level players are a pretty normal occurrence in the top 5 or 10 of most drafts...that is not true.

If most fans are of the opinion that their team holds the #3 to #10 pick in any given draft that they will be able to add a player like Marner they are going to be disappointed more often than not. Do you believe that Mitch Marner is near the top of the following list of players (#3-#10 draft picks)

2010: Erik Gudbranson, Ryan Johansen, Nino Niederreiter, Brett Connolly, Jeff Skinner, Alex Burmistrov, Mikael Granlund, Dylan McIlrath

2011: Jonathan Huberdeau, Adam Larsson, Ryan Strome, Mika Zibanejad, Mark Scheifele, Sean Couturier, Dougie Hamilton, Jonas Brodin

2012: Alex Galchenyuk, Griffin Reinhart, Morgan Rielly, Hampus Lindholm, Mathew Dumba, Derrick Pouliot, Jacob Trouba, Slater Koekkoek

2013: Jonathan Drouin, Seth Jones, Elias Lindholm, Sean Monahan, Darnell Nurse, Rasmus Ristolainen, Bo Horvat, Valeri Nichushkin

2014: Leon Draisaitl, Sam Bennett, Michael Dal Colle, Jake Virtanen, Haydn Fleury, William Nylander, Nikolaj Ehlers, Nick Ritchie

2015: Dylan Strome, Noah Hanifin, Pavel Zacha, Ivan Provorov, Zack Werenski, Timo Meier, Mikko Rantanen

2016: Piere-Luc Dubois, Jesse Puljujarvi, Olli Juolevi, Matthew Tkachuk, Clayton Keller, Alexander Nylander, Mikhail Sergachev, Tyson Jost

None of the forwards listed above have had a better 2 seasons to start their career than Marner has (Keller is entering his 2nd season this year along with other 2016 draftees).

I'd say he fits in well with those names aside from obvious disappointments, yes.
If a team is selecting top 5 they damn well expect to pick a player of Marner's level (top pair defenseman, top line forward).

 

[WetcoastOrca]

No, it's the combo of Matthews(franchise player) and Marner(Superstar player), actually.

By a huge margin.

The first 69 point superstar we’ve seen in a while. What do you call the 82 point guys? Generational?
The only thing I agree with you on is that the answer is McDavid by a huge margin.

 

[spiny norman]

Lopsided result.