Stadium Series Jerseys?

Devilsfan992

Registered User
Apr 14, 2012
8,644
3,558
It's still like that. In the mall by me, Champs has Penguins, Rangers, Jets, Giants, Mets, Yankees, Nets, Knicks, and a bunch of random college shirts. In Modell's, I'd say about 80% of the hockey stuff is Rangers. In New Jersey. :shakehead

Where are you from? The one by mean had a bunch of Devils stuff including Devil Stadium Jerseys without the name plate.
 

Baggy Spandex

The Nightman Cometh
Mar 5, 2008
3,986
1
Fake Rangerfanville
At this point I wouldn't be surprised if the logos were given the chrome treatment for this game because of the league, and I also wouldn't be surprised if Lou kept them off the public market because he thinks they're terrible.
 

Scott04

Registered User
Sep 13, 2010
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New Jersey
Lou doesn't run our marketing all by himself. That's why the Devils have a marketing department. In reality, the higher up that has the final say on these things is probably Scott O'Neil anyway. But regardless.... the people in the marketing/licensing departments are the people involved with these things (aside from external pressures/decisions/clearances given by specific sponsors or the league themselves)... Maybe they're to blame for things you all are not happy with... Maybe it's not Lou pissing in everyone's corn flakes every morning... The team's director of marketing did leave within the last year anyway. That could be a cause for some of the "changes" or the fact that some feel they don't do "as much" as they used to.
 

Mory Schneideur*

Guest
Kids always follow a winner - with the Pens have been lately. And so many of their parents and families are Rangers fans, and there's nothing to do about that.

You're oversimplifying a problem and just saying it's status quo. There's more Devils fans now then ever before, and their brand is growing in exciting ways.

For the sake of argument, there's plenty of Devils fans in other markets - what do you think their local team's fans think about that? The same exact thing. Nothing you can do about it.

A simple thing like an action figure, sticker, or other merchandise can easily sway a kid. Like I have said in other threads, my pediatrician friend has plenty of Penguins stickers and band-aids for kids... but zero NJ Devils stuff. In Bergen County. New Jersey. The so-called heart of the Devils market.

The Devils have had this problem as long as I can remember and they will continue to do so until they take some steps other teams have.

In regards to Devils fans in other areas, the odd fan here or there is part of every fan base.

Lets stop looking at everything Devils related with Rosy-colored glasses because the picture some are presenting is far from reality.
 

Scott04

Registered User
Sep 13, 2010
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New Jersey
A simple thing like an action figure, sticker, or other merchandise can easily sway a kid. Like I have said in other threads, my pediatrician friend has plenty of Penguins stickers and band-aids for kids... but zero NJ Devils stuff. In Bergen County. New Jersey. The so-called heart of the Devils market.

The Devils have had this problem as long as I can remember and they will continue to do so until they take some steps other teams have.

In regards to Devils fans in other areas, the odd fan here or there is part of every fan base.

Lets stop looking at everything Devils related with Rosy-colored glasses because the picture some are presenting is far from reality.

Status quo.

Is that the phrase here?
 

Mory Schneideur*

Guest
Status quo.

Is that the phrase here?

Hey man, don't get me wrong. I'm not one of these "sky is falling" types. I'm a passionate fan. This is just 20+ years of frustration built up. I've been a fan since age 5 and its the same old song.

I'm not just venting online for the sake of venting, if anything the ultimate goal would be for a few outspoken and vocal fans who share opinions to get together and to try to reach out to the team.

There is no reason the Devils can't be 2x more popular with some minor effort.

When you see the Red Bull start passing the Devils, you gotta start worrying a bit.
 

Scott04

Registered User
Sep 13, 2010
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New Jersey
Hey man, don't get me wrong. I'm not one of these "sky is falling" types. I'm a passionate fan. This is just 20+ years of frustration built up. I've been a fan since age 5 and its the same old song.

I'm not just venting online for the sake of venting, if anything the ultimate goal would be for a few outspoken and vocal fans who share opinions to get together and to try to reach out to the team.

There is no reason the Devils can't be 2x more popular with some minor effort.

When you see the Red Bull start passing the Devils, you gotta start worrying a bit.

No you don't. You assume the latter because you know nothing about them. They are two sports that have a totally different presence in the sports market in this country. And in the world. They're on two totally different paths and are only drawn together because of geographic proximity (in the case of Red Bulls and Devils) and because there are a few numbers that can be pulled for comparisons (which are often bad metrics, like attendance or revenues, as the two operate on totally different levels)
 

Feed Me A Stray Cat

Registered User
Mar 27, 2005
14,847
144
Boston, MA
A simple thing like an action figure, sticker, or other merchandise can easily sway a kid. Like I have said in other threads, my pediatrician friend has plenty of Penguins stickers and band-aids for kids... but zero NJ Devils stuff. In Bergen County. New Jersey. The so-called heart of the Devils market.

The Devils have had this problem as long as I can remember and they will continue to do so until they take some steps other teams have.

In regards to Devils fans in other areas, the odd fan here or there is part of every fan base.

Lets stop looking at everything Devils related with Rosy-colored glasses because the picture some are presenting is far from reality.

I became a Devils fan because I liked their logo when I was five or six, so this can definitely be true.
 

Mory Schneideur*

Guest
I became a Devils fan because I liked their logo when I was five or six, so this can definitely be true.

Me too :laugh:

I keep going back to the pediatrics story, but these are literally dozens of kids who will grow up to be Penguins fans. They come back asking for more Penguins stickers & when they don't have those, they get Rangers stickers. -__-

From what I'm told, these kids act like its Christmas from getting a simple sticker. Why Devils stickers are not available in NJ to markets where hockey stickers are being sold to little kids is beyond me. Its simple, its stupid, its effective.

By the way, who will feed the kids and their obsessive fascination once the seed is planted, the parents of course! This is how you could get entire families to come to the games.

Why? Within 5 years soccer will be bigger in every US market except Boston and DC and that's only because those two MLS teams are terribly ran.

Right but remember what a joke the MLS was when it started? How poorly soccer was received in the US? What a joke the MetroStars were relative to the big 4-league teams here in the NYC area?

Well, they changed their marketing strategy and bam... success. If they stayed Status Quo like Lou's recipe for marketing success, there is no doubt in my mind that they wouldn't nearly have even a 1/10th of the successful growth they are seeing now.

Oh, I would love to add that giving Red Bulls fans the cold shoulder at Devils games was pure genius :sarcasm: (I'm referring to the load of fans from Viking Nation & South Ward that wanted to join us at Rock but were treated poorly and felt unwanted by the org).
 

Scott04

Registered User
Sep 13, 2010
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New Jersey
Me too :laugh:

I keep going back to the pediatrics story, but these are literally dozens of kids who will grow up to be Penguins fans. They come back asking for more Penguins stickers & when they don't have those, they get Rangers stickers. -__-

From what I'm told, these kids act like its Christmas from getting a simple sticker. Why Devils stickers are not available in NJ to markets where hockey stickers are being sold to little kids is beyond me. Its simple, its stupid, its effective.

By the way, who will feed the kids and their obsessive fascination once the seed is planted, the parents of course! This is how you could get entire families to come to the games.



Right but remember what a joke the MLS was when it started? How poorly soccer was received in the US? What a joke the MetroStars were relative to the big 4-league teams here in the NYC area?

Well, they changed their marketing strategy and bam... success. If they stayed Status Quo like Lou's recipe for marketing success, there is no doubt in my mind that they wouldn't nearly have even a 1/10th of the successful growth they are seeing now.

Oh, I would love to add that giving Red Bulls fans the cold shoulder at Devils games was pure genius :sarcasm: (I'm referring to the load of fans from Viking Nation & South Ward that wanted to join us at Rock but were treated poorly and felt unwanted by the org).


The two cannot be compared though. You're comparing a league that is 18 years old to a league that is almost 100 years old. And the popularity of soccer world wide is going to do a huge amount to drive up a league in a country with such a diverse population once the talent pool grows to a respectable level. That's what you're seeing now.
 

Mory Schneideur*

Guest
The two cannot be compared though. You're comparing a league that is 18 years old to a league that is almost 100 years old. And the popularity of soccer world wide is going to do a huge amount to drive up a league in a country with such a diverse population once the talent pool grows to a respectable level. That's what you're seeing now.

Hockey and soccer are similar on many levels, so much so, that many Red Bulls fans wanted to become Devils hardcores, until the Devils pulling out the welcome mat stopped that.
 

Scott04

Registered User
Sep 13, 2010
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New Jersey
Hockey and soccer are similar on many levels, so much so, that many Red Bulls fans wanted to become Devils hardcores, until the Devils pulling out the welcome mat stopped that.

That has nothing to do with similarities. That just means there are people that enjoy sports and want to get involved in another one. The economic landscapes of the two sports could not be more different. You see the post a few above this comparing the two league revenues? While that stat is being used way out of context for his argument, it's very valid to go against what you're trying to theorize here. Growth in one of those sports is in no way an indication of a path/method/probability of similar growth in the other sport.
 

Mory Schneideur*

Guest
That has nothing to do with similarities. That just means there are people that enjoy sports and want to get involved in another one. The economic landscapes of the two sports could not be more different. You see the post a few above this comparing the two league revenues? While that stat is being used way out of context for his argument, it's very valid to go against what you're trying to theorize here. Growth in one of those sports is in no way an indication of a path/method/probability of similar growth in the other sport.

Alright, how about this. What are your suggestions? What do you say we should change/keep the same regarding off-ice aspects?
 

DatBoyJPP

Good Night
Jul 30, 2009
19,799
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Blairstown
Statements like this...:shakehead

MLS annual revenue is like $300 million. NHL annual revenue is $3.5 billion.

Ah yes, the old money debate. I guess the NFL isn't popular then because 3 of the 4 playoff games this weekend aren't going to sell out.

MLS doesn't price its fans out. You can get club leavel season tickets for the Red Bulls for the cost of 4 club seats to a Devils game.
 

Feed Me A Stray Cat

Registered User
Mar 27, 2005
14,847
144
Boston, MA
Ah yes, the old money debate. I guess the NFL isn't popular then because 3 of the 4 playoff games this weekend aren't going to sell out.

MLS doesn't price its fans out. You can get club leavel season tickets for the Red Bulls for the cost of 4 club seats to a Devils game.

Not sure whether you're trolling me here.

The NFL has annual revenue of over $9 billion.

A professional sports teams will charge ticket prices that more or less meet demand - the reason the Red Bulls don't charge Devils ticket prices is because they can't.

Additionally, much of the revenue from a sport comes from TV deals, which are all about what how much people watch.

Revenue is a very good reflection of interest level in the sport.
 

Scott04

Registered User
Sep 13, 2010
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New Jersey
Alright, how about this. What are your suggestions? What do you say we should change/keep the same regarding off-ice aspects?

First, the biggest factor above all else is going to be winning, which can't be controlled by off-ice stuff. The team wins, people jump aboard (see how easily they moved tickets for the playoff run a couple years back, even as prices skyrocketed by the finals). The team wins, people stop complaining about minor to medium level things. It's a trickle down. Why are all of these complaints coming up repeatedly this year? Because the team sucked last year and hasn't taken the league by storm this year either. Most of these aren't "new" things.


In regards to fixing any off-ice issues... its complicated, because again, not everything is solely up to them. The top thing which they need to resume/pick up again is fan engagement. Easiest way to do that is social media. They made great strides and I think it took a step back. That's probably largely to do with the former Director of Marketing leaving within the last year (as he was spearheading much of their social media involvement in recent years) to go do social media for the Mets. Best thing about social media for a sports team is that it gives them a voice/face. Use that to interact directly with fans and it goes a long way. It becomes a source for feedback, both positive and negative, and makes fans feel the team is more approachable.

Take the Diablos, destroy the entire thing, and start from scratch. The idea in theory isn't bad. It's current execution is. Changing/fixing a few things will be a band-aid on a giant wound. Tear it all down. Start over again with a better, more definitive vision of what this group should be, and then make it happen. And I'm not saying this should be done without fan involvement. But it should be a few specific individuals, or a group of 5-10 as the "management" of sorts for any supporters group/groups.

Ignore the crap about the goal song. People will always find something to complain about. Those who still care are too stubborn to ever win over. If they want to change it, feel free, but do it in the off-season, make a poll with 5-10 choices, without the old song being in the mix, and go from there. Who cares. But constantly re-visiting it serves no purpose, bringing back the old one serves no purpose, harping on this serves no purpose, etc. The general solution here is make sure the employees in charge of game presentation site down and really assess what they have in their script on a regular basis, take out old things that don't work. Put in new things to try to mix things up. This means everything everything. Video bits, audio choices, promos and contests, etc.

Better sponsorship relations. This is what Scott O'Neil will largely be involved with. This is his specialty. If this is what he is doing here, it will be fine in time. But it can't be ignored or put on the back burner. Sponsorship deals will lead to better/additional promo items and benefits to fans. They'll enjoy it, as stupid of a thing as it may seem.

Figure out ticket prices. Consolidate some zones (way too many price points for the average fan to make sense of). Assess some numbers of what sells, what sells to individual game buyers, what sells to full seasons, what doesn't sell at all. Lower some STH prices a bit. Lower individual game prices, but not by as drastic of a percentage as full seasons. Create a bigger gap between the two. Allows for a bigger cushion for a STH to sell their tickets where they can get their money back, but potentially keeping it low enough that people will buy them on the secondary market. This still does create demand for tickets (on a secondary market), which will make it a little more worthwhile for people to own season tickets since they know they can sell them. The big ticket games will likely sell at a premium over face, and so will playoff tickets if they don't break the structure to try to capitalize pricing options on those. Like always, if the team wins and gets that far, its great for the season ticket holder.

And the one thing to add about season ticket holders... go back to making it about "the experience." All of these meet the team events, special access opportunities and what not is the non-monetary value associated with owning tickets. Yes, many people may get a little burned out when you have the same events every year, especially the basic ones. But they'll be far more pissed having them eliminated than repetitive. Work on keeping them fresh as you go, but keep them there. "Owning the same seat for every game" isn't a perk any more. Events, access, perks, and tangible items that aren't given to non-STHs provides some exclusivity/incentive/sense of being valued. That's what people want. They can spend a few hours at the DMV to be treated like **** for far less money.

Pay the operations people more money. Never seen an Ops staff for any building that hasn't been overworked, underpaid, and underappreciated.




...... There. Happy?
 

Scott04

Registered User
Sep 13, 2010
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New Jersey
Not sure whether you're trolling me here.

The NFL has annual revenue of over $9 billion.

A professional sports teams will charge ticket prices that more or less meet demand - the reason the Red Bulls don't charge Devils ticket prices is because they can't.

Additionally, much of the revenue from a sport comes from TV deals, which are all about what how much people watch.

Revenue is a very good reflection of interest level in the sport.

Revenue relative to expenses. Not pure revenue figures. The MLS is weird because attendance is great (pure numbers, percentages for attendances, whichever). TV viewership is not. And this is the exact same excuse that would be used to defend the NHL compared to the NBA, or MLB. It's not a tell-all about interest in a sport. Just a dollar figure that doesn't tell the whole story.
 

BigBlueAndRed

Registered User
Apr 15, 2012
895
45
I'm removing parts of your posts to slim down this reply. I apologize in advance if you felt I removed a piece that helped make your point.

Two of your ideas I disagree with:

First, the biggest factor above all else is going to be winning, which can't be controlled by off-ice stuff. The team wins, people jump aboard (see how easily they moved tickets for the playoff run a couple years back, even as prices skyrocketed by the finals).

If the team had a more loyal fan base, winning would be less of an issue. Look at the Packers, their fans have sold out for generations even though they were dogs from the 1970s-1990s. I realize Green Bay is more of a special case since it's the only major sport in town. If we want to switch to a town with more than one team, another example is the Chicago Cubs. Their team hasn't won in over 100 years; yet their stadium still is still close to capacity even in down years and above average relative to the league. Loyal fans stick by their team in good times and bad when they've established that ingrained connection.

This is why Johnyrocket is trying to think of ideas to get people more involved outside the game experience. Building and engaging fan loyalty should be the biggest factor for any team including ours, that way fan attendance doesn't disappear during down years.

The top thing which they need to resume/pick up again is fan engagement. Easiest way to do that is social media. They made great strides and I think it took a step back. ... Best thing about social media for a sports team is that it gives them a voice/face.

You have to be careful with this. How many of the fans are you going to reach with this? Social media demographics tend to indicate that the users skew younger for most social networks.

We've seen that the Devils are now targeting families with their efforts (ie, the goal song change), so why would they want to focus their efforts in this direction when it's not representative of their target demographic? You'll reach plenty of fans who are young and don't have disposable income, but what value is that? You have already stated that it's the "wrong spot".
 

DatBoyJPP

Good Night
Jul 30, 2009
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Blairstown
Pay the operations people more money. Never seen an Ops staff for any building that hasn't been overworked, underpaid, and underappreciated.

...... There. Happy?

eIeOWjl.gif
 

Scott04

Registered User
Sep 13, 2010
6,742
0
New Jersey
I'm removing parts of your posts to slim down this reply. I apologize in advance if you felt I removed a piece that helped make your point.

Two of your ideas I disagree with:



If the team had a more loyal fan base, winning would be less of an issue. Look at the Packers, their fans have sold out for generations even though they were dogs from the 1970s-1990s. I realize Green Bay is more of a special case since it's the only major sport in town. If we want to switch to a town with more than one team, another example is the Chicago Cubs. Their team hasn't won in over 100 years; yet their stadium still is still close to capacity even in down years and above average relative to the league. Loyal fans stick by their team in good times and bad when they've established that ingrained connection.

This is why Johnyrocket is trying to think of ideas to get people more involved outside the game experience. Building and engaging fan loyalty should be the biggest factor for any team including ours, that way fan attendance doesn't disappear during down years.



You have to be careful with this. How many of the fans are you going to reach with this? Social media demographics tend to indicate that the users skew younger for most social networks.

We've seen that the Devils are now targeting families with their efforts (ie, the goal song change), so why would they want to focus their efforts in this direction when it's not representative of their target demographic? You'll reach plenty of fans who are young and don't have disposable income, but what value is that? You have already stated that it's the "wrong spot".

First, about the loyalty part.... Those are both special exceptions. You're talking about two of the oldest franchises in their respective sports. The Packers are almost 100 years old. The Cubs are over 140 years old. Why do the Rangers have this sense about them of being this great history, and without factoring in the suits that roam the place these days, such a die-hard fan base? Because of their age. Not because of their "winning history." If you want to make a comparison, you're looking at teams like the Blues or Sharks. Or in baseball the Astros or the Mariners, none of which are known for this untouchable fan base that never wavers. Fan stability that can succeed beyond performance comes with age. You can still ruin it if you do other things wrong (a lot of them can stem from ownership or specific personnel) , but that's usually the key for teams that have a more durable fan base.

As for the second part: you're thinking too small of a segment that social media reaches. How many people are on facebook/how many are on twitter? Yes, newer, more emerging social media entities are loaded with younger early adopters. That's not the debate, as those are the sources with more limited user bases. Lets not act like facebook and twitter is only used to engage with people under the age of 24. How many people in their 30s and 40s are readily active on social media? A lot more than you think... Facebook started opened up around 10 years ago.... It's not only high school and college kids anymore as many people stuck with it, and many opted in after it opened up. This targets younger people, it targets families, it can target middle aged people. Don't underestimate the adoption of technology amongst a large variety of people.

And on top of that... make up your mind. Everyone here complains about targeting families so that they could target the youth, build roots, and one day they'll have families that will be raised Devils fans... Forget about the logic behind bypassing the people with spending power now to get them down the road that has been used before... Why wouldn't you want to get in touch with all of these groups? This is a common uniting factor. And one readily available to so many people in real-time.
 

Kurt Cobain

Registered User
Mar 30, 2004
5,947
258
Ah yes, the old money debate. I guess the NFL isn't popular then because 3 of the 4 playoff games this weekend aren't going to sell out.

MLS doesn't price its fans out. You can get club leavel season tickets for the Red Bulls for the cost of 4 club seats to a Devils game.


MLS is not surpassing the NHL anytime soon. Soccer/football as a whole may surpass hockey sooner than later when you consider how big the European soccer has gotten over here. I'm one of those people who refuse to watch the MLS and well only watch the highest level of soccer there is and im not the only one.
 

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