TSN: Some Powerful Words from Bob Mackenzie about Liljgren and Sandin

[Mess]

For a couple of years now, I knew we needed to replace 3 dmen.

Gardiner, Hainsey and Zaitsev OUT and hopefully 3 new Dmen IN preferably all RHD.

Rielly ---- New Guy
Muzzin -- New Guy
Rosen --- New Guy
Holl

Dermott (injured)

 

[gravyface]

Gardiner, Hainsey and Zaitsev OUT and hopefully 3 new Dmen IN preferably all RHD.

Rielly ---- New Guy
Muzzin -- New Guy
Rosen --- New Guy
Holl

Dermott (injured)

I'd like them to take a run at Stralman as a potentially inexpensive Zaitsev replacement with Muzzin.

 

[Its not your fault]

For a couple of years now, I knew we needed to replace 3 dmen.

And then,....?

 

[Pyrophorus]

And then,....?

See if the defence improves: less being pinned in, less shots allowed, quicker breakouts, opposing players eating pine, etc

 

[Its not your fault]

See if the defence improves: less being pinned in, less shots allowed, quicker breakouts, opposing players eating pine, etc

I hope for much of the same! That would be some good much needed improvement.

 

[Man Bear Pig]

I'd like them to take a run at Stralman as a potentially inexpensive Zaitsev replacement with Muzzin.

Will Stralman be cheap though? I'd love to have him back but a good top 4 experienced RHD on the open market may not come as cheap as we'd hope. I think he'd pair nicely with Rielly too.

 

[Pucker77]

If Liljegren is going to play 3rd pair minutes for the Leafs, I would rather him play top 2 or at worst top 4 minutes with the Marlies. The Leafs are going to have to start being forward thinking because once all the core gets paid, they will have to exploit cheap young talent. No point in wasting a year of Liljegren's contract on 13-15 minutes a night.

The same goes for Sandin, but in the Minors, he at least can have his contract slide another year where Lilly cant.

I have no problem with them getting a sniff in the Preseason and a few games as a reward and as injury replacement's but unless either proves capable of playing top 4 minutes with the Leafs I would rather than feast on the AHL.

And if I am Dubas, I would not base my summer decisions on having Lilly or Sandin on the Leafs.

 

[waingr0]

If Liljegren is going to play 3rd pair minutes for the Leafs, I would rather him play top 2 or at worst top 4 minutes with the Marlies. The Leafs are going to have to start being forward thinking because once all the core gets paid, they will have to exploit cheap young talent. No point in wasting a year of Liljegren's contract on 13-15 minutes a night.

The same goes for Sandin, but in the Minors, he at least can have his contract slide another year where Lilly cant.

I have no problem with them getting a sniff in the Preseason and a few games as a reward and as injury replacement's but unless either proves capable of playing top 4 minutes with the Leafs I would rather than feast on the AHL.

And if I am Dubas, I would not base my summer decisions on having Lilly or Sandin on the Leafs.

Gotta love the salary cap.

 

[Nylander88]

I'd love to get Adam McQuaid cheap for a righty on the bottom pairing. Especially at the start of the year when we will likely be without Dermott in the lineup.

Rielly- ?Trade?
Muzzin-Hainsey(resigned)
Rosen-McQuaid

When Dermott comes back, he takes whoever is the weak link out. Rosen or McQuaid. McQuaid after being traded to Columbus didn't get to play much. So he may come cheap/provide depth and toughness. And if he's a healthy scratch here and there when everyone is in, so be it.

 

[ottomaddox]

I'd love to get Adam McQuaid cheap for a righty on the bottom pairing. Especially at the start of the year when we will likely be without Dermott in the lineup.

Rielly- ?Trade?
Muzzin-Hainsey(resigned)
Rosen-McQuaid

When Dermott comes back, he takes whoever is the weak link out. Rosen or McQuaid. McQuaid after being traded to Columbus didn't get to play much. So he may come cheap/provide depth and toughness. And if he's a healthy scratch here and there when everyone is in, so be it.

How was McQuaid in the playoffs? Wait! Don't answer that.

 

[diceman934]

Rielly was drafted in 2012, spent one season in the minors, then was a full time NHL player.

Development is different for every single prospect, but I don’t think it’s unreasonable to suggest at least one of the two young defensemen could play meaningful minutes next season, especially considering both have logged considerable pro level minutes, something that’s Rielly did not prior to joining the Leafs.

I like Bob, but I don’t find his perspective the most powerful.

Also, outside of Lil and Sandin, we have other D who definitely could push for a spot.

Rielly never spent a year in the minors.

 

[Its not your fault]

I'd love to get Adam McQuaid cheap for a righty on the bottom pairing. Especially at the start of the year when we will likely be without Dermott in the lineup.

Rielly- ?Trade?
Muzzin-Hainsey(resigned)
Rosen-McQuaid

When Dermott comes back, he takes whoever is the weak link out. Rosen or McQuaid. McQuaid after being traded to Columbus didn't get to play much. So he may come cheap/provide depth and toughness. And if he's a healthy scratch here and there when everyone is in, so be it.

One year contract sure. 3 year nope 2 year nope all filler now should be one year prove it deals.

 

[MoreMogilny]

Rielly never spent a year in the minors.

I’m referring to the CHL, sorry. His post-draft season.

 

[diceman934]

I’m referring to the CHL, sorry. His post-draft season.

Yes as he missed almost his whole draft year with a knee injury. He played around 18 games in his draft year.

 

[Pyrophorus]

Gotta love the salary cap.

More worried about the expansion draft
Why is Lindgren available for it?

 

[Pyrophorus]

If Liljegren is going to play 3rd pair minutes for the Leafs, I would rather him play top 2 or at worst top 4 minutes with the Marlies. The Leafs are going to have to start being forward thinking because once all the core gets paid, they will have to exploit cheap young talent. No point in wasting a year of Liljegren's contract on 13-15 minutes a night.

The same goes for Sandin, but in the Minors, he at least can have his contract slide another year where Lilly cant.

I have no problem with them getting a sniff in the Preseason and a few games as a reward and as injury replacement's but unless either proves capable of playing top 4 minutes with the Leafs I would rather than feast on the AHL.

And if I am Dubas, I would not base my summer decisions on having Lilly or Sandin on the Leafs.

The long term vision (not this season), is to have those 5 kids show something.

 

[LeafsOHLRangers98]

More worried about the expansion draft
Why is Lindgren available for it?

He was on a loan this year which burned the first year of his ELC as he was not an underage player. Next year would be year two of that ELC.

 

[The Hanging Jowl]

And then,....?

 

[DarkKnight]

If Liljegren is going to play 3rd pair minutes for the Leafs, I would rather him play top 2 or at worst top 4 minutes with the Marlies. The Leafs are going to have to start being forward thinking because once all the core gets paid, they will have to exploit cheap young talent. No point in wasting a year of Liljegren's contract on 13-15 minutes a night.

The same goes for Sandin, but in the Minors, he at least can have his contract slide another year where Lilly cant.

I have no problem with them getting a sniff in the Preseason and a few games as a reward and as injury replacement's but unless either proves capable of playing top 4 minutes with the Leafs I would rather than feast on the AHL.

And if I am Dubas, I would not base my summer decisions on having Lilly or Sandin on the Leafs.

I'd argue 13 minutes in the NHL has way more value to ultimate development than 22 minutes in the minors. Hardly a waste, and most young D men start on the third pairing as they learn, a natural progression. These kids aren't starting in the top 4.

 

[Bluelines]

..and Bob , some people said Dermott was not ready for the NHL game. In some aspects the NHL game is more predictable than the AHL game, you might see Lilly come up and not be out of place, it really depends on how quickly he can adjust to the NHL systems. The thing working for him is if he does come up he will come up to a new defenceman coach, might be good to start day one with the new coach.

 

[Crease Master]

I'd argue 13 minutes in the NHL has way more value to ultimate development than 22 minutes in the minors. Hardly a waste, and most young D men start on the third pairing as they learn, a natural progression. These kids aren't starting in the top 4.

Yeah, until the kid gets repeatedly torched and then stapled to the bench by Babcock resulting in a complete lack of confidence. Maybe you should be the Edmonton development coach, your ideas on player development mesh quite well.

 

[DarkKnight]

Yeah, until the kid gets repeatedly torched and then stapled to the bench by Babcock resulting in a complete lack of confidence. Maybe you should be the Edmonton development coach, your ideas on player development mesh quite well.

Yeah, kids usually start with 22 minutes a night on D. Such a nonsense retort. That's why you start against other teams lesser lines is you don't get torched and gain confidence. Man did we ever ruin Dermott too right, with that exact same path. Again, nonsense you spew. Bye.

 

[ULF_55]

Will Stralman be cheap though? I'd love to have him back but a good top 4 experienced RHD on the open market may not come as cheap as we'd hope. I think he'd pair nicely with Rielly too.

And yet some have the Leafs paying for a team to take one.

Bait .... click

 

[HoweHullOrr]

Gardiner, Hainsey and Zaitsev OUT and hopefully 3 new Dmen IN preferably all RHD.

Rielly ---- New Guy
Muzzin -- New Guy
Rosen --- New Guy
Holl

Dermott (injured)

And yet some have the Leafs paying for a team to take one.

Bait .... click

I think your talking about Zaitsev (?). If recent rumors are to be believed, the return would be a 3rd, a B prospect, and a #6 defender. That sounds about right. Its a "return", just not a spectacular one.

And, more importantly, we have three (3) holes to fill on the blueline, or 2 if we get a #6 RD back from the Zaitsev trade. That's still a big concern and gives Dubas lots of work (& worry) this summer.

 

[81Leafs50]

Yesterday on TSN Overdrive Hour 3 Bob Mackenzie responding to the Zaitsev situation:

"Leaf Fans are saying: "just bring up Liljgren, just bring up Sandin, bring up Rosen...

My understanding of the situation is that there is no guarantee whatsoever. And I think it's a reach to suggest Timothy Liljgren and especially Rasmus Sandin. These guys are not NHL ready. Not prime time ready...

...if you remove Gardiner, Hainsey, and now Zaitsev. You tell me: who's replacing them? If it's Calle Rosen then that's fine but you better find some other people that can play defense "



What do you think of this? Do you agree? Are Sandin and Liljgren too far away in their development?

I think many people see this Zaitsev request as a blessing, but replacing 3 main D-players is going to be a massive undertaking. Instead of tinkering with the Roster to go deep into the playoffs, Dubas has to fill large holes.

Sandin and Liljegren were supposed to be brought up this season to get games but injuries derailed those plans so who knows. I think these two kids are more NHL ready than people think.

No one thought Moore, Johnsson and Kapanen were NHL ready until they played so lets see what happens this season.

I personally would no be afraid to play both in the top 6 to start the season. Leafs arent contenders so lets see what the kids got.