Value of: Slava Voynov’s rights

[Motte and Bailey]

What would your team offer LA for his rights?

What would LA fans accept in a trade for his rights?

I will start the bidding at two 2nds from the Canucks.

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[WingsMJN2965]

I'd give up a 1st for Voynov under the condition that he has to do five, 5 minute rounds with Cris Cyborg.

 

[tomd]

He has zero value until the NHL clears him and announces the length of any suspension they may levy.

 

[BatVader]

I’d offer a 1st on the condition his visa is revoked and he’s deported and refused any and all future permits to play in the NHL.

 

[Starat327]

Ah, another thread for the internet warriors to come in and talk about doling out their 'street justice' to Voynov.

His value is minimal, if any, at this point. Until he gets officially cleared to play, has his visas secured, and any supplementary NHL discipline decided, the risk isn't worth much to another team.

If all goes well and he's cleared? Whats a top pair RHD cost on the open market? That'll be his value.

 

[Randy Randerson]

Ah, another thread for the internet warriors to come in and talk about doling out their 'street justice' to Voynov.

His value is minimal, if any, at this point. Until he gets officially cleared to play, has his visas secured, and any supplementary NHL discipline decided, the risk isn't worth much to another team.

If all goes well and he's cleared? Whats a top pair RHD cost on the open market? That'll be his value.

really think he's a top pairing player? His relatives really make his career look like 2nd year Nikita Zaitsev on a good team

 

[mouser]

What would your team offer LA for his rights?

What would LA fans accept in a trade for his rights?

I will start the bidding at two 2nds from the Canucks.

I'm not certain LA can even trade his rights at this time.

 

[Starat327]

really think he's a top pairing player? His relatives really make his career look like 2nd year Nikita Zaitsev on a good team

I dont think he could lead a top pair, but i think he'd be an amazing support player. I think he'd look tremendous next to Morgan on the leafs, for example.

Worst Case, we'll call him a #3 RHD.

To your point on Zaitsev - and im not saying you said this, and it might not even be the right year - but i remember a lot of leafs fans claiming Zaitsev played like a top pair in one year. Was that the year in question (im admittedly not familiar with zaitsevs progression/stats)?

 

[Jumptheshark]

Milan lucic, Kris Russell and Sekera all for Voyanov and then we trade him for a 3rd

 

[BatVader]

Ah, another thread for the internet warriors to come in and talk about doling out their 'street justice' to Voynov.

His value is minimal, if any, at this point. Until he gets officially cleared to play, has his visas secured, and any supplementary NHL discipline decided, the risk isn't worth much to another team.

If all goes well and he's cleared? Whats a top pair RHD cost on the open market? That'll be his value.

Ah, another thread for all the fans who value a trivial trophy won by a team they don’t even play on, to come in and talk about how winnng is superior to morals.

 

[StuckOutHere]

Ah, another thread for the internet warriors to come in and talk about doling out their 'street justice' to Voynov.

His value is minimal, if any, at this point. Until he gets officially cleared to play, has his visas secured, and any supplementary NHL discipline decided, the risk isn't worth much to another team.

If all goes well and he's cleared? Whats a top pair RHD cost on the open market? That'll be his value.

Nope, I think some of us just believe in the moral integrity of the league, but nice try!

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

I dont think he could lead a top pair, but i think he'd be an amazing support player. I think he'd look tremendous next to Morgan on the leafs, for example.

Worst Case, we'll call him a #3 RHD.

To your point on Zaitsev - and im not saying you said this, and it might not even be the right year - but i remember a lot of leafs fans claiming Zaitsev played like a top pair in one year. Was that the year in question (im admittedly not familiar with zaitsevs progression/stats)?

This. When he left, he had a claim to be maybe a low-end #1 but he never would have had a chance at that role with Drew in the top spot. I do think he's a little too small for it--think Sekera--as the wear and tear and big minutes could kill him. But I think he'd be a phenomenal #2 or could run the 2nd pairing as one of the best 3ds in the league. But he can play in all situations.

I imagine if he gets traded there will be a whole lot of conditions on the picks. He has potential high value as a player--especially as an RHD--so he won't go for peanuts, but there's obviously a lot of baggage.

Him and Shattenkirk were pretty equal when they left--Voynov being the maybe better defensively of the two, Shatty being the more dynamic offensively--so while I woudn't expect that same return due to the situation, I think high picks and good prospects would likely do it.

Ah, another thread for all the fans who value a trivial trophy won by a team they don’t even play on, to come in and talk about how winnng is superior to morals.

"We'll trade a 1st for justice" is a worthless gesture for some internet "character" points and doesn't contribute anything to discussion no matter what your morals say.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

I'm not certain LA can even trade his rights at this time.

That's what I thought. I read articles that said he was the same as Kovalchuk, but at the same time it was Kovalchuk who made the decision to move on. I thought it was treated as a mutual termination (meaning LA does not have to pay the cap or money remaining, but they lose the rights to him regardless of where he ends up; like the Leafs and Marchenko last year), but in this case Voynov does not have the right to veto the termination on his end because of his domestic abuse charge. Therefore, LA chose to go through with it on their end and got the contract entirely off of their books, but now they do not get to reap the benefits of keeping his rights.

Or for the same sort of thing, LA did not keep Mike Richards' rights after they terminated his contract for breaking the law himself. Washington was able to sign him outright.

 

[GagneHanson12]

Title made me think of

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

That's what I thought. I read articles that said he was the same as Kovalchuk, but at the same time it was Kovalchuk who made the decision to move on. I thought it was treated as a mutual termination (meaning LA does not have to pay the cap or money remaining, but they lose the rights to him regardless of where he ends up; like the Leafs and Marchenko last year), but in this case Voynov does not have the right to veto the termination on his end because of his domestic abuse charge. Therefore, LA chose to go through with it on their end and got the contract entirely off of their books, but now they do not get to reap the benefits of keeping his rights.

IIRC, when he left his contract was "tolled" and he was treated like a defector, hence LA still has his rights. I just can't imagine a guy with pending discipline could be traded, but even if he could, it's most likely that he WOULDNT be traded as who knows what his eventual fate is? The NHL could even ban him for life and the trading team would be left holding nothing.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

IIRC, when he left his contract was "tolled" and he was treated like a defector, hence LA still has his rights. I just can't imagine a guy with pending discipline could be traded, but even if he could, it's most likely that he WOULDNT be traded as who knows what his eventual fate is? The NHL could even ban him for life and the trading team would be left holding nothing.

Besides going to the KHL, how is it any different than what LA did with Richards though? Would LA have kept Richards' rights if he had gone to the KHL?

 

[Randy Randerson]

I dont think he could lead a top pair, but i think he'd be an amazing support player. I think he'd look tremendous next to Morgan on the leafs, for example.

Worst Case, we'll call him a #3 RHD.

To your point on Zaitsev - and im not saying you said this, and it might not even be the right year - but i remember a lot of leafs fans claiming Zaitsev played like a top pair in one year. Was that the year in question (im admittedly not familiar with zaitsevs progression/stats)?

I think there was a lot of hope on Zaitsev, who was played in the #2 role in his rookie year and was a little out of his depth but didn't get buried like Santini, that he would take a step forward in his 2nd year and be passable as a #2D. It went the other way for sure in his 2nd year, so I think there was a lot of backtracking on that opinion by those who had it. I don't believe he thinks fast enough to be a top pairing guy, but I could see him being a good 2nd pairing guy

I do think Voynov is an upgrade on the Leafs' situation, if he was a real #2 I would do it if he agreed to things that would show he was remorseful (counselling, voluntary advocacy against that kind of violence, etc) but I think he falls into the Petry tier so I'd prefer to just do that in trade

 

[mouser]

IIRC, when he left his contract was "tolled" and he was treated like a defector, hence LA still has his rights. I just can't imagine a guy with pending discipline could be traded, but even if he could, it's most likely that he WOULDNT be traded as who knows what his eventual fate is? The NHL could even ban him for life and the trading team would be left holding nothing.

I don't think it was reported at the time Voynov left, however there was an article from a few months ago claiming that Voynov had officially retired from the NHL as part of his departure settlement. I didn't see any report that LA tolled his contracts, by all accounts the contract has been voided. If that's all accurate then his rights would be handled in a similar fashion to Kovalchuk. The retirement explanation would make a lot of sense as well because it would explain how LA could still hold his rights after terminating the contract, and how he was able to sign in the KHL without violating the gentlemen's agreement between the leagues to honor each others contracts.

It would further mean that Voynov is not on LA's Reserve List at this time, though they could arrange to re-add him to the Reserve List in the future. I'm not certain that teams can trade "rights" to players other then Unsigned Draft Choices or players on the Reserve List.

Of course it's possible the retirement report is inaccurate. Also there was reportedly a special agreement between the NHL and PA covering Voynov's departure which might include unique clauses in it covering his situation.

 

[Reaper45]

Ah, another thread for the internet warriors to come in and talk about doling out their 'street justice' to Voynov.

His value is minimal, if any, at this point. Until he gets officially cleared to play, has his visas secured, and any supplementary NHL discipline decided, the risk isn't worth much to another team.

If all goes well and he's cleared? Whats a top pair RHD cost on the open market? That'll be his value.

I mean his visas have been cleared already right? He's been vacationing in Florida I think fairly recently.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

I don't think it was reported at the time Voynov left, however there was an article from a few months ago claiming that Voynov had officially retired from the NHL as part of his departure settlement. I didn't see any report that LA tolled his contracts, by all accounts the contract has been voided. If that's all accurate then his rights would be handled in a similar fashion to Kovalchuk. The retirement explanation would make a lot of sense as well because it would explain how LA could still hold his rights after terminating the contract, and how he was able to sign in the KHL without violating the gentlemen's agreement between the leagues to honor each others contracts.

It would further mean that Voynov is not on LA's Reserve List at this time, though they could arrange to re-add him to the Reserve List in the future. I'm not certain that teams can trade "rights" to players other then Unsigned Draft Choices or players on the Reserve List.

Of course it's possible the retirement report is inaccurate. Also there was reportedly a special agreement between the NHL and PA covering Voynov's departure which might include unique clauses in it covering his situation.

I think you're right.

I do absolutely remember reading his contract was tolled at the time as we were wondering what the situation would be given the special circumstances. Makes more sense that the NHL/PA handled that behind closed doors with clauses and that rather it was similar to certain situations. All I can find now from credible sources is stuff like "The Kings terminated Voynov’s six-year, $25-million contract in 2015 but retain his rights and could trade him for assets if he were reinstated." from Curtis Zupke who covers the Kings in various capacities. Former Kings defenseman Slava Voynov is granted dismissal of domestic abuse conviction

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

If all goes well and he's cleared? Whats a top pair RHD cost on the open market? That'll be his value.

Whatever his on-ice value is it the Kings won’t get it in a trade (if they can trade his rights). Hasn’t played in the league in some time. And call me a “justice warrior”, but can’t imagine any GM wants to deal with the public backlash of trading a package of good assets for him. They’ll look to add him of course, but on the cheap. I predict a 3rd for Voynov.

 

[Reaper45]

Nope, I think some of us just believe in the moral integrity of the league, but nice try!

Why? This league has never been moral before.

 

[Starat327]

Nope, I think some of
us just believe in the moral integrity of the league, but nice try!

Ah, the moral integrity of a league that allowed Bertuzzi to viciously assault someone on the ice on live television, suspend him a few games, and resume his career as though nothing happened, while the other player was never able to play the game again?

The same moral integrity that had Patrick Kane assault a cab driver over a cab fare?

The same moral integrity that allowed Heatley to continue playing after making a decision to drive drunk and kill another player?


Spare me your white knight stories. What Voynov did was terrible, and no one should defend that. But please dont tie the 'morality of the league' in to this at all when there the league has allowed much worse.

 

[Starat327]

I think there was a lot of hope on Zaitsev, who was played in the #2 role in his rookie year and was a little out of his depth but didn't get buried like Santini, that he would take a step forward in his 2nd year and be passable as a #2D. It went the other way for sure in his 2nd year, so I think there was a lot of backtracking on that opinion by those who had it. I don't believe he thinks fast enough to be a top pairing guy, but I could see him being a good 2nd pairing guy

I do think Voynov is an upgrade on the Leafs' situation, if he was a real #2 I would do it if he agreed to things that would show he was remorseful (counselling, voluntary advocacy against that kind of violence, etc) but I think he falls into the Petry tier so I'd prefer to just do that in trade

Maybe i just have a different view from watching him more frequently. At the time, he was a very Clear #2 or #3 at worst. I'd easily argue that if he came back playing the same level of hockey he played when he left - he'd be the leafs best RHD by a fair margin, but you know what they say about opinions..

 

[Morbo]

Nope, I think some of us just believe in the moral integrity of the league, but nice try!

bahahaha you believe in the whatnow??