Player Discussion Shea Weber - Dear Dad Edition

[le_sean]

Trading Weber is a silly notion and trading him to help the Leafs is absolutely ridiculous.

 

[Habs Halifax]

If you think 2.5 years is our window then we should be dangling Poehling..Romanov..and the likes to bring in immediate help.
We should also offer the league max for 7 years to Karlsson this summer.

Not really. We can try to go after Stone with our cap space. Then we can dangle Gallagher and Reilly for Nurse and Puljujarvi. If we have to add a 2nd, so be it. We don't really have to trade our top prospects like Poehling, Suzuki, Romanov, Brook, Primeau, Ylonen IMO. I think we can try to win now and later. Our cap space is step 1 and we will know July 1st. I was interested in Muzzin cause the price was fair to acquire. I'm not going to trade for Panarin or Stone as rental and the sign and trade would also be a steep price.

I would consider this group a top 5-10 range cup contender (line-up below). And we would still have our 1st round picks and top prospects in Poehling, Suzuki, Romanov, Brook, Primeau, etc for the future. In 2.5 years, we evaluate how good Petry, Tatar, Danault are as pending UFA's and also how Weber is at age 35. Might require another re-set. I don't see the point of doing nothing in this next 2.5 years where people think we will for sure be better in 5 years. Doing nothing in this 2.5 year span is stupid. We either must go after improvements or sell, sell, sell. One or the other IMO. I don't want to be in the top 10-15 range for season after season.

Drouin / Domi / Stone
Lehkonen / Kotkaniemi / Puljujarvi
Tatar / Danault / Armia
Hudon / Peca / Shaw

Mete / Weber
Nurse / Petry
Kulak / Juulsen

Price
Lindgren

 

[Habs Halifax]

I dont know enough about Sandin to have a well formed opinion on the matter. If Kapanen is more interesting piece than Sandin, I pass.

I consider Sandin and Romanov equals. Some give the edge to Romanov and vice versa if you ask the Leafs. I think it's close between these two.

Weber to the Avs would be a better fit. Go get the Sens pick. However, I think they need help on LD more than RD.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

He never implied it was his fault though.

" He has yet to lead a NHL team to the 3rd round"

Because leadership is all it takes to reach the 3rd round? I mean, fact Nashville didn't spend much on players is not important, we should question Weber's leadership instead...?

You know it's just one of those things where the reason Nashville wasn't very good is obvious and it had little to do with his leadership.

I'd be far more concerned if Nashville was spending big money, going for a run and their captain didn't do any sort of leadership.

I think Weber's whole mythical leadership ability with the 'aura' and 'stare' nonsense was something started by Babcock and became a meme but he seems like a good leader. There's little or no evidence or the contrary. It just seems unfair to expect him to be godly when it's more of a meme than anything else. Besides...like I said some teams aren't very good, it's fine.

I think Landeskog is a good leader and talented player but his team does jack. I don't think it's his fault. If I compared him to some ridiculous standard created out of meme then yeah...he'd fail the test too.

He's fine and we should drop the mythical leadership nonsense unless we recognize it as a joke, not unlike Gorges allegedly being captain of a WHL team.

 

[Kriss E]

" He has yet to lead a NHL team to the 3rd round"

Because leadership is all it takes to reach the 3rd round? I mean, fact Nashville didn't spend much on players is not important, we should question Weber's leadership instead...?

You know it's just one of those things where the reason Nashville wasn't very good is obvious and it had little to do with his leadership.

I'd be far more concerned if Nashville was spending big money, going for a run and their captain didn't do any sort of leadership.

I think Weber's whole mythical leadership ability with the 'aura' and 'stare' nonsense was something started by Babcock and became a meme but he seems like a good leader. There's little or no evidence or the contrary. It just seems unfair to expect him to be godly when it's more of a meme than anything else. Besides...like I said some teams aren't very good, it's fine.

I think Landeskog is a good leader and talented player but his team does jack. I don't think it's his fault. If I compared him to some ridiculous standard created out of meme then yeah...he'd fail the test too.

He's fine and we should drop the mythical leadership nonsense unless we recognize it as a joke, not unlike Gorges allegedly being captain of a WHL team.

Sure, but nobody speaks of Landescog as the best leader in the NHL as they have with Weber.
I think leadership is massively exaggerated anyways. If it was as important as many believe or lead on, then you could have terrific leaders on your team with less skills and still do well. Not the case.
Very much like fighting, if it was as impactful, teams would carry way more fighters.

 

[Adriatic]

Weber really is a great leader and he is a father figure to a lot of the young Habs.

 

[Kriss E]

I consider Sandin and Romanov equals. Some give the edge to Romanov and vice versa if you ask the Leafs. I think it's close between these two.

Weber to the Avs would be a better fit. Go get the Sens pick. However, I think they need help on LD more than RD.

Theres no way they move the Sens pick now. I had argued about doing this when the Avs were at the top of the West. Right now they're not even sure to make the POs, they really shouldn't give away a potential #1 pick.

 

[Kriss E]

Not really. We can try to go after Stone with our cap space. Then we can dangle Gallagher and Reilly for Nurse and Puljujarvi. If we have to add a 2nd, so be it. We don't really have to trade our top prospects like Poehling, Suzuki, Romanov, Brook, Primeau, Ylonen IMO. I think we can try to win now and later. Our cap space is step 1 and we will know July 1st. I was interested in Muzzin cause the price was fair to acquire. I'm not going to trade for Panarin or Stone as rental and the sign and trade would also be a steep price.

I would consider this group a top 5-10 range cup contender (line-up below). And we would still have our 1st round picks and top prospects in Poehling, Suzuki, Romanov, Brook, Primeau, etc for the future. In 2.5 years, we evaluate how good Petry, Tatar, Danault are as pending UFA's and also how Weber is at age 35. Might require another re-set. I don't see the point of doing nothing in this next 2.5 years where people think we will for sure be better in 5 years. Doing nothing in this 2.5 year span is stupid. We either must go after improvements or sell, sell, sell. One or the other IMO. I don't want to be in the top 10-15 range for season after season.

Drouin / Domi / Stone
Lehkonen / Kotkaniemi / Puljujarvi
Tatar / Danault / Armia
Hudon / Peca / Shaw

Mete / Weber
Nurse / Petry
Kulak / Juulsen

Price
Lindgren

Theres no way Oilers make this trade of yours. None. I'd be seriously pissed if I was a fan of theirs and heard this trade came through.

I'd much prefer signing Karlsson. Having him and Weber would be huge for us. More so than Stone.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Theres no way they move the Sens pick now. I had argued about doing this when the Avs were at the top of the West. Right now they're not even sure to make the POs, they really shouldn't give away a potential #1 pick.

I don't expect them to give up the pick if they get the 1st 3 spots. If they somehow get the 4th OA pick, then I think they might consider trading it. Weber and Reilly for Zadorov and the 4th OA. But like I said, they appear to need more LD help and they have Makar coming soon who is a right handed shot. Not sure if they think Weber fits but I think a lot of GM's make him fit lol.

With the 4th pick, I would have a hard time over Cozens and Byram

 

[Habs Halifax]

Theres no way Oilers make this trade of yours. None. I'd be seriously pissed if I was a fan of theirs and heard this trade came through.

I'd much prefer signing Karlsson. Having him and Weber would be huge for us. More so than Stone.

I'm not 100% sure. If we offer Rielly who softens the LD blow of losing Nurse, they might do it. Gallagher has a lot of value. There are some Oilers fans on the main board yesterday who have admitted that they would do a Gallagher for Nurse straight up. Who knows what their Management thinks.

I'd love to sign both Karlsson and Stone but that would require unloading Shaw, Schlemko, and the anchor contract in Alzner to fit them it.

- Karlsson at $11M and Stone at $8.5M
- Shaw for picks.
- Schlemko for whatever we can get. If we have to add a late pick to get rid of him, so be it.
- Alzner is tricky. Might require unloading our 2020 1st and $1M retention.
- Armia and Lehkonen get bridge deals at $2.5M AAV
- Reilly and Kulak get $1M AAV

If Karlsson and Stone are interested in the Habs and Bergevin can unload Shaw, Schlemko, Alzner, it fits a $83M cap but very tight. If the cap is higher, it's gravy on top and makes the negotiation with Armia and Lehkonen easier.

 

[Kriss E]

I don't expect them to give up the pick if they get the 1st 3 spots. If they somehow get the 4th OA pick, then I think they might consider trading it. Weber and Reilly for Zadorov and the 4th OA. But like I said, they appear to need more LD help and they have Makar coming soon who is a right handed shot. Not sure if they think Weber fits but I think a lot of GM's make him fit lol.

With the 4th pick, I would have a hard time over Cozens and Byram

I dont think Bergey would move Weber for that return.
And again, if your saying let's contend within 2.5y...better off keeping all these guys and throw the max to Karlsson. We would lose absolutely nothing and add a Norris winner.

 

[Spring in Fialta]

I'm not 100% sure. If we offer Rielly who softens the LD blow of losing Nurse, they might do it. Gallagher has a lot of value. There are some Oilers fans on the main board yesterday who have admitted that they would do a Gallagher for Nurse straight up. Who knows what their Management thinks.

I'd love to sign both Karlsson and Stone but that would require unloading Shaw, Schlemko, and the anchor contract in Alzner to fit them it.

- Karlsson at $11M and Stone at $8.5M
- Shaw for picks.
- Schlemko for whatever we can get. If we have to add a late pick to get rid of him, so be it.
- Alzner is tricky. Might require unloading our 2020 1st and $1M retention.
- Armia and Lehkonen get bridge deals at $2.5M AAV
- Reilly and Kulak get $1M AAV

If Karlsson and Stone are interested in the Habs and Bergevin can unload Shaw, Schlemko, Alzner, it fits a $83M cap but very tight. If the cap is higher, it's gravy on top and makes the negotiation with Armia and Lehkonen easier.

Rielly is a nothing player. That trade with the Oilers is a shameless fantasy.

 

[Habs Halifax]

I dont think Bergey would move Weber for that return.
And again, if your saying let's contend within 2.5y...better off keeping all these guys and throw the max to Karlsson. We would lose absolutely nothing and add a Norris winner.

I rather do one or the other.

1) Make improvements now using our cap space and trades but our young core and top prospects are untouchable.
or
2) Sell, Sell, Sell. Weber, Petry, Tatar, Gallagher, Danault. Not necessary all of them at the same time but move them one at at time in the next 1-2 years.

Doing nothing is what will annoy me.

 

[Kriss E]

I'm not 100% sure. If we offer Rielly who softens the LD blow of losing Nurse, they might do it. Gallagher has a lot of value. There are some Oilers fans on the main board yesterday who have admitted that they would do a Gallagher for Nurse straight up. Who knows what their Management thinks.

I'd love to sign both Karlsson and Stone but that would require unloading Shaw, Schlemko, and the anchor contract in Alzner to fit them it.

You have some Habs fans who thought Subban was equal to Del Zotto. Going by some HF fans doesnt mean anything.
Oilers have been a mess because of their defense for years, Chia was a moron, now the new guy comes in to trade their best Dman?...this for Gallagher? Ya I dont see it man.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Rielly is a nothing player. That trade with the Oilers is a shameless fantasy.

I disagree. I have more Oilers fans agreeing with me than the few Habs fans on our boards that think this is a fantasy. Rielly is not a nothing player. Keep dreaming

 

[Spring in Fialta]

I disagree. I have more Oilers fans agreeing with me than the few Habs fans on our boards that think this is a fantasy. Rielly is not a nothing player. Keep dreaming

Then those Oilers fans deserve the team they have today. It's a terrible trade from the Oilers POV.

 

[Kriss E]

I rather do one or the other.

1) Make improvements now using our cap space and trades but our young core and top prospects are untouchable.
or
2) Sell, Sell, Sell. Weber, Petry, Tatar, Gallagher, Danault. Not necessary all of them at the same time but move them one at at time in the next 1-2 years.

Doing nothing is what will annoy me.

Sign Karlsson. If we are not selling, I'm doing everything possible to get him to sign here. Whatever he wants, he'll get.

 

[Habs Halifax]

You have some Habs fans who thought Subban was equal to Del Zotto. Going by some HF fans doesnt mean anything.
Oilers have been a mess because of their defense for years, Chia was a moron, now the new guy comes in to trade their best Dman?...this for Gallagher? Ya I dont see it man.

I do agree that HF fans and popularity means little. But it doesn't mean that all opinions are trash. I'm not saying the Oilers make this move for sure. It's just an example of the type of move we can dangle to get the LD piece we need. Gallagher and Rielly is a solid package. People throwing Rielly under the bus is weird. The kid is playing well for us.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Sign Karlsson. If we are not selling, I'm doing everything possible to get him to sign here. Whatever he wants, he'll get.

I'm with you on this one buddy!

 

[Habs Halifax]

Then those Oilers fans deserve the team they have today. It's a terrible trade from the Oilers POV.

That's your opinion. How does the Oilers roster look after this trade? I think their top 6 is much better by adding Gallagher and this doesn't include Yamamoto yet. Still imprvements to make in the bottom 6. The D is solid but depends on how Sekera is after coming back from LTI. We will see soon.

Drai / McDavid / Rattie
Lucic / RNH / Gallagher
Khaira / Brodziak / Chiasson
Whoever

Klefbom / Russel
Sekera / Larsson
Russell / Bouchard

I think you are devaluing the impact Gallagher would have for them.

 

[Belial]

Weber's going to retire as a Habs player! Bookmark this post.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Sure, but nobody speaks of Landescog as the best leader in the NHL as they have with Weber.
I think leadership is massively exaggerated anyways. If it was as important as many believe or lead on, then you could have terrific leaders on your team with less skills and still do well. Not the case.
Very much like fighting, if it was as impactful, teams would carry way more fighters.

Since the thread was bumped did anyone even say "Weber is the best leader in the NHL"? I looked and saw nothing in last 3 pages. Maybe it goes before that but I don't recall it apart from the memes.

 

[Belial]

I know it may sound dumb but Weber is making an impact just by being on the ice!

You rarely see someone trying to enter the zone with the puck on his side because they know he's there... So they will dump it and Mete will get it on the other side cuz he skates like the wind lol or Carey will intercept the puck behind the net and initiate a breakout...

 

[THE HOFF]

So, if Weber were to leave the Habs, one way or another, there wouldnt be another player to inspire the youngsters ?


Not saying Weber isnt helping the young D or anything, just trying to understand what he's doing that is so unique, that other "leaders" around the league can't do...

There is just as big a chance none of those guys are in the NHL in a few years too.
Beaulieu couldn't stop raving about Gonchar too...PK on Gill...veterans are needed to help youngsters, no doubt about it, but veteran presence isnt difficult to find.

Obviously he does not possess special powers (or does he? )) ) but all im saying is that many of us are looking for ways to offload him for just about anything.

I enjoy the ride this year. I enjoy my man mountain. Enjoy the moment and what he brings.

 

[ECWHSWI]

I really don't get the argument that the team can do without Weber, especially the one that says, "If he is that needed, the team just isn't good enough to win." That kind of reasoning when we are talking about one of team's best players at their position, who is also one of the better players at his position in the league, is grade school logic. MON isn't good enough to get rid of players that affect the team make-up throughout the lineup and stabilize the whole D? No ****.

TOR adding Weber to their lineup would set them up for a Cup, IMO. Muzzin, not so much, although he might help make the D deeper than it was, for sure.

grade school logic is repeating all the time someone's an amazing leader, one of the very best if not THE best leader while not having a single example, a single "proof" of said amzing leadership quality...