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Prospect Info: Senators Prospect Talk 2016-2017, part two

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MaxTheLimit

MaxTheLimit

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Jul 21, 2016
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Proust said:
60 point, 2-way players are not 2nd tier. I agree with the 2nd tier part, but that means he's more likely to be a 40 pt, 2-way player.
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Pointing out that I mentioned as his PEAK. As in his best year / couple years he may touch 60.

I think most years he will be more like 40 to maybe 50. I'm struggling to find a comparable, but for offensive production curve, maybe something like a Jordan Staal, Frans Nielsen, or Mikhail Grabner. Only looking at offensive stats, guys who have a production arc that culminates at around 60 but for the most part are 40-50 points.

Strictly from an offensive standpoint, that's what I meant when I said 'high water mark'. I'm not expecting him to be around 60 points for a long stretch through his prime or anything. I don't think he has that as a maintained upside. Just a peak year.
 
God Says No

God Says No

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MaxTheLimit said:
Pointing out that I mentioned as his PEAK. As in his best year / couple years he may touch 60.

I think most years he will be more like 40 to maybe 50. I'm struggling to find a comparable, but for offensive production curve, maybe something like a Jordan Staal, Frans Nielsen, or Mikhail Grabner. Only looking at offensive stats, guys who have a production arc that culminates at around 60 but for the most part are 40-50 points.

Strictly from an offensive standpoint, that's what I meant when I said 'high water mark'. I'm not expecting him to be around 60 points for a long stretch through his prime or anything. I don't think he has that as a maintained upside. Just a peak year.
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That is still an overtly optimistic projection. You could be correct, but I see him as defensive minded 3C who will touch 40s on occasion, but mostly hover between 20 and 40. Something similar to JGP.
 
Cosmix

Cosmix

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BondraTime said:
Honestly, trying to evaluate a guy like that is useless. Becoming disappointed at something like that is a problem of your expectations and metrics more than anything.
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Yes, his play did not live up to the expectations created in my mind from comments made by others.
 
neelynugs

neelynugs

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after chabot/white/brown, how would you guys rank the next tier of prospects? perron probably close, but what's the top 10 look like?
 
Real Smart Sens Fan

Real Smart Sens Fan

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neelynugs said:
after chabot/white/brown, how would you guys rank the next tier of prospects? perron probably close, but what's the top 10 look like?
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Tier 1: Chabot/Brown/White
Tier 2: Chlapik/Dahlen/Englund
Tier 3: Hogberg/Perron/Paul
Tier 4: Jaros/Harpur/Gagne/Ahl

This is roughly how I would rank our guys.
 
ReginKarlssonLehner

ReginKarlssonLehner

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I've watched White as many times as I could, ya, he isn't 1st line material. He is definitely 2nd line material tho, the type of 2nd line C's you need to win and go deep in playoffs, imo. If he ends up a 3rd liner I'll be quite disappointed. My hopes is he ends up like Kesler is now for Anaheim, a complete 2 way 2nd line C with excellent speed, and ability to step up big in the clutch. Even tho he doesn't have elite skill-set, he's the type of guy you rely on in important situations because of his complete game, IQ and ability to raise his game.

45-55 point C is my hope.
 
playasRus

playasRus

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ReginKarlssonLehner said:
I've watched White as many times as I could, ya, he isn't 1st line material. He is definitely 2nd line material tho, the type of 2nd line C's you need to win and go deep in playoffs, imo. If he ends up a 3rd liner I'll be quite disappointed. My hopes is he ends up like Kesler is now for Anaheim, a complete 2 way 2nd line C with excellent speed, and ability to step up big in the clutch. Even tho he doesn't have elite skill-set, he's the type of guy you rely on in important situations because of his complete game, IQ and ability to raise his game.

45-55 point C is my hope.
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This is how I feel watching him too albeit in limited spurts.
 
Real Smart Sens Fan

Real Smart Sens Fan

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Do Make Say Think said:
Gagne is the prototypical boom//bust right?

Hard to make him fit in a tier'd system.
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I'd say all of my tier 4 guys are more likely to bust than boom... but they are all guys with NHL potential. That's why I grouped them that way. Tier 3 I think have a good chance of making the NHL... Tier 2 I think have the ability to be top 6/4 players, Tier 1 have a very good chance of being top 6/4 players with the ability to be impact players.
 
Xspyrit

Xspyrit

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Let's assume that Dzingel and Claesson have graduated

1- Chabot-White-Brown

2- Dahlen-Chlapik-Perron-Hogberg

3- Jaros-Englund-Paul

4- Lajoie-Ahl-Gagne-Harpur-McCormick

5- Wolanin-Nurmi-Baillargeon-Gendron-Eiserman

6- the rest

Do Make Say Think said:
I'l be very surprised if Perron becomes anything more than a decent 3rd liner.
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I said that I'd be very surprised if Hoffman becomes anything more than a cup-of-coffee player. Conclusion is that it's still way too early to tell. If we base yourself on the season in Bingo for the prospects down there, we might get fooled. One thing for sure is that Perron needs to add weight and strength. Let's see what he does next year in a bigger role and hopefully better players around him. He has the ability to become a top-6 forward, speed, skating, shot, passing, elusiveness. Impossible to tell what he will be right now. However, next year is crucial for his development.

playasRus said:
This is how I feel watching him too albeit in limited spurts.
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My opinion on White is that his upside is somewhat of a mix between a mini-Bergeron and Brassard. Or a taller Pageau (30-40 pts) if he doesn't reach 50-60 pts upside

Ol Chunk O Coal said:
I'd say all of my tier 4 guys are more likely to bust than boom... but they are all guys with NHL potential. That's why I grouped them that way. Tier 3 I think have a good chance of making the NHL... Tier 2 I think have the ability to be top 6/4 players, Tier 1 have a very good chance of being top 6/4 players with the ability to be impact players.
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Why do you think that Jaros is more likely to bust than boom? He seems like a good bet to be a NHL player if he crosses the pond. Perron and Chlapik have more chances to bust than Jaros IMO. Their upside is bigger though.
 
Real Smart Sens Fan

Real Smart Sens Fan

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Xspyrit said:
Why do you think that Jaros is more likely to bust than boom? He seems like a good bet to be a NHL player if he crosses the pond. Perron and Chlapik have more chances to bust than Jaros IMO. Their upside is bigger though.
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Bolded is the exact reason why. I am not confident that he will put in a serious attempt in North America. If he gave any indication that he was serious about coming to NA and putting in work, I would probably have him at the high end of Tier 3.
 
aragorn

aragorn

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Tier 1: Chabot/Brown/White
Tier 2: Hogberg/Englund/Jaros
Tier 3: Paul/Perron/Chlapik/Dahlen
Tier 4: Harpur/Gagne/Ahl/McCormick
 
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