Salary Cap: Salary Cap+Roster Building: 'twas a great run....

[KIRK]

Also does not compute. Which is why JR has gone mad

Senile. Mad. A distinction without a difference in some ways, I suppose . . .

 

[Pancakes]

I don't know if Mackey actually knows anything but the thought of trading Malkin seems crazy. Kessel, ok. Letang....maybe.

But Malkin? That would be drastic.

 

[Andy99]

I'd love to know the 'source' saying Mario and Burkle are considering INITIATING a discussion with Malkin to waive his NTC.

Can’t see Mario ever doing this...not only that, but they’d have to have a deal in place beforehand because if it didn’t work out, that would ruin any relationship there...

 

[KIRK]

Can’t see Mario ever doing this...not only that, but they’d have to have a deal in place beforehand because if it didn’t work out, that would ruin any relationship there...

And you'd have to know in advance that Malkin was going to accept the trade.

I mean, imagine if you did it without asking, and Malkin basically said '**** you, I'm not going there, but here are the 2-3 teams where I would go, and I now expect to be traded to one, because I'm done here after you pulled this ****'.

 

[PensandCaps]

no way Malkin gets traded.

Neither Letang gets traded too.

These two have been here since the start and have won 3 cups. They deserve to retire as Penguins.

Oh And they're both still top 5-10 at their posistion.

 

[KIRK]

I don't know if Mackey actually knows anything but the thought of trading Malkin seems crazy. Kessel, ok. Letang....maybe.

But Malkin? That would be drastic.

Let's see how long that lasts out there without a public spanking.

When the Letang talk was out there a year and a half ago, they let it hang for a week until a deal with Florida fell apart, then they came down hard that the rumors were false.

Malkin made his end of season comments about system, construction, and arrogance. A few days ago, you get the Yohe article, which basically was a 'it's not the coaches, it was players like Malkin' story that I'm sure came from someone like Recchi or Guerin. Now, we get this Mackey tidbit, with a 'and maybe Malkin too'.

So, let's see how long that one hangs out there or if anyone else reports the same thing.

 

[Andy99]

And you'd have to know in advance that Malkin was going to accept the trade.

I mean, imagine if you did it without asking, and Malkin basically said '**** you, I'm not going there, but here are the 2-3 teams where I would go, and I now expect to be traded to one, because I'm done here after you pulled this ****'.

Even asking him beforehand “hey we’d like to consider trading you, would you be open to leaving” and he says yes to FLA or CHI only, and there’s no deal to be made there...now what? Now he just plays even worse here and has a grudge? Don’t go there...if he walks over to Mario out of the blue and says it, that’s one thing...it’s another thing to approach him at all...

 

[PensandCaps]

There should be only 5 untouchable players.

Sid
Geno
Tanger
Dumo
Guentzel


I'd say Murray, but idk how much he is asking for. If under 6 per year, he should be untouchable.

 

[SEALBound]

Letang is a little different given his NTC, but it makes me laugh that people don't understand the absolute ****show that would ever come of the organization asking Malkin to waive his NTC:

1. I suspect that's a genie that you will NOT be able to put back into the bottle, because I suspect that Malkin would be permanently offended by that request. It's why smarter journalists have suggested/assumed that the Pens will never trade Malkin unless the request originates with him.

2. Malkin isn't going to give the Pens a ton of options. More like a handful. The Pens still may get an okay return, but AT BEST it will be like the Phil deal . . . you'll get a player you HOPE will come close to giving you in 2-3 years what a early 30's Malkin gives you and a later 1st you HOPE will pan out.

That said, part of me HOPES the Pens ownership and management really is this stupid . . . the fall out drama from that **** up will be entertaining.

I doubt the conversation is an abrupt "We want you to waive your NMC so that we can trade you." I believe it would be a nice sit down with JR, Mario, and Burkle asking Geno about his desires. Im sure they will be have established the direction they want to go in and see if thats something he wants to be a part of or if he wants to start fresh with a new team. Thats not that unreasonable. Its those tough conversations good leaders have to have to prevent major downfalls. Burkle will have that convo no doubt. 4 game sweep cut deeply into his playoff revenue. Make no mistake...hes a businessman who watches the bottomline.

Dont know where he'd go though to be honest. LA for Kopitar? Calgary, Montreal, Nashville, Florida Chicago? Not even sure what the list looks like.

 

[KIRK]

Even asking him beforehand “hey we’d like to consider trading you, would you be open to leaving” and he says yes to FLA or CHI only, and there’s no deal to be made there...now what? Now he just plays even worse here and has a grudge? Don’t go there...if he walks over to Mario out of the blue and says it, that’s one thing...it’s another thing to approach him at all...

Yeah, I 100% think IF you ask Malkin to waive, then that genie never goes back into the bottle. You have to move him to somewhere he's willing to go.

 

[PensandCaps]

I really don't see how trading a top 5 Dman in the league on a great cap hit makes us any better.

Especially since its our weakest position.

Seems obvious to me is to cut the fat around Letang and Dumo and not trade them.

(Schultz,Maatta,JJ,Guds) get rid of those subpar players and not the elite #1 guy. Seems obvious.

Keep Petts.

 

[KIRK]

I doubt the conversation is an abrupt "We want you to waive your NMC so that we can trade you." I believe it would be a nice sit down with JR, Mario, and Burkle asking Geno about his desires. Im sure they will be have established the direction they want to go in and see if thats something he wants to be a part of or if he wants to start fresh with a new team. Thats not that unreasonable. Its those tough conversations good leaders have to have to prevent major downfalls. Burkle will have that convo no doubt. 4 game sweep cut deeply into his playoff revenue. Make no mistake...hes a businessman who watches the bottomline.

Dont know where he'd go though to be honest. LA for Kopitar? Calgary, Montreal, Nashville, Florida Chicago? Not even sure what the list looks like.

But you've basically confirmed it . . . this only happens if GENO initiates it by saying he wants out.

And, LOL if you think the return would be something like Kopitar. Think more along the lines of what JR paid for Phil. Maybe a little better IF Geno is generous in the list he provides.

 

[Pancakes]

Let's see how long that lasts out there without a public spanking.

When the Letang talk was out there a year and a half ago, they let it hang for a week until a deal with Florida fell apart, then they came down hard that the rumors were false.

Malkin made his end of season comments about system, construction, and arrogance. A few days ago, you get the Yohe article, which basically was a 'it's not the coaches, it was players like Malkin' story that I'm sure came from someone like Recchi or Guerin. Now, we get this Mackey tidbit, with a 'and maybe Malkin too'.

So, let's see how long that one hangs out there or if anyone else reports the same thing.

That's fair, but aren't we also now at a point where if there's smoke there's fire? This is now two off seasons in a row where Kessel and Letang have been rumored to be moving, and now they are throwing Malkin's name out there too.

I don't see how we get through this summer unscathed in terms of those three names. When these rumors hang around long enough something eventually happens, no?

 

[DesertedPenguin]

I guarantee you the first conversation between the brass and Geno wouldn't even mention the word trade.

It'd be all about how Geno feels. How does he feel about his play? How does he feel about his linemates and the power play? How does he feel about Sullivan? What does he perceive the team's weaknesses to be and does he have suggestions to fix it? And, finally, is he happy in Pittsburgh?

The only way a trade comes up is if Geno expresses dissatisfaction to the point where moving him seems palatable to both parties. I'd imagine it'll never get to that point.

By the way, you have the same conversation with Sid. Only a trade is something you don't even think about.

 

[KIRK]

That's fair, but aren't we also now at a point where if there's smoke there's fire? This is now two off seasons in a row where Kessel and Letang have been rumored to be moving, and now they are throwing Malkin's name out there too.

I don't see how we get through this summer unscathed in terms of those three names. When these rumors hang around long enough something eventually happens, no?

I've known about Letang since December of 2017. Phil not as much until the summer.

Exploring a Geno trade is another story . . . and one that I think ends badly for the Pens regardless as noted above.

I guarantee you the first conversation between the brass and Geno wouldn't even mention the word trade.

It'd be all about how Geno feels. How does he feel about his play? How does he feel about his linemates and the power play? How does he feel about Sullivan? What does he perceive the team's weaknesses to be and does he have suggestions to fix it? And, finally, is he happy in Pittsburgh?

The only way a trade comes up is if Geno expresses dissatisfaction to the point where moving him seems palatable to both parties. I'd imagine it'll never get to that point.

By the way, you have the same conversation with Sid. Only a trade is something you don't even think about.

Speaking of Sid, I'm not necessarily sure he'd be on board with the idea of a rebuild that includes jettisoning Malkin.

 

[Andy99]

I doubt the conversation is an abrupt "We want you to waive your NMC so that we can trade you." I believe it would be a nice sit down with JR, Mario, and Burkle asking Geno about his desires. Im sure they will be have established the direction they want to go in and see if thats something he wants to be a part of or if he wants to start fresh with a new team. Thats not that unreasonable. Its those tough conversations good leaders have to have to prevent major downfalls. Burkle will have that convo no doubt. 4 game sweep cut deeply into his playoff revenue. Make no mistake...hes a businessman who watches the bottomline.

Dont know where he'd go though to be honest. LA for Kopitar? Calgary, Montreal, Nashville, Florida Chicago? Not even sure what the list looks like.

They have to know what direction they want to go in and how to get there first...I’m not convinced they do, or there aren’t folks with different ideas...if they do know how they should play with their ideal roster, then they should be having these conversations with Sid and Letang too, the leadership core, because they’ll need everyone to be on board ... and what they say and whether they agree or think Sully isn’t the person to lead them there, that input should guide what they do as far as trading anyone from the leadership core...

 

[Jules Winnfield]

Sadly, Caps own the Bruins. But maybe the well-rested Isles have something to say about this?

Hopefully Carolina has something to say about this tonight.

 

[KIRK]

Hopefully Carolina has something to say about this tonight.

@MrazeksVengeance . . . will they?

cc: @ColePens

 

[Jules Winnfield]

Malkin isn’t going anywhere guys. Not even worth discussing.

 

[Pancakes]

I've known about Letang since December of 2017. Phil not as much until the summer.

Exploring a Geno trade is another story . . . and one that I think ends badly for the Pens regardless as noted above.



Speaking of Sid, I'm not necessarily sure he'd be on board with the idea of a rebuild that includes jettisoning Malkin.

Yeah. I do think it's very unlikely we move Malkin, and even less likely that if we were to move him we'd get a good deal.

But I feel in my gut that something drastic happens this off season. I think one of Letang or Kessel are gone. I really do. No sources, but it's my gut.

 

[Gurglesons]

Actually, you're right that using a 1st to jump JJ is the lunacy.

BUT, you're just as wrong in your evaluation of Johnson.

@pixiesfanyo . . . the smarter play, IF you need to give up a 1st to rid yourself of Johnson, is to buy him out.

I know what the smarter move is.

This is a leadership that signed that contract and traded for Gudbranson though.

 

[DesertedPenguin]

Speaking of Sid, I'm not necessarily sure he'd be on board with the idea of a rebuild that includes jettisoning Malkin.

Exactly.

I think Mackey's article is full of nuance. He was very aware of needing to drop in lines suggesting that trading Letang and Malkin may never happen. I think his source(s) are just trying to get across that for the first time, the Pens are thinking, "What if?" and that they'll have the discussions with all the important people to gauge the kind of overhaul needed. In past offseasons, even after disappointing seasons, those kinds of topics were never even broached. Now, they'll at least dig a little deeper to find out how happy everyone is and make some decisions from there.

Hell, it may not even get to the point of talking to Sid/Geno/Tanger about trading part of the core. Mario could wake up one day after thinking about it for a little bit and tell JR there's no way he'd approve a deal around one of the big three.

 

[MrazeksVengeance]

@MrazeksVengeance . . . will they?

cc: @ColePens

WE WILL TAKE VENGEANCE AGAINST THE SHEEPS OF WASHINGTON.

PREFERABLY TONIGHT.

 

[SEALBound]

I really don't see how trading a top 5 Dman in the league on a great cap hit makes us any better.

Especially since its our weakest position.

Seems obvious to me is to cut the fat around Letang and Dumo and not trade them.

(Schultz,Maatta,JJ,Guds) get rid of those subpar players and not the elite #1 guy. Seems obvious.

Keep Petts.

How does cutting everyone not named Letang and Dumo make Letang play a smarter game? The reasons for wanting to potentially move Letang and the issues with the rest of the defense are two independent issues.

But you've basically confirmed it . . . this only happens if GENO initiates it by saying he wants out.

And, LOL if you think the return would be something like Kopitar. Think more along the lines of what JR paid for Phil. Maybe a little better IF Geno is generous in the list he provides.

Right but I think they will lead him into that conversation.

Kopitar is my little pipe dream. Thinking this is a Weber for Subban type of deal.

I would tend to agree that the Kessel (or even Richards and Carter) trade is a more likely scenario.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Yohe yesterday: I don't think the Penguins will be making any big changes this off-season.

The reality is that the Pittsburgh media is filled with a bunch of guys who don't have a clue what they're talking about.