Salary Cap: Salary Cap & Roster Building: The Uncoachable & The Unmovable: The Tale of The American Dream

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Riptide

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Tom Hanks

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Sorry for those of you who thought the Pens had a chance...Bob says Skinner about to sign with BUF for around $9 mil AAV...thank god we won’t have to pay him that much...

https://www.tsn.ca/buffalo-sabres-jeff-skinner-close-to-eight-year-extension-1.1318605

There was a 99% chance (maybe higher :laugh:) he was going to sign in Buffalo.

He may have said he’ll go to UFA if he wasn’t happy with the offer which got them to budge a little. For me he’s worth 8 mil a year but he gets a bit more being a UFA and Buffalo needed scoring desperately if they want to push for a playoff berth.

I imagine Eichel and others would have been pretty ****ed if they let him walk.
 

ColePens

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Gurglesons

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And people think Phil isn't worth 6.8..... lulz

Skinner over the past 5 years has 12 more goals while playing 8 less games.

He’s also 7th in ES goals over that time. Kessel is in the 30s and has nearly 30 less ES goals.

Factor in Skinner is a few years younger. No surprise. Not to mention Kessel is actually making 8 mil.

If anything when comparing inflation and the contracts. Skinner’s is a steal versus Kessel. And they are relatively similar players.

I also haven’t heard anyone say he isn’t worth 6.8 around here. Just that he isn’t worth 6.8 to THIS TEAM.
 
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canadianguy77

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And people think Phil isn't worth 6.8..... lulz
(If we're in a playoff spot) Phil can slack off from Oct-Feb for all I care. The issue for me this season, is that he started trying in game 1. It was already too late at that point.

Geno and the guys forgot how to play with him when he tries. (And Phil did try hard in these playoffs)
 

ColePens

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That was no slight to Skinner. I obviously want him. I've said it many times. My intent in that post is to explain where we are with teh cap in 2019 and what those players cost. 9m is 2.2m more than we are paying Phil. Is that guy 2.2m more? That i am not sure of.

Bottom line - players are expensive in UFA. That's my point.
 
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SHOOTANDSCORE

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i would be shocked if he commanded any less than $3M per year
Yeah, I figure he'll get 3-3.2 ish. I think the Pens might be able to get him around 2.5 depending on term, NTC, etc. Maybe also an apology from JR. :laugh:

Personally, I'd seriously consider bringing him back at 2.5.
 
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Tom Hanks

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That was no slight to Skinner. I obviously want him. I've said it many times. My intent in that post is to explain where we are with teh cap in 2019 and what those players cost. 9m is 2.2m more than we are paying Phil. Is that guy 2.2m more? That i am not sure of.

Bottom line - players are expensive in UFA. That's my point.

A lot of us (including me) thought Phil was a net negative player this past season (I’d say 1.5 seasons) and some of us (including me) don’t think that’ll change going forward if he stays here. So we’re happy to move on.

I also want JR to stay out of FA for the most part because as you said they become expensive.
 
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Gurglesons

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That was no slight to Skinner. I obviously want him. I've said it many times. My intent in that post is to explain where we are with teh cap in 2019 and what those players cost. 9m is 2.2m more than we are paying Phil. Is that guy 2.2m more? That i am not sure of.

Bottom line - players are expensive in UFA. That's my point.

But, that’s twisting facts. Kessel is an 8 mil cap hit. Obviously he has been value for us and is still IMO worth 8 mil on a team that can utilize him in their top six.

In a league where Bobby Ryan and Evander Kane are making 7+, Skinner at 9 mil is fair value.
 
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pistolpete11

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I never understood why a player would re-sign this close to being a UFA. Even if you intend to return to that team, why not see what offers you get?
 

canadianguy77

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I'd lol if Phil has an epiphany this summer and grows up. He forgets about the stupid "iron-man" streak, and resigns himself to playing a 2-way game because he see's the writing on the wall for him and his "next" contract. (which at this point is in doubt)

He finishes the season with 25g-25a and a plus 20 on the 3rd line with Big D**k Nick and whoever else is healthy enough to play.

He gets the Masterton, some votes for the Smythe, and another ring.

And then he says f*** you to everyone, because he won big in Vegas in August 2020 on a drunk bet, and he will no longer need to put up with the hassle of people who can't even skate, questioning his ability or desire to play hockey.

*This is a dream of mine.
 

Tom Hanks

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I never understood why a player would re-sign this close to being a UFA. Even if you intend to return to that team, why not see what offers you get?

He wants to be there, got a good deal, I doubt anyone else is offering more and even if they’d did he’d stay in Buffalo. Nice to get a 72mil pay day locked up.

It can go the other way too (not likely in this case) if Buffalo trades or knows they can sign some other potent forwards. Then maybe Buffalo doesn’t think they need to pay 9 mil for him or worse for him they move on completely (and location was a big thing for him).
 

Ugene Magic

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That was no slight to Skinner. I obviously want him. I've said it many times. My intent in that post is to explain where we are with teh cap in 2019 and what those players cost. 9m is 2.2m more than we are paying Phil. Is that guy 2.2m more? That i am not sure of.

Bottom line - players are expensive in UFA. That's my point.

I still take Kessel at his age over Skinner.

Skinner may have goals going for him, but Kessel isn't far off and brings a lot more, has done more, and will never have Skinner top his best year let alone his 5th best year. But goals for 5 years.... for these guys. Skinner doesn't bring much, or enough to be in the discussion otherwise.

Kessel has out produced him overall over that span by 100+ points, in on Conn Smythe talk and more. Has 5 seasons of PPG marks.

Phil is a special player, and Skinner is a goal scorer, but not much more.

That isn't worth 2.2 more, no matter age, or if he scores more goals on depleted teams and brings little beyond that.

Kessel brought what he does for well before the last 5 seasons. Only people with agendas would want the lesser player.
 
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Riptide

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I never understood why a player would re-sign this close to being a UFA. Even if you intend to return to that team, why not see what offers you get?

Here's some reasons:
1) You really really want to play for said team. Skinner wants to be near Southern Ontario. Toronto doesn't have a need or cap space for him and Ottawa is a disaster. That leaves Buffalo or Detroit. If he got want he wanted out of Buffalo, why wait?
2) Waiting so that you can talk to other teams, also allows the team to talk to other players. And in general the more time you hedge and wait, the more time the team has to see what it's options are. I mean what if he said he wanted to hold off for a few weeks, and Buffalo got tired of waiting and traded for Kessel, thus removing the spot/cap space they would have used on Skinner?
3) Injuries. Sure the season is over, but what happens if he gets hit by a bus tomorrow and his career is over? If it's before he signs that contract, the contract isn't getting signed. However if it's after he signs it, at least he has that to fall back on.

Skinner as someone who's made 35m can afford to gamble a little more... but not really considering where he wants to play. At the end of the day once you get the offer you're looking for (or are willing to accept), you should take it. An extra 4-8m doesn't mean all that much if it means he doesn't get to play where he wants.
 

Gurglesons

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I still take Kessel at his age over Skinner.

Skinner may have goals going for him, but Kessel isn't far off and brings a lot more, has done more, and will never have Skinner top his best year let alone his 5th best year. But goals for 5 years.... for these guys. Skinner doesn't bring much, or enough to be in the discussion otherwise.

Kessel has out produced him overall over that span by 100+ points, in on Conn Smythe talk and more. Has 5 seasons of PPG marks.

Phil is a special player, and Skinner is a goal scorer, but not much more.

That isn't worth 2.2 more, no matter age, or if he scores more goals on depleted teams and brings little beyond that.

Kessel brought what he does for well before the last 5 seasons. Only people with agendas would want the lesser player.

Phil also has had the luxury of you know playing on much better teams than Skinner.

Skinner put up 37 goals with Viktor Rask as his center.

Kessel had prime JVR and Bozak at that age.

And it isn’t 2.2 mil. Kessel’s cap hit is 8 mil.

I agree Kessel is the better player, but Skinner’s contract is not surprising or overpayment.
 
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