Salary Cap: Salary Cap + Roster Building | Preseason Edition (Cap Details + Links in First Post)

[Turin]

A D who plays at Daley's 2016 level is probably in the same neighborhood. That was a hell of a trade.

Daley was actually pretty bad defensively, but he was often paired with Letang and the offense and speed was just too much. I say go all in on offense.

 

[The Old Master]

with the way our forwards back check / turn over the puck. there is not many defenders out there that would help. imo

 

[Gurglesons]

Daley was actually pretty bad defensively, but he was often paired with Letang and the offense and speed was just too much. I say go all in on offense.

Plus, as we are seeing with terrible Dumo right now, when Letang is dialed in he is amazing defensively.

 

[SHOOTANDSCORE]

Daley was actually pretty bad defensively, but he was often paired with Letang and the offense and speed was just too much. I say go all in on offense.

I don't agree with that. He was pretty good defensively towards the end of the season and playoffs. He played out of his mind when Tanger was suspended.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Wow copy cat

Did someone write that earlier?

How have you determined that this is Sullivan's issue with that line?

You're right, maybe he's just shaking things up. It's stupid and should be a last resort rather than a default option, but it's not necessarily determined by what he thinks of Brass at center.

Is that a deal you actually want to do though? I mean lets say if Shatty costs 4.65m (NYR eats 2m). Does that actually make us a better team?

Offensively, sure... but our issues over the past year+ are not usually offensive issues, but defensive ones...

Schultz is likely going to be out long-term and even before that, people were talking about how we missed Daley's presence. We could use another RH PMD especially with Letang's ever-tenuous health situation, and I'll always trust Gonch with rehabilitating defensemen of his ilk.

At this point, I think he potentially offers us more than Olli does...his skating issues aren't going away even after a full off-season, and the league's only getting faster from here on out.

 

[Ogrezilla]

Yeah Shatt fits the theme of playing to our strengths, weaknesses be damned.

 

[Turin]

I don't agree with that. He was pretty good defensively towards the end of the season and playoffs. He played out of his mind when Tanger was suspended.

He was good defensively in so far as keeping the puck in the other zone. He was never particularly good in his own end once the puck got there and the numbers speak to that.

 

[Peat]

The 2015-16 Penguins weren't defensive masters in their own zone, they were defensive masters at ensuring it came to that as little as possible.

I honestly think this year's version might be more capable in their own zone (or at least are when the mistakes settle down), but they have been far worse at keeping it out of there in the first place for a long time. Far far worse. And I think even with maximum effort they're not as good as 15-16. Not that the roster moves particularly agree with that assessment.

 

[Turin]

The 2015-16 Penguins weren't defensive masters in their own zone, they were defensive masters at ensuring it came to that as little as possible.

I honestly think this year's version might be more capable in their own zone (or at least are when the mistakes settle down), but they have been far worse at keeping it out of there in the first place for a long time. Far far worse. And I think even with maximum effort they're not as good as 15-16. Not that the roster moves particularly agree with that assessment.

They were great at blocking shots. Lovejoy, Cole, Bonino, and Kuhnhackl especially who are all gone now.

 

[Peat]

They were great at blocking shots. Lovejoy, Cole, Bonino, and Kuhnhackl especially who are all gone now.

I'm not sure how much that's changed. We were 24th in the league in 15-16 after Sully took over for blocking shots (12.83 blocks a game) and 20th last season (14.43). We blocked 16.9 in last season's playoffs, 18 in 15-16. We've blocked 17.75 shots a game so far this season; using per game stats, Maatta, Riikola and Johnson are all top 30 for blocking shots among dmen so far this season; Sheahan and Kessel top 30 for blocking shots among forwards.

I... uhm, I'm sorry, I forget what my point is in light of that news. Phil Kessel, shot blocker extraordinaire.

Uhm... okay, yeah, numbers maybe aren't all of it, I don't know how much of a science shot blocking is, whether we're holding the blocker responsible for getting the right angle so the puck doesn't rebound right to a shooter or anything. But for what the numbers are worth we've still got guys who'll block shots.

I'd like to take this moment to point out that, if Phil Kessel is blocking a shot a game, then regardless of whatever annoys the two men about each other, Sully and Kessel are capable of having a good working relationship that works for the team.

 

[Turin]

I'm not sure how much that's changed. We were 24th in the league in 15-16 after Sully took over for blocking shots (12.83 blocks a game) and 20th last season (14.43). We blocked 16.9 in last season's playoffs, 18 in 15-16. We've blocked 17.75 shots a game so far this season; using per game stats, Maatta, Riikola and Johnson are all top 30 for blocking shots among dmen so far this season; Sheahan and Kessel top 30 for blocking shots among forwards.

I... uhm, I'm sorry, I forget what my point is in light of that news. Phil Kessel, shot blocker extraordinaire.

Uhm... okay, yeah, numbers maybe aren't all of it, I don't know how much of a science shot blocking is, whether we're holding the blocker responsible for getting the right angle so the puck doesn't rebound right to a shooter or anything. But for what the numbers are worth we've still got guys who'll block shots.

I'd like to take this moment to point out that, if Phil Kessel is blocking a shot a game, then regardless of whatever annoys the two men about each other, Sully and Kessel are capable of having a good working relationship that works for the team.

Huh. Could have sworn they were blocking shots like mad in 16 and 17.

Either way you are right, the best way this team can defend is offensive pressure and neutral zone chaos.

 

[Peat]

Huh. Could have sworn they were blocking shots like mad in 16 and 17.

Either way you are right, the best way this team can defend is offensive pressure and neutral zone chaos.

Are you suggesting Phil Kessel blocking shots isn't the way of the future?

(I think the stats might look closer if we did shots blocked as a percentage of shots on target)

Yeah Shatt fits the theme of playing to our strengths, weaknesses be damned.

Problem is we're reaching the point where our weaknesses are beginning to lessen our strengths. We can mask the effects of puck movement from the back (and there was a good article in a Dallas paper about Oleksiak's success here which pointed out the extent to which our forwards led our breakouts) but we can't mask continually permitting clean zone entries. And tbh, preventing those is going to do more for breakouts than any amount of PMD. Better to have Dumo making breakout passes under little pressure than Letang trying to make the pass with two guys all over him.

 

[gdsmack267]

Time for Crosby to wake up. Its been 4 games, hes been invisible

 

[EightyOne]

The 2015-16 Penguins weren't defensive masters in their own zone, they were defensive masters at ensuring it came to that as little as possible.

I honestly think this year's version might be more capable in their own zone (or at least are when the mistakes settle down), but they have been far worse at keeping it out of there in the first place for a long time. Far far worse. And I think even with maximum effort they're not as good as 15-16. Not that the roster moves particularly agree with that assessment.

Yes their neutral zone and offensive zone containment was flawless.

It was a super stifling organism. They'd be in the face of a player with the puck and two others would cut off passing lanes. Meanwhile the defense would stagger to further limit options.

Result. Turnovers and dump ins that the slightly farther back d would gather.

It requires players knowing where they are on the ice and skating hard...nearly sprinting for your shift, to literally limit time and space for your opponent. Everyone always tries to limit time
.limit..space...blah blah blah but this team REALLY DID IT. That's f***ing rare.

They would also block shots. But that's more like the opposition was so tired after the third attempt through the neutral zone that they'd throw a shit outside point shot.

There's a reason so many of those games teams would only get 5 shots on goal in the third. They were spent because the Pens players were the most committed to a high energy game that we may ever see.

 

[Peat]

They were spent because the Pens players were the most committed to a high energy game that we may ever see.

Sometimes I wonder whether we simply need to replace more or less everyone who can be replaced from that run - whether we've basically wrecked them.

Then I realise its impossible. And take deserved comfort in things like the third period of that game, where we were all over them, and looking at stats from 15-16, where we got hammered in possession at times too. As long as this team really goes for it when the game is in the balance and looks good doing so, I'll remain fairly confident. I think the way they fought back against Washington, the way they buzzed when looking for a winner against Montreal, that shows there's still a lot of hunger. They just need to accept there's a higher floor needed for coasting on the back of leads. Need to get those basics right.

But at the same time, if we can get a new youth movement, make a few more Perron-Hagelin and Scuderi-Daley trades... the process will happen eventually, but more hunger will help. The difficulty lies in trading out good pieces while getting better.

 

[Andy99]

Sometimes I wonder whether we simply need to replace more or less everyone who can be replaced from that run - whether we've basically wrecked them.

Then I realise its impossible. And take deserved comfort in things like the third period of that game, where we were all over them, and looking at stats from 15-16, where we got hammered in possession at times too. As long as this team really goes for it when the game is in the balance and looks good doing so, I'll remain fairly confident. I think the way they fought back against Washington, the way they buzzed when looking for a winner against Montreal, that shows there's still a lot of hunger. They just need to accept there's a higher floor needed for coasting on the back of leads. Need to get those basics right.

But at the same time, if we can get a new youth movement, make a few more Perron-Hagelin and Scuderi-Daley trades... the process will happen eventually, but more hunger will help. The difficulty lies in trading out good pieces while getting better.

This is recognizing exactly what I believe....something has to change with the team or the results will be the same as last year...either system/coach or changing the mix of player, playing younger players....it’s a risk but if they can hit on something, we’ll be a contender again...I don’t think with all the age and players who’ve won Cups on this roster that we’ll get to the SCF without some changes....

 

[Peat]

This is recognizing exactly what I believe....something has to change with the team or the results will be the same as last year...either system/coach or changing the mix of player, playing younger players....it’s a risk but if they can hit on something, we’ll be a contender again...I don’t think with all the age and players who’ve won Cups on this roster that we’ll get to the SCF without some changes....

Maybe. I'm not sure if you've heard or not, but we came pretty close last year

Joshing aside, I'm comfortable enough with what we've got to keep riding it unless there's obviously better moves out there, but not so comfortable I don't find myself wishing for those moves. I'm hoping the current generation of WBS can give us 2-3 high quality grinders. That'd be big.

 

[Ogrezilla]

I think it's crazy to think we weren't a contender last year or that we aren't a contender this year.

 

[EightyOne]

Sometimes I wonder whether we simply need to replace more or less everyone who can be replaced from that run - whether we've basically wrecked them.

Then I realise its impossible. .

Funny, I've had the same thought. Like. Maybe we used up all the legs we had.

But yeah. I agree with the rest, too. That it is as good as it'll be.

 

[Ryder71]

I think it's crazy to think we weren't a contender last year or that we aren't a contender this year.

On paper we should be a serious contender. In actuality it really depends on the level of cohesion and consistency we play at. And if the majority of our roster plays to their respective abilities. It's really hard to say just how it will play out, but the talent is there IMO.

 

[Andy99]

I think it's crazy to think we weren't a contender last year or that we aren't a contender this year.

It’s sounds crazy but just remember that no team has ever won the Cup with more than four 30+ aged regular players...when you look at how the speed and youth of the game has increased in the last few years, it’s not as crazy as it seems....would you have thought MTL this year and NJD last year could beat us so decisively? We all were dreading the possibility of facing NJD in the POs last year....

 

[Andy99]

I think it's crazy to think we weren't a contender last year or that we aren't a contender this year.

It’s sounds crazy but just remember that no team has ever won the Cup with more than four 30+ aged regular players...when you look at how the speed and youth of the game has increased in the last few years, it’s not as crazy as it seems....would you have thought MTL this year and NJD last year could beat us so decisively? We all were dreading the possibility of facing NJD in the POs last year....

 

[EightyOne]

It’s sounds crazy but just remember that no team has ever won the Cup with more than four 30+ aged regular players...when you look at how the speed and youth of the game has increased in the last few years, it’s not as crazy as it seems....would you have thought MTL this year and NJD last year could beat us so decisively? We all were dreading the possibility of facing NJD in the POs last year....

Not only that. But it's a league where 75% of the teams are a contender for most of the year.

Then 50% have a shot.

Some clear juggernauts get abused in playoffs. Some trash rag tag teams look like stars. You NEVER know who's gonna be good and with so much of the league in play...well..yeah..Everyone should always be considered a threat.

 

[Shady Machine]

On paper we should be a serious contender. In actuality it really depends on the level of cohesion and consistency we play at. And if the majority of our roster plays to their respective abilities. It's really hard to say just how it will play out, but the talent is there IMO.

Can't you say that about nearly every playoff team?

 

[Shady Machine]

It’s sounds crazy but just remember that no team has ever won the Cup with more than four 30+ aged regular players...when you look at how the speed and youth of the game has increased in the last few years, it’s not as crazy as it seems....would you have thought MTL this year and NJD last year could beat us so decisively? We all were dreading the possibility of facing NJD in the POs last year....

You need some more context. It's been 4 games. The Caps are 2-2-1 and lost 6-0 to New Jersey. Shit happens in this league. We need a bigger sample size before saying this team isn't a contender.