Friedman: Sabres won't sell low on Girgensons

[CrypTic]

Few players of Girgensons' age are as good defensively. His offensive upside is still there, he's just not going to reach it if he's used on the 4th line, that's all.

This^

And to the poster a few ahead...he still is captain material down the line. He just won't ever get it over our current core.

If he's not going to get the playing time/linemates in Buffalo, especially with all your injuries, where do you think he'll get it? I don't know of any team that's just going to hand someone minutes or play them in the top 6/top 9 (depending on how the team views its lineup). Maybe a top draft pick that stood out in camp or revered veteran & core player who's played well with the team until this season but not anyone else.

 

[10coach*]

Not worth much

 

[DJN21]

If he's not going to get the playing time/linemates in Buffalo, especially with all your injuries, where do you think he'll get it? I don't know of any team that's just going to hand someone minutes or play them in the top 6/top 9 (depending on how the team views its lineup). Maybe a top draft pick that stood out in camp or revered veteran & core player who's played well with the team until this season but not anyone else.

Bylsma.

To be more of a devils advocate he is a center buried behind Eichel, reinhart, ror, larsson...he was drafted to be a 2C and was pushed down and forces to play both wings and center top line to bottom line. His development has been botched.

He can still play defense better than half your favorite team's players even at his age.

 

[Cirris]

Buffalo loses a Girgensons trade, he's a prime 'needed a change of scenery' example player. He'd be valuable to a good team as a 3rd or 4th line center that isn't deep at center.

Which is what I'm sure a lot of scouts are telling their GMs. And why GM's are calling the Sabres trying to poach him on the cheap. And, why Sabres are telling Friedman they aren't going to sell low.

Makes sense?!

It also explain partially why a bunch of Scouts were at the Sabres game a week ago. That and Murray trying to shop Kane.

 

[CrypTic]

Bylsma.

To be more of a devils advocate he is a center buried behind Eichel, reinhart, ror, larsson...he was drafted to be a 2C and was pushed down and forces to play both wings and center top line to bottom line. His development has been botched.

He can still play defense better than half your favorite team's players even at his age.

I understand that you think Bylsma has mishandled him. That may be true but doesn't answer my question which was, on which teams do you see him playing higher up in the lineup and getting better linemates? You can't turn back the clock and have him start as a rookie with another coach. It was a sincere question. He would be on the Sharks' 4th line or else playing wing bc we have Thornton, Couture, Hertl, Marleau, Tierney plus Carpenter, O'Regan, and Chartier in the AHL all fighting for the center position. Also, Wingels and Karlsson can play center. Off the top of my head, I can't think of a team where he'd play in the top 6. But maybe there are teams where he'd have a decent shot at that. I'm asking which teams you think are good candidates for that.

Don't know why you took a pot shot at the Sharks' defense. Thornton, Pavs, Couture, Marleau, Hertl and many of our forwards are very good defensively. It's how we managed to make the playoffs with bad defensemen beyond our top ones for so many years in the past. (We have excellent d-men now but that wasn't true two years ago.)

 

[tsujimoto74]

I understand that you think Bylsma has mishandled him. That may be true but doesn't answer my question which was, on which teams do you see him playing higher up in the lineup and getting better linemates? You can't turn back the clock and have him start as a rookie with another coach. It was a sincere question. He would be on the Sharks' 4th line or else playing wing bc we have Thornton, Couture, Hertl, Marleau, Tierney plus Carpenter, O'Regan, and Chartier in the AHL all fighting for the center position. Also, Wingels and Karlsson can play center. Off the top of my head, I can't think of a team where he'd play in the top 6. But maybe there are teams where he'd have a decent shot at that. I'm asking which teams you think are good candidates for that.

Don't know why you took a pot shot at the Sharks' defense. Thornton, Pavs, Couture, Marleau, Hertl and many of our forwards are very good defensively. It's how we managed to make the playoffs with bad defensemen beyond our top ones for so many years in the past. (We have excellent d-men now but that wasn't true two years ago.)

You say that like Girgs' play has anything to do with where he's slotted in the line-up. There have been times his play has justified how Bylsma uses him, but also plenty of times it hasn't. I'm sure there are lots of more reasonable coaches around the league who would reward his better nights with extra shifts. Also coaches that would give him some special teams time (at least PK).

 

[truthbluth]

You say that like Girgs' play has anything to do with where he's slotted in the line-up. There have been times his play has justified how Bylsma uses him, but also plenty of times it hasn't. I'm sure there are lots of more reasonable coaches around the league who would reward his better nights with extra shifts. Also coaches that would give him some special teams time (at least PK).

I don't even think he needs a different spot in the lineup, Bylsma just needs to stop rolling RoR's line 20+ minutes every single night. RoR wore down last year, and the same will happen this year if Disco Dan doesn't stop coaching scared, which is how I interpret rolling Eichel-RoR-Eichel-RoR-Larsson-RoR-Eichel-RoR every single game in the 3rd period. It's cowardice, and any short term rewards will be forgotten with his top players can't get up and down the ice from February on...again.

Bringing it back to Girgensons, he's been a good possession player this season and last, but his lack of time, esp PP time, and his quality of linemates have impacted his scoring stats. He's a good player, even if he'll never be the top 6 center we thought he would. I mean, he's not going to score much carrying Nic 'stone hands' Deslauriers around the ice 10 minutes a game. Slot Ennis there when he comes back, and give MM-ZG-TE 15 minutes/game, and I think you'll see him produce more like he did in 2013-14.

 

[King1s]

I would take Jankowski over Olli Matta every damn time.

I am sure you would. If Määttä was a flame, he'd be a norris candidate.

 

[Aladyyn]

If he's not going to get the playing time/linemates in Buffalo, especially with all your injuries, where do you think he'll get it? I don't know of any team that's just going to hand someone minutes or play them in the top 6/top 9 (depending on how the team views its lineup). Maybe a top draft pick that stood out in camp or revered veteran & core player who's played well with the team until this season but not anyone else.

Still holding out the hope that he gets a decent chance here.

 

[Orvald]

Still holding out the hope that he gets a decent chance here.

not with this coach.

 

[Aladyyn]

not with this coach.

that's the implication

 

[THall4]

I am sure you would. If Määttä was a flame, he'd be a norris candidate.

Flamers still trying to convince themselves Jankowski was a good pick at the position he was taken?

 

[Dreakon13]

I like all of the people coming out of the woodwork with "remember when Sabres fans said 'so-and-so' about Girgensons a few years ago". Do you realize how much the team has changed since then? For a short while there, Girgensons probably was our most productive player... or at least our most exciting rookie. Tank years.

He's not a bad player, he has moments where he makes bursting into the zone and scoring look easy. He's just not a very cerebral offensive player. He won't be effective if he's over-thinking things... which is happening a lot between Bylsma's "system", his questionable role on the team right now, and his own lacking performance/confidence. A system/role that affords him the opportunity to barrel in and crash the net every chance he gets, and a little more faith in him from the coaching staff, would probably go a long way.

 

[Bfreezy40]

Bjugstad for Girgensons?

I'd do this if Bjugstad can play LW we need a trigger man.

 

[CrypTic]

You say that like Girgs' play has anything to do with where he's slotted in the line-up. There have been times his play has justified how Bylsma uses him, but also plenty of times it hasn't.

I never said or implied that. I'm asking you on which teams you see him playing higher in the lineup. (It's asking you to sell your guy, since you seem to have missed that implication.) No one answering that question tells me that you don't.

I'm sure there are lots of more reasonable coaches around the league who would reward his better nights with extra shifts. Also coaches that would give him some special teams time (at least PK).

I'm sure there are too, on nights when he and his line are playing well. Or cutting his time (or benching him) when he and his line aren't. DeBoer will cut the third or usually fourth lines' time or move players around in the third period when we're down a goal, which is fairly often. That seems fairly common. It still doesn't change where he normally plays, which is a main determinant of his value (both to the team and in trade).

 

[Zip15]

The player the Flames traded down from to select Jankowski instead.... Feaster looks pretty brilliant about that move now

You and I may have different definitions of brilliant. On a related note, thanks for taking Sieloff (with the other pick in that deal) two picks before we selected McCabe. Brilliant!

 

[mrinsane]

Girgenson could turn into a second player but he'll become a 3rd liner.

 

[gwh]

Latest Friedman:

" Let’s do some game-related stuff. Ice time for Zemgus Girgensons' last seven games: 10:07, 9:08, 8:07, 8:39, 9:40, 7:23, 9:07. Buffalo is getting calls, but general manager Tim Murray is telling people the decreased usage doesn’t mean the Sabres will just give him away. I think Anaheim had some dialogue here last summer, but the asking price was one of the Ducks’ talented young defencemen — a cost they were unwilling to pay without some kind of sweetener."

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Never happening if you ask me.

 

[SnoopDogg]

Latest Friedman:

" Let’s do some game-related stuff. Ice time for Zemgus Girgensons' last seven games: 10:07, 9:08, 8:07, 8:39, 9:40, 7:23, 9:07. Buffalo is getting calls, but general manager Tim Murray is telling people the decreased usage doesn’t mean the Sabres will just give him away. I think Anaheim had some dialogue here last summer, but the asking price was one of the Ducks’ talented young defencemen — a cost they were unwilling to pay without some kind of sweetener."

---

Never happening if you ask me.

Yeah.. even as a Sabres fan I'd love one of their young defenseman but we'd need to add a LOT

 

[Tripod]

You want a young D? Philly will offer Hagg for Girgs.

 

[Mad Brills*]

Wonder if the young d was say manson/montour , not fowler.

 

[DapperCam]

Girgensons is an ideal 3rd line center or winger on a contender, who can fill in on the top 6 in a pinch. In Buffalo, that niche has been filled by the Foligno - Larsson - Gionta line, so Girgensons has been buried by Bylsma.

A good return for him would be a good second pairing defenseman on a good contract, or who Murray thinks he can extend. Youth isn't necessarily important, but he should match Buffalo's contention window.

 

[Tripod]

Girgensons is an ideal 3rd line center or winger on a contender, who can fill in on the top 6 in a pinch. In Buffalo, that niche has been filled by the Foligno - Larsson - Gionta line, so Girgensons has been buried by Bylsma.

A good return for him would be a good second pairing defenseman on a good contract, or who Murray thinks he can extend. Youth isn't necessarily important, but he should match Buffalo's contention window.

A good 2nd pairing Dman on a good contract is worth way more than a current 4th liner on pace for 15 points. 2nd pairing Dmen fetch 2nd line guys due to the lack of good defensemen in the league.

 

[DudeWhereIsMakar]

Burmistrov is the best they'll get from Winnipeg.

 

[DapperCam]

A good 2nd pairing Dman on a good contract is worth way more than a current 4th liner on pace for 15 points. 2nd pairing Dmen fetch 2nd line guys due to the lack of good defensemen in the league.

He's being underutilized due to roster makeup. The Sabres are in last place in goals for in the league (basically due to the circa 1995 NJ Devils system Bylsma is using).

You take any 3rd line center on a contender in the league, and stick him 8-10 min per game with no special teams time on the current Sabres 4th line with Grant and Delaurier, and they will produce the same as Girgensons currently is.

He's being put in a position where it is impossible to succeed, and that is why other GMs are sniffing around.