News Article: Sabres to name captain following camp; 10/7: Gionta 'C', Gorges 'A', Moulson 'A'

[Clock]

Even after letting this sit for a few days my reaction is "whatever."

At least we have them on contracts for a few years. Maybe this will end the letter merry-go-round.

 

[mikemcburn]

I'm still wondering if a couple recent decisions have come down to taking the easy way in the short term, no matter a possible butt bite in the longer term...

I haven't a clue about Gionta, just haven't ever followed him, but word around is that he's an upstanding guy and ideal 'C' material. So, okay, no prob, right?

Except that the Sabres have just put the 'C' on a guy who is starting his 3 year reign from the 3rd line at the age of 35. So in years 2 and 3 of Gionta's tenure, while today's sophomores and rookies are on the ice, where is their Captain? Scrounging for 4th line minutes, obliged into gracefully fading away, or another trade out?

Just seems to me that if Gionta, Mouslon and Gorges are such leaders, they don't need the letters and could readily step into mentoring roles for today's sophomores...

Putting the 'C' on Moulson (not my pick for other reasons) or Gorges, and tagging an 'A' on two of Myers, Hodgson and Ennis, would have stabilized the leadership in the short term without narrowing future options however the sophomores and rookies develop, are dealt, etc.

But that's just how I see things from afar and clearly Nolan doesn't have my number or he'd be icing Grigorenko (regardless of affect on Reinhart getting his 9 games) for the opener...

I just don't think youth is best developed by dangling unattainable carrots - and in Grigorenko's case, especially given how his development was arguably stalled due organizational issues. Playing word games after the fact ("we only said we wanted the decision to be rough, not that there was any hope our minds could be changed") is sucky too.

So yeah, Nolan doesn't have my number, lol.

 

[Paxon]

I'm still wondering if a couple recent decisions have come down to taking the easy way in the short term, no matter a possible butt bite in the longer term...

I haven't a clue about Gionta, just haven't ever followed him, but word around is that he's an upstanding guy and ideal 'C' material. So, okay, no prob, right?

Except that the Sabres have just put the 'C' on a guy who is starting his 3 year reign from the 3rd line at the age of 35. So in years 2 and 3 of Gionta's tenure, while today's sophomores and rookies are on the ice, where is their Captain? Scrounging for 4th line minutes, obliged into gracefully fading away, or another trade out?

Just seems to me that if Gionta, Mouslon and Gorges are such leaders, they don't need the letters and could readily step into mentoring roles for today's sophomores...

Putting the 'C' on Moulson (not my pick for other reasons) or Gorges, and tagging an 'A' on two of Myers, Hodgson and Ennis, would have stabilized the leadership in the short term without narrowing future options however the sophomores and rookies develop, are dealt, etc.

But that's just how I see things from afar and clearly Nolan doesn't have my number or he'd be icing Grigorenko (regardless of affect on Reinhart getting his 9 games) for the opener...

I just don't think youth is best developed by dangling unattainable carrots - and in Grigorenko's case, especially given how his development was arguably stalled due organizational issues. Playing word games after the fact ("we only said we wanted the decision to be rough, not that there was any hope our minds could be changed") is sucky too.

So yeah, Nolan doesn't have my number, lol.

What you see as a downside is an upside to me. Gionta will only be the captain for 2-3 seasons which opens up the captaincy for a long-term candidate. Maybe Reinhart, maybe a guy we draft this year, who knows? Maybe even an older guy like Myers if he takes that next step. It's good though. Why would you want Matt Moulson to be your captain for 5 years? This is the first time he's even been a full-time A in his NHL career. I preferred Gorges to Gionta, but Gionta's age and contract are a benefit to him being the choice. I don't know why you're assuming Gionta is going to be a fourth liner next season. That's pretty bold. Who the hell are going to be our six top 9 wingers above Gionta?

 

[Takeo]

I'm still wondering if a couple recent decisions have come down to taking the easy way in the short term, no matter a possible butt bite in the longer term...

I haven't a clue about Gionta, just haven't ever followed him, but word around is that he's an upstanding guy and ideal 'C' material. So, okay, no prob, right?

Except that the Sabres have just put the 'C' on a guy who is starting his 3 year reign from the 3rd line at the age of 35. So in years 2 and 3 of Gionta's tenure, while today's sophomores and rookies are on the ice, where is their Captain? Scrounging for 4th line minutes, obliged into gracefully fading away, or another trade out?

Just seems to me that if Gionta, Mouslon and Gorges are such leaders, they don't need the letters and could readily step into mentoring roles for today's sophomores...

Putting the 'C' on Moulson (not my pick for other reasons) or Gorges, and tagging an 'A' on two of Myers, Hodgson and Ennis, would have stabilized the leadership in the short term without narrowing future options however the sophomores and rookies develop, are dealt, etc.

But that's just how I see things from afar and clearly Nolan doesn't have my number or he'd be icing Grigorenko (regardless of affect on Reinhart getting his 9 games) for the opener...

I just don't think youth is best developed by dangling unattainable carrots - and in Grigorenko's case, especially given how his development was arguably stalled due organizational issues. Playing word games after the fact ("we only said we wanted the decision to be rough, not that there was any hope our minds could be changed") is sucky too.

So yeah, Nolan doesn't have my number, lol.

Good post. This kind of odd personnel decision-making has been par for the course for years now. It's practically ingrained in the franchise. We know last year was a complete debacle and I think it was mostly attributable to mixed signals from a bloated hockey operations department. I hope things eventually smooth out under Murray, but not holding my breath.

 

[mikemcburn]

What you see as a downside is an upside to me. Gionta will only be the captain for 2-3 seasons which opens up the captaincy for a long-term candidate. Maybe Reinhart, maybe a guy we draft this year, who knows? Maybe even an older guy like Myers if he takes that next step. It's good though. Why would you want Matt Moulson to be your captain for 5 years? This is the first time he's even been a full-time A in his NHL career. I preferred Gorges to Gionta, but Gionta's age and contract are a benefit to him being the choice. I don't know why you're assuming Gionta is going to be a fourth liner next season. That's pretty bold. Who the hell are going to be our six top 9 wingers above Gionta?

I see your point about age and contract length actually going in Gionta's favour (over Gorges and Moulson, in any case), but ultimately it could go either way depending upon where he fits into the lineup over his tenure.

To clarify, I'm on your page re: Moulson (he wasn't my pick for 'C' or 'A', if only due to his playing style) and would have readily gone for Gorges over Gionta (again, due mainly how I suspect Gionta's on-ice role will diminish over his tenure).

As for Gionta's on-ice role, I haven't made a prediction, bold or otherwise. Just voiced a concern, and one based only on his 3rd line start this year and not seeing how that doesn't go down from here. Not merely because of his role and production the last five seasons establish the recent trend, but also as you have hit on - "who knows" who is coming up behind him? There are a number of factors in play that don't speak to the notion Gionta has a long shelf life in the top 9.

Whichever of the three for 'C', I still would have put the 'A's onto sophomores. As it is, I can see it now - Gionta gone in 2-3 seasons followed by Moulson, due to his 'A' now, the default the replacement 'C' for 3 years after that. Not a prediction, just a hunch.

Edit: And unless what I saw of Moulson last year was an anomaly, I don't see him as an awesome 'C', or even much of a leader. Last year it was his linemates doing the heavy lifting, and whenever the kids could have used a guy stepping up and into the thick of things, it was Moulson floating casually, watching from afar with his dangling mouth guard. It'll take a long while to get those images out of my head ;-)

 

[Paxon]

I see your point about age and contract length actually going in Gionta's favour (over Gorges and Moulson, in any case), but ultimately it could go either way depending upon where he fits into the lineup over his tenure.

To clarify, I'm on your page re: Moulson (he wasn't my pick for 'C' or 'A', if only due to his playing style) and would have readily gone for Gorges over Gionta (again, due mainly how I suspect Gionta's on-ice role will diminish over his tenure).

As for Gionta's on-ice role, I haven't made a prediction, bold or otherwise. Just voiced a concern, and one based only on his 3rd line start this year and not seeing how that doesn't go down from here. Not merely because of his role and production the last five seasons establish the recent trend, but also as you have hit on - "who knows" who is coming up behind him? There are a number of factors in play that don't speak to the notion Gionta has a long shelf life in the top 9.

Whichever of the three for 'C', I still would have put the 'A's onto sophomores. As it is, I can see it now - Gionta gone in 2-3 seasons followed by Moulson, due to his 'A' now, the default the replacement 'C' for 3 years after that. Not a prediction, just a hunch.

Edit: And unless what I saw of Moulson last year was an anomaly, I don't see him as an awesome 'C', or even much of a leader. Last year it was his linemates doing the heavy lifting, and whenever the kids could have used a guy stepping up and into the thick of things, it was Moulson floating casually, watching from afar with his dangling mouth guard. It'll take a long while to get those images out of my head ;-)

I don't think the lack of an 'A' on a young player now will be a hindrance to any of them having C's or A's over the next 3 years. It shouldn't, anyhow. Personally I think at least one of the 'A's will be different next year, without any of these three captains leaving. It's not uncommon to change A's around like that. I definitely can't see Moulson being the next captain just because he's wearing an 'A' now; I was a bit surprised to see him get the 'A', though I have no problem with it.

This isn't to any specific point, but here are some players I think could and/or should factor into the leadership group in three years:
Old vets: Gorges and Moulson -- will likely be around, but I doubt Moulson still gets a letter. Other vet acquisitions would factor in of course
Young vets: Myers, Ennis, Hodgson, Foligno
Young players: Reinhart, Girgensons, Ristolainen, Pysyk

Throw in some guys who will be rookies between now and then like McCabe and Compher, guys who won't get letters by then but do factor into the group in all likelihood. If we draft "McEichel" that player shoots right to the top of likely long-term captain.

 

[ZeroPT*]

Good post. This kind of odd personnel decision-making has been par for the course for years now. It's practically ingrained in the franchise. We know last year was a complete debacle and I think it was mostly attributable to mixed signals from a bloated hockey operations department. I hope things eventually smooth out under Murray, but not holding my breath.

This is great.

Who would you have named captain?