Speculation: Ryan O'Reilly : Money-Money-Money-Money...Mo-ney!! Thread #6

[Bordeleau Of Blood]

From the latest LeBrun article:



The only thing I gather is that it will take a massive over payment to get ROR. Otherwise the Avs will just wait for ROR to break.

Good. If no one wants to pay their asking price, he sits. Simple as that. This is nowhere near a situation where the Avs have to trade him just to get something for him.

 

[RockLobster]

Good. If no one wants to pay their asking price, he sits. Simple as that. This is nowhere near a situation where the Avs have to trade him just to get something for him.

But they might have to adjust their asking price (both for a trade or ROR re-signing)

 

[thedoctor]

But they might have to adjust their asking price (both for a trade or ROR re-signing)

Says who? They can always just let him rot.

 

[henchman21]

Says who? They can always just let him rot.

They could, but it would be terrible asset management. I'm guessing that the Avs hope is that somebody decides they really need (or panics a bit) and ups their offer to a ridiculous level.

 

[Foppa2118]

From the latest LeBrun article:


In the meantime, everyone is waiting to see if/when Colorado moves Ryan O’Reilly. A long list of teams have inquired -- the likes of Ottawa, Toronto, Philadelphia, the Rangers, among other clubs -- but have been put off by the high asking price.

"I just think they don’t really want to move him unless it’s a home-run offer," said one Eastern Conference GM. "That’s their prerogative, really."

The only thing I gather is that it will take a massive over payment to get ROR. Otherwise the Avs will just wait for ROR to break.

These kind of tactics seem to be done more and more lately, and I'm not really buying it in this situation. Coincidentally the same kind of talk was happening last year when the Rangers were trying to get Nash.

They want to get a significant player without giving up any real significant players of their own, so they try and paint the other team as being unreasonable or asking for too much, to put pressure on them to drop their asking price.

I just find it odd that these GM's or whoever are even making public comments. What reason do they have, it's not about their player? Seems calculated to me.

 

[CalderKing21]

They could, but it would be terrible asset management. I'm guessing that the Avs hope is that somebody decides they really need (or panics a bit) and ups their offer to a ridiculous level.

no it wouldn't, smart move to call his bluff.
they can tell him no one values him like we do and with no other offers he has to sign.

 

[El_Loco_Avs]

They could, but it would be terrible asset management. I'm guessing that the Avs hope is that somebody decides they really need (or panics a bit) and ups their offer to a ridiculous level.

They have all the time in the world. More than RoR has anyway. It would be bad asset management not to try to squeeze every little bit of value of of that guy.

 

[henchman21]

no it wouldn't, smart move to call his bluff.
they can tell him no one values him like we do and with no other offers he has to sign.

Letting a #2C just rot and not play for multiple years is throwing away a valuable asset that could just cost Sherman his job in the end. Plus, if ROR was forced to sign a deal like that just to end it, he might not be the happiest camper in the locker room. I'm not saying he would be a cancer, but that possibility would surely be there.

 

[S E P H]

If that is the case, get this effer signed.

 

[henchman21]

They have all the time in the world. More than RoR has anyway. It would be bad asset management not to try to squeeze every little bit of value of of that guy.

I agree to a point. All except they don't have all the time in the world. They have until mid-July. That would be the point where the top free agents from this season are locked up and the teams that missed on them are looking for other ways to build their rosters. If this drags out until next season, ROR will lose value (I really don't think this happens).

 

[Foppa2118]

This plan is working out great. Should I sign a reasonable deal like my teammate did and just play hockey again? Or should I get extra sensitive during negotiations, and ask for more than I'm worth, and get nothing as a result?

 

[thedoctor]

They could, but it would be terrible asset management. I'm guessing that the Avs hope is that somebody decides they really need (or panics a bit) and ups their offer to a ridiculous level.

It would also be terrible asset management to give in to these ridiculous demands from O'Reilly, or to trade him for less than he's really worth.

O'Reilly has backed the Avs into a corner with this negotiation. The only options they have are losers for them -- overpay him, trade him for less than he's worth, look weak + overpay other RFAs for a long time, or let him rot. Those are all bad options. Letting him rot is by far the least objectionable -- they look tough in negotiations, they're not overpaying anyone, and they're not getting taken advantage of by another team.

O'Reilly deserves to rot for his stupidity and selfishness in all this. He can't see anything but his own perspective, and it's killing negotiations.

Letting a #2C just rot and not play for multiple years is throwing away a valuable asset that could just cost Sherman his job in the end. Plus, if ROR was forced to sign a deal like that just to end it, he might not be the happiest camper in the locker room. I'm not saying he would be a cancer, but that possibility would surely be there.

Actually, if he doesn't play this year, the Avs get get another year of RFA. Every year he refuses to play on the front end is another he has to play for us on the back end until he turns 23 -- 2 more years.

 

[henchman21]

It would also be terrible asset management to give in to these ridiculous demands from O'Reilly, or to trade him for less than he's really worth.

O'Reilly has backed the Avs into a corner with this negotiation. The only options they have are losers for them -- overpay him, trade him for less than he's worth, look weak + overpay other RFAs for a long time, or let him rot. Those are all bad options. Letting him rot is by far the least objectionable -- they look tough in negotiations, they're not overpaying anyone, and they're not getting taken advantage of by another team.

O'Reilly deserves to rot for his stupidity and selfishness in all this. He can't see anything but his own perspective, and it's killing negotiations.

So what you are saying is that having no player is better than having a 'bad deal' like MDZ + high end prospect.

I agree the Avs shouldn't overpay, but if it comes down to not having ROR or anybody for 13-14 or a 'bad deal' you have to take the bad deal. Letting a valuable asset sit for 2 seasons will cause a GM to lose their job.

 

[henchman21]

Actually, if he doesn't play this year, the Avs get get another year of RFA. Every year he refuses to play on the front end is another he has to play for us on the back end until he turns 23 -- 2 more years.

It would be 2 years of lost development, and ROR holding out for 2 years would make his value plummet. The a straight swap for MDZ suddenly would look like a great deal.

 

[Bonzai12]

Who would have though that when we drafted Ryan O’Reilly, we may have selected potentially the guy that could have one of the best KHL careers in history?

За тебя / За вас, ROR....see ya in Russia next year. On the plus side, you'll probably get a good seat to watching NHLers play at the Olympics in Sochi.

 

[Lonewolfe2015]

It would be 2 years of lost development, and ROR holding out for 2 years would make his value plummet. The a straight swap for MDZ suddenly would look like a great deal.

Quite true.

This will be over this summer, not a doubt in my mind. O'Reilly may very well agree to a cheaper deal towards the end of the season with the Avs so that he has basically a one year deal next season to prove himself with.

While that isn't ideal for us, I think Sherman would take 10-15 games of O'Reilly and 3.5mil next year if he agrees to it.

Otherwise, a team can knock our socks off if they want him.

 

[dahrougem2]

So what you are saying is that having no player is better than having a 'bad deal' like MDZ + high end prospect.

I agree the Avs shouldn't overpay, but if it comes down to not having ROR or anybody for 13-14 or a 'bad deal' you have to take the bad deal. Letting a valuable asset sit for 2 seasons will cause a GM to lose their job.

No it will not cost Sherman his job; if this were Matt Duchene maybe you might have a point but its not, its Ryan O'Reilly. For how much we love him, hes still just Ryan O'Reilly, a 3C with potential to become a solid 2C. The Avs have to either wait for the homerun offer in order to trade him, or let him rot back in Ontario missing out on playing NHL hockey.

Also, your "bad deal" of MDZ + a high end prospect was likely already rejected by Sather, I recall an article that stated Sather turned it down. Also, Sather probably wants no part of O'Reilly because he'll just try to give him a bridge deal, its the way Sather is with RFA's.

Personally I hope O'Reilly rots back home for as long as possible before finally giving in. Signs the deal, comes to practice and on the first day, scraps with Duchene. Second day, scraps with Landeskog. Third day, Scraps with Bordeleau. Then he'll have earned the respect of the locker-room lol..... Maybe on 1st game ask him to scrap the opposition's heavyweight too

 

[thedoctor]

So what you are saying is that having no player is better than having a 'bad deal' like MDZ + high end prospect.

I agree the Avs shouldn't overpay, but if it comes down to not having ROR or anybody for 13-14 or a 'bad deal' you have to take the bad deal. Letting a valuable asset sit for 2 seasons will cause a GM to lose their job.

Why do we need a guy for '13-'14? Are we suddenly contending? I doubt it. So why the urgency?

Did Poile lose his job for letting Radulov "sit?" When a player pulls **** like this, you can't blame the GM, especially when there are fair offers on the table. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink.

It would be 2 years of lost development, and ROR holding out for 2 years would make his value plummet. The a straight swap for MDZ suddenly would look like a great deal.

I agree losing those development years is a bad thing and it will hurt his value to some extent, but it's not like he's going to forget how to play hockey. He'll pick up where he left off when he comes back, especially if he was to continue to play in the KHL. And I consider this likely if he's not signed next summer.

Until he starts burning years of RFA on this holdout, I don't think his value will "plummet." If this holdout gets to that point, THEN it's time to trade him. I would be shocked if O'Reilly didn't break before that.

 

[thedoctor]

Quite true.

This will be over this summer, not a doubt in my mind. O'Reilly may very well agree to a cheaper deal towards the end of the season with the Avs so that he has basically a one year deal next season to prove himself with.

While that isn't ideal for us, I think Sherman would take 10-15 games of O'Reilly and 3.5mil next year if he agrees to it.

Otherwise, a team can knock our socks off if they want him.

I disagree. You're burning a year of RFA for a meaningless season. If he's not signed by the trade deadline, I don't think anything will happen until next summer. Sherman isn't dumb enough to let O'Reilly hook the hook like that. I think, at least.

 

[henchman21]

No it will not cost Sherman his job; if this were Matt Duchene maybe you might have a point but its not, its Ryan O'Reilly. For how much we love him, hes still just Ryan O'Reilly, a 3C with potential to become a solid 2C. The Avs have to either wait for the homerun offer in order to trade him, or let him rot back in Ontario missing out on playing NHL hockey.

Also, your "bad deal" of MDZ + a high end prospect was likely already rejected by Sather, I recall an article that stated Sather turned it down. Also, Sather probably wants no part of O'Reilly because he'll just try to give him a bridge deal, its the way Sather is with RFA's.

Personally I hope O'Reilly rots back home for as long as possible before finally giving in. Signs the deal, comes to practice and on the first day, scraps with Duchene. Second day, scraps with Landeskog. Third day, Scraps with Bordeleau. Then he'll have earned the respect of the locker-room lol..... Maybe on 1st game ask him to scrap the opposition's heavyweight too

The rumored deal was MDZ + Kreider/Miller... high end prospect can mean many things. IMO Skej, St. Croix, and Fasth all have real good potential, but less value than their top prospects. MDZ + Fasth wouldn't be a good deal for ROR, but better than getting nothing.

People's emotions of ROR still holding out are getting the best of them. It is never good to let a very valuable asset rot and lose value.

 

[Pokecheque]

Personally I hope O'Reilly rots back home for as long as possible before finally giving in. Signs the deal, comes to practice and on the first day, scraps with Duchene. Second day, scraps with Landeskog. Third day, Scraps with Bordeleau. Then he'll have earned the respect of the locker-room lol..... Maybe on 1st game ask him to scrap the opposition's heavyweight too

I'll take it.

 

[Foppa2118]

Who would have though that when we drafted Ryan O’Reilly, we may have selected potentially the guy that could have one of the best KHL careers in history?

За тебя / За вас, ROR....see ya in Russia next year. On the plus side, you'll probably get a good seat to watching NHLers play at the Olympics in Sochi.

Yea, he might be able to watch Matt Duchene, the guy he thinks he's worth more than, play for Canada.

 

[henchman21]

Why do we need a guy for '13-'14? Are we suddenly contending? I doubt it. So why the urgency?

Did Poile lose his job for letting Radulov "sit?" When a player pulls **** like this, you can't blame the GM, especially when there are fair offers on the table. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink.

Making the playoffs in 13-14 is absolutely needed if Sherman wants to keep his job. Not having ROR or the assets he would bring in would potentially cause this team to miss the playoffs yet again.

Poile had a lot better team and was in the playoffs every single year that Rads was gone. Still making the playoffs really helps keep your job. Lets just say that the Avs don't trade him and ROR sits out next season as well. If the Avs finish in the bottom 5 both years, do you really expect that Sherman will have a job?

 

[RoyIsALegend]

For how much we love him, hes still just Ryan O'Reilly, a 3C with potential to become a solid 2C.

I don't see many 55 point, 21 year old, 3rd line centremen around the league, but that might just be me...

 

[Pokecheque]

It is likely going to require a team give up a core piece and top prospect, maybe more, to land Ryan O'Reilly, since he himself is a core piece. This trade is going to change the respective dynamic of the Avs and the team they trade with substantially. You don't do those kinds of deals at the deadline, you only add big pieces to an already stacked roster for the most part.

I'd be very, very surprised if a deal was struck before the deadline.