Rumor: Rumors & Proposals Thread | Rainman Edition "I'm an Excellent Driver" Read OP and Watch Video For Educational Purposes

[Fourier]

If it goes to arbitration aren't we on the hook for whatever is offered? Meaning he would need to be moved before the ruling? Or traded after? Not sure how that works but I can't imagine we're able to keep Mcleod here for anything over 1.7 which seems to be an impossibility.

It leads me to wonder, if we do lose Mcleod and need to bring a guy in who is league minimum, or you know, let a guy like Holloway play C and bring in a Caggiula type to replace him on the wing...what kind of roster we are going into the season with compared to last. It's concerning to say the least if we do start the year without Yamo, Kostin, Bjugstad, and Mcleod. Will need to see what else transpires before start of the season.

edit: basically what I'm asking is, how do we find a way to address the problems on this roster given the cap hell Holland has put the club in? It seems like a near impossibility that we'll even be able to field a full roster that is in an undeniably worse spot than it was last year. This is not meant to be a doom & gloom post, rather, wondering how we are going to address the multiple areas of need when we're in this position. Treading water seems like an impossible ask.

He could be moved this year but the number matters for next year as well as it sets his QO. If they can squeeze it in this year they may not move him. But it may well mean that if he does not improve he does not get qualified. That's the part that Holland needs to make clear. We saw a lot of this happen with players of McLeod's level this year and I expect that this could happen next year as well as teams start to regroup for the rising cap.

The cap is an issue for sure but I actually don't see the roster as being worse than last year. I think it is possibly a modest step back from the playoff roster but while you disagree I know I feel the addition of Brown and a healthy Janmark compensates a lot for the loss of Bjugstad, Yamamoto and Kostin. Beyond that if Hyman and Kane are healthy I think the team that starts the season should be as good as the one that ended it even without growth from guys like Bouchard. But I also don't expect the roster that starts the season will be the one that finishes it. There is a good chance that there will be cap space available to add an Ekholm level player at the deadline.

 

[Heavy Dee]

Drai has been hanging out with Larsson on vacation via his instagram. Recruiting Larsson?

Or the other way around?

 

[duul]

He could be moved this year but the number matters for next year as well as it sets his QO. If they can squeeze it in this year they may not move him. But it may well mean that if he does not improve he does not get qualified. That's the part that Holland needs to make clear. We saw a lot of this happen with players of McLeod's level this year and I expect that this could happen next year as well as teams start to regroup for the rising cap.

The cap is an issue for sure but I actually don't see the roster as being worse than last year. I think it is possibly a modest step back from the playoff roster but while you disagree I know I feel the addition of Brown and a healthy Janmark compensates a lot for the loss of Bjugstad, Yamamoto and Kostin. Beyond that if Hyman and Kane are healthy I think the team that starts the season should be as good as the one that ended it even without growth from guys like Bouchard. But I also don't expect the roster that starts the season will be the one that finishes it. There is a good chance that there will be cap space available to add an Ekholm level player at the deadline.

You mean by moving Ceci + Foegele for a player type of scenario? How else could we accrue space to add a guy on that level otherwise?

Or the other way around?

Lol, yea ...

 

[SupremeTeam16]

Fair enough. I guess it was the only one from last year. Let's look a couple more years back to get a bigger picture. Gonna go over every forward who had an arbitration verdict over the last few years. The award and the ppg the season prior of which the arbitrator is working off of presumably.

Trenin awarded 1.7 x 2 -- 0.3 ppg
Bertuzzi awarded 3.5 x 1 -- 0.67 ppg
Copp awarded 2.28 x 2 -- 0.36 ppg
Grimaldi awarded 1 x 1 -- 0.24 ppg
Rodrigues awarded 1 x 2 -- 0.39 ppg

As we can see, Trenin put up a significanty less ppg than any of Cates, Newhook, and Mcleod and still got 1.7, this being as a considerably older player as well who can not take advantage of a factor of potential like some of the younger guys.

I don't see how an arbiter would award Mcleod less than 1.7, and after taking a sweetheart deal for us last year so we could fit into the cap, I can not fathom why he would sign for anything below 2. It makes zero sense for the player to sign here for 1.7 as the arbiter will very likely give him more, especially when considering comparables that were signed in this offseason. Mcleod owes us no favours, he did his part last year.

Arb awards from over two years ago likely aren’t relevant in todays cap situation.

But like I said I don’t believe this goes to arbitration. The Oilers will offer him as much as they are able to and he will take it. Cloud doesn’t owe the Oilers anything but he should be mindful that he’s got a good situation here and the leagues recent history is littered with young players pushing for more money early only to see themselves become overpriced assets as roster spots go to cheaper players.

 

[Fourier]

You mean by moving Ceci + Foegele for a player type of scenario? How else could we accrue space to add a guy on that level otherwise?


Lol, yea ...

Yah, it could well be moving those two. But it may not require that. If the Oilers can avoid going into LTIR at the deadline they could accrue enough cap space so that they would not have to move both especially if there was retention on the other end. If the Oilers went into the deadline with $750K in space that is enough to add $3M to the cap.

 

[5 Mins 4 Ftg]

I really want to see the BlackBerry movie. I have known lots of people involved in the company at all levels including a casual acquaintance with Mike Lazaridis who is a very interesting character. From what I gather the movie has little to do with what actually happened but it is suppose to be very entertaining nonetheless.

It did seem rather over the top on how it portrayed Lazaridis and Balsillie but movies tend to exaggerate personality traits in the short time span of the movie.

But the movie told a compelling story nonetheless and I found it entertaining and quite enjoyable.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

If it goes to arbitration aren't we on the hook for whatever is offered? Meaning he would need to be moved before the ruling? Or traded after? Not sure how that works but I can't imagine we're able to keep Mcleod here for anything over 1.7 which seems to be an impossibility.

It leads me to wonder, if we do lose Mcleod and need to bring a guy in who is league minimum, or you know, let a guy like Holloway play C and bring in a Caggiula type to replace him on the wing...what kind of roster we are going into the season with compared to last. It's concerning to say the least if we do start the year without Yamo, Kostin, Bjugstad, and Mcleod. Will need to see what else transpires before start of the season.

edit: basically what I'm asking is, how do we find a way to address the problems on this roster given the cap hell Holland has put the club in? It seems like a near impossibility that we'll even be able to field a full roster that is in an undeniably worse spot than it was last year. This is not meant to be a doom & gloom post, rather, wondering how we are going to address the multiple areas of need when we're in this position. Treading water seems like an impossible ask.

Worse.

The roster will be significantly worse.

Caggiula is not an NHLer anymore and anyone that we brought in at league minimum to "replace" McLeod would be orders of magnitude worse. McLeod was the guy that stirred the drink for the entire bottom six.

 

[Arpeggio]

If McLeod makes too much I think the obvious choice is to move Foegele and replace him with a minimum free agent. I know everyone loves him but there are guys out there that could get close to his production.

I worry about management's attachment to Foegele and Kulak. Like if Broberg shows up this year and plays well, are we really going to hang on to Kulak for sentimental reasons? I like him and think he's an absolute gamer, but he's your third pairing dman, and your top two LD both PK.

 

[joestevens29]

If McLeod makes too much I think the obvious choice is to move Foegele and replace him with a minimum free agent. I know everyone loves him but there are guys out there that could get close to his production.

I worry about management's attachment to Foegele and Kulak. Like if Broberg shows up this year and plays well, are we really going to hang on to Kulak for sentimental reasons? I like him and think he's an absolute gamer, but he's your third pairing dman, and your top two LD both PK.

Meh, same was said about Yamo. First we need guys like Broberg to actually show up.

Even if he does there is little reason to move Kulak until next off-season. Broberg needs a strong regular season and playoffs before I start moving guys out for him.

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

The Yotes are very pathetic, it's very funny.

 

[Arpeggio]

Meh, same was said about Yamo. First we need guys like Broberg to actually show up.

Even if he does there is little reason to move Kulak until next off-season. Broberg needs a strong regular season and playoffs before I start moving guys out for him.

I definitely see your logic, and maybe that is the right way to go, but 5 million in cap on a bottom pairing d man and a third line lw doesn't make a ton of sense to me if there is an option to bring an impact player in. I'm happy with the roster where it's at assuming they bring back McLeod and Bouchard, so hopefully they can get those guys in at a reasonable number.

 

[McDNicks17]

If McLeod makes too much I think the obvious choice is to move Foegele and replace him with a minimum free agent. I know everyone loves him but there are guys out there that could get close to his production.

I worry about management's attachment to Foegele and Kulak. Like if Broberg shows up this year and plays well, are we really going to hang on to Kulak for sentimental reasons? I like him and think he's an absolute gamer, but he's your third pairing dman, and your top two LD both PK.

Ditching both Foegele and Kulak is a pretty obvious move to me.

Replace them with Holloway and Broberg. If they falter, you can trade like a 4th rounder for wingers and defensemen better than Foegele and Kulak at the deadline that are also probably cheaper on the cap.

If the idea is to go all-in with the Brown contract, you can't have $4M in deadweight at the bottom of your roster.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

If McLeod makes too much I think the obvious choice is to move Foegele and replace him with a minimum free agent. I know everyone loves him but there are guys out there that could get close to his production.

I worry about management's attachment to Foegele and Kulak. Like if Broberg shows up this year and plays well, are we really going to hang on to Kulak for sentimental reasons? I like him and think he's an absolute gamer, but he's your third pairing dman, and your top two LD both PK.

this organization needs to take a page out of Vegas' book. Some tough decisions need to be made, and guys such as Foegele and Kulak might be casualties. If the bandaid needs to be ripped off, rip it off.

 

[Arpeggio]

Ditching both Foegele and Kulak is a pretty obvious move to me.

Replace them with Holloway and Broberg. If they falter, you can trade like a 4th rounder for wingers and defensemen better than Foegele and Kulak at the deadline that are also probably cheaper on the cap.

If the idea is to go all-in with the Brown contract, you can't have $4M in deadweight at the bottom of your roster.

Exactly. Kulak is great, but he also cost you a second round pick to acquire. Those types of players will be available at the deadline. If you can grab an impact RD, or a top six forward, and Kulak or Foegele is preventing you from doing that, I think you have to move them out.

 

[TopShelfGloveSide]

The Yotes are very pathetic, it's very funny.

I wonder what he did.

 

[joestevens29]

I definitely see your logic, and maybe that is the right way to go, but 5 million in cap on a bottom pairing d man and a third line lw doesn't make a ton of sense to me if there is an option to bring an impact player in. I'm happy with the roster where it's at assuming they bring back McLeod and Bouchard, so hopefully they can get those guys in at a reasonable number.

Lol I get that logic as well.

My larger concern about the d is something that goes back many many years. We continued to hope young guys would fill voids and they never did. I really hate to move Kulak right now only to find out Broberg can't cut it and then we are looking for a Kulak later on this year at a premium.

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

I wonder what he did.

I'm 1000% blaming the Yotes first. I suspect they promised him a certain spot, then took that away lol.

 

[joestevens29]

I wonder what he did.

Logically speaking he could've taken one look at their facilities and they took one look at his play from last year and decided maybe this isn't a good move.

 

[Sanchez]

 

[Arpeggio]

Lol I get that logic as well.

My larger concern about the d is something that goes back many many years. We continued to hope young guys would fill voids and they never did. I really hate to move Kulak right now only to find out Broberg can't cut it and then we are looking for a Kulak later on this year at a premium.

Just for fun, let's say every free agent currently available was willing to sign here for 1.5 million. Would you rather ice this bottom six and bottom pairing:

Foegele - McLeod - Janmark
Holloway - Ryan - Lavoie

Kulak - Broberg

or:

Kane - Toews - Janmark
Holloway - McLeod - Ryan

Broberg - Desharnais

I know it's a bit unrealistic, and who knows who would actually come here. I also actually forgot who the Oilers currently have signed for the bottom six lol (is Lavoie really the 4th line RWer right now?). But my point is that 4 million could go so far right now.

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

Absolutely on the Yotes lol

 

[joestevens29]

Just for fun, let's say every free agent currently available was willing to sign here for 1.5 million. Would you rather ice this bottom six and bottom pairing:

Foegele - McLeod - Janmark
Holloway - Ryan - Lavoie

Kulak - Broberg

or:

Kane - Toews - Janmark
Holloway - McLeod - Ryan

Broberg - Desharnais

I know it's a bit unrealistic, and who knows who would actually come here. I also actually forgot who the Oilers currently have signed for the bottom six lol (is Lavoie really the 4th line RWer right now?). But my point is that 4 million could go so far right now.

I don't have much love for Kane or Toews to be honest.

Kane is out of action for quite sometime and Toews honestly doesn't mentally seem to be in the game anymore.

The other issue I have with Broberg and Desharnais outside of them still both having major holes. Is I don't think the 4 guys above them are good enough to let us run with that inexperienced of a blueline.

Up front I do think we can afford a weaker 4th line and let Foegele go if need be. We have a strong top 6 and our third line regardless should be decent enough too. But on the back end I don't think we have the manpower to have that risky of a 3rd pairing.

Absolutely on the Yotes lol

Well to me this tells me that he must've did something, as unconditional waivers generally are when both parties agree.

Question now is, has the PA actually reached out to Galchenyuk's camp to confirm?

 

[Canovin]

I wonder what he did.

He commented on their arena

 

[Fourier]

It did seem rather over the top on how it portrayed Lazaridis and Balsillie but movies tend to exaggerate personality traits in the short time span of the movie.

But the movie told a compelling story nonetheless and I found it entertaining and quite enjoyable.

I met Laz in NYC at an event around the Opening Bell Ceremony at the NYSE. I found him to be very down to earth. Pretty much everyone I knew who knew Laz liked him. I can't say the same for Balsille.

Laz has a very interesting backstory. He was an engineering student who wanted to make a fortune so that he could one day fund a physics institute which he did do. The Perimeter Institute ha snow become a very well respected independent research institute. Before his death Hawking held a Distinguished Visiting Research Chair. The Director at the time, Neil Turok was a colleague of Hawking at Cambridge.

History | Perimeter Institute

From notion to groundbreaking research & discoveries in theoretical physics & award-winning ideas about the origin of our universe, it’s Perimeter history.

perimeterinstitute.ca

He is also a major contributor to the the University of Waterloo's Institute for Quantum Computing and Institute for Nanotechnology.

Before I met Laz I use to see him around town a lot often in small local restaurants. One of the last time I saw him was at the height of RIM's success. He would have been worth about $6B at that time. He and his son were in front of my wife and I in the HMV at the local mall. He was buying DVD's and the clerk, who was in his early 20's, was trying to hard sell him on signing up for their points program. Laz's order came to about $120 and the first big sale was that he'd get a 10% discount on the purchase. Laz declined and then the guy asks Laz if he likes music. Laz said yes and the clerk asked who he was listening to these days. Laz kind of shrugged and said he liked U2. He then pointed to a reproduction of an autographed photo of Bono behind the counter and said that with enough points Laz could get one of those. What the kid did not realize is that Laz actually knew Bono personally. RIM had signed a partnership deal with U2 and that RIM rented out the Skydome for a concert for the RIM employees. Rather than saying anything Laz politely declined, paid for his dvd's and left.

When I got to the counter after listening to this hard sell I asked the kid if he knew who that guy was. He said no. I told him it was Mike Lazaridis...The kids response was classic. He dropped his head and out loud said... Ah sh## I blew it. I should have asked him for a job. Turns out the kid was a computer science student working part-time to make some extra cash who would have killed to work at RIM.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

The Coyotes could eat babies and Gary would still look the other way.