Prospect Info: Round 7, Pick 196: Wyatt Kalynuk, D, Bloomington (USHL) -> Wisconsin

[wankstifier]

Ok. We will agree to disagree on that.

Why's that?

 

[CSKA1974]

Why's that?

Because, I might have undervalued Wyatt and you might have overvalued him.
Also, this conversation started with "losing an asset for free", but no one on this board has any information about communication between him and the team.

 

[Magua]

I wasted many hours watching Wisconsin hockey. I’d just like to know that everyone who questions his play, his value, whatever......saw him even once. Because there’s a whole lot of minimization combined with factual evasion.

But now we get to play my favorite game: the waiting game. Let’s see what he does as a pro.

 

[captainpaxil]

There's no way he is a straight to the NHL prospect.

Definitely not here but he does have nhl wheels and given a different developmental approach on a team with less depth he would have a shot.
I think he's a very figure out what we have in training camp guy. He's 23 so it's not he's going to be physically not ready or they have to be overly concerned with ruining his confidence. On a team that needs pp help or is short on pmd he has a much better chance. That's not the flyers.
My prediction is a long look at camp and be sent down with homework.

How would those who follow college hockey closer than me compare him to Friedman? I feel Thier paths will be similar they're about the same age though I think Friedman is more likely to be a player but kalynuk has a higher upside

 

[orangey]

Chicago wouldn't have given much for Kalynuk, just look at their depth chart, they're actually deeper than the Flyers in young defensive prospects and have a roster logjam with 5 veterans signed through 2022.

Interesting that he didn't go to the place with the easiest path to the NHL. He must have really liked Chicago.

 

[wankstifier]

Because, I might have undervalued Wyatt and you might have overvalued him.
Also, this conversation started with "losing an asset for free", but no one on this board has any information about communication between him and the team.

I don't really have an opinion since I've never seen Kalynuk play. I was just spitballing value given Kalynuk's apparent success in two respected leagues.

The comparison between Marody and Kalynuk seems somewhat reasonable? I know there are notable differences: position, age, draft position. Still, they're later round selections who improved markedly in the NCAA. I'm not sure why'd you'd disagree that Kalynuk's stock might rise?

 

[wasup]

Kalynuk was passed over twice and has since proven his worth. Seems apt to me.

Draft position means very little when we are three years removed from when it took place.

I think you are just higher on him than some on here are .

I am not pleased that we lost an asset for nothing either but we just have to many young D men ahead of him . He has always had the heads up puck carrying flashy skills but had really struggled with the defensive side of things ,especially board work . He has had trouble stopping things like the cycle in the past but i will admit he has gotten a little better but still has a way to go .

I am also not really shocked we lost him cause as i said in the past . the family was hoping he was not drafted that way he could pick and choose where he plays if he continued to develop . Anyways i still wish him the best and hope things work out for him being a hometown Toban and all .

 

[CSKA1974]

I don't really have an opinion since I've never seen Kalynuk play. I was just spitballing value given Kalynuk's apparent success in two respected leagues.

The comparison between Marody and Kalynuk seems somewhat reasonable? I know there are notable differences: position, age, draft position. Still, they're later round selections who improved markedly in the NCAA. I'm not sure why'd you'd disagree that Kalynuk's stock might rise?

That maybe the case, but as of right now, he is just a projection not a proven commodity. Many a time players fail to transition from NCAA to the pro level. I am not saying that Wyatt is a bust, I am saying that his value at the pro level is nothing more than hypothetical. Would I be ok if Flyers signed or traded him. Absolutely! But I do not know what was his message to the team brass and what conversations happened there.

 

[CSKA1974]

I wasted many hours watching Wisconsin hockey. I’d just like to know that everyone who questions his play, his value, whatever......saw him even once. Because there’s a whole lot of minimization combined with factual evasion.

But now we get to play my favorite game: the waiting game. Let’s see what he does as a pro.

Could you share your opinion of his skill set please?

 

[Stizzle]

Marody was traded when he still had 17 months until he became a free agent.

I didn't realize that was being take into consideration. I missed that context in the discussion. I was purely speaking about value of the player. Not anything leverage related regarding a trade.

 

[FLYguy3911]

I think you are just higher on him than some on here are .

I am not pleased that we lost an asset for nothing either but we just have to many young D men ahead of him . He has always had the heads up puck carrying flashy skills but had really struggled with the defensive side of things ,especially board work . He has had trouble stopping things like the cycle in the past but i will admit he has gotten a little better but still has a way to go .

I am also not really shocked we lost him cause as i said in the past . the family was hoping he was not drafted that way he could pick and choose where he plays if he continued to develop . Anyways i still wish him the best and hope things work out for him being a hometown Toban and all .

1. I have him firmly in a second tier of prospects, along with a handful of other players who project to be bottom 6/bottom pair players.

2. Even if I am higher on him than others, what does that have to do with what I said?

 

[deadhead]

I see nothing that suggests Kalynuk was as good as Ghost coming out of college as a junior at 21, or York and Zamula right now.
He's probably better than Friedman coming out after 3 years of college play with lesser talent and similar statistics, but how much better?

If he doesn't make the Blackhawks this fall, he'll be 24 in 2021-22, fighting for a spot with a half dozen 1st to 3rd rd draft picks on a roster with 5 guaranteed NHL contracts for veteran defensemen.
So there's no guarantee he ever has a NHL career.

It's not like the Flyers had any control, they followed him closely, kept in touch, obviously he wanted to stay in the Midwest, because Chicago is not the best situation for him. Chicago has more young depth on defense in their organization.

 

[wankstifier]

That maybe the case, but as of right now, he is just a projection not a proven commodity. Many a time players fail to transition from NCAA to the pro level. I am not saying that Wyatt is a bust, I am saying that his value at the pro level is nothing more than hypothetical. Would I be ok if Flyers signed or traded him. Absolutely! But I do not know what was his message to the team brass and what conversations happened there.

Marody didn't prove himself at a pro level either. He was traded for a 3rd before any pro experience.

 

[CSKA1974]

Marody didn't prove himself at a pro level either. He was traded for a 3rd before any pro experience.

Well, there are GMs that buy on promise, and then there are those who do not. There are human biases that this discussion has not included so far.
And then again, we will never know what happened between Wyatt and Flyers.

 

[wankstifier]

Well, there are GMs that buy on promise, and then there are those who do not. There are human biases that this discussion has not included so far.
And then again, we will never know what happened between Wyatt and Flyers.

Yeah, I dunno... I think it pays to be proactive and have an honest conversation with drafted prospects about signability. The Predators found that they weren't able to sign Vesey and traded his rights fairly close to his free agency. I think Vesey had more hype than Kalynuk, so he got traded for a 3rd at a pretty late stage.

Not sure what Kalynuk could've fetched in a trade, but there was ample opportunity to at least get some return. I'm not bent out of shape about the Flyers possibly losing the prospect for nothing since they have good depth. However, this kind of loss can add up, especially as Fletcher trades more mid to late round picks for NHL talent.

 

[deadhead]

Actually I don't think there was any opportunity to trade Kalynuk, with the college season truncated, and uncertainty about this year and next year's NHL seasons, teams were going to hoard draft picks.

Kalynuk is not Fox, he wasn't in high demand, you didn't see a flurry of stories of teams contacting him or being mentioned as possible landing spots. So in this environment, getting anything for him would have been a bonus.

 

[wasup]

1. I have him firmly in a second tier of prospects, along with a handful of other players who project to be bottom 6/bottom pair players.

2. Even if I am higher on him than others, what does that have to do with what I said?

You said you think his value in a trade of his rights is a second round pick and that's what i'm questioning . I think with his age and the fact that he is close to free agency a 4th would be more realistic . imo

 

[Curufinwe]

Yeah, I dunno... I think it pays to be proactive and have an honest conversation with drafted prospects about signability. The Predators found that they weren't able to sign Vesey and traded his rights fairly close to his free agency. I think Vesey had more hype than Kalynuk, so he got traded for a 3rd at a pretty late stage.

Buffalo took a punt on trading for his rights and wasted a 3rd cause he was set on signing in New York.

Then three years later they traded another 3rd to get him.

https://www.capfriendly.com/trades/players/jimmy-vesey

 

[FLYguy3911]

You said you think his value in a trade of his rights is a second round pick and that's what i'm questioning . I think with his age and the fact that he is close to free agency a 4th would be more realistic . imo

Nope. That’s not what I said. That is how you interpreted it.

I said, in my opinion, that his expected value as a player was equivalent to about a second round pick. As with Vorobyev, that doesn’t mean I expected that return in a trade.

 

[wasup]

Nope. That’s not what I said. That is how you interpreted it.

I said, in my opinion, that his expected value as a player was equivalent to about a second round pick. As with Vorobyev, that doesn’t mean I expected that return in a trade.

Yup my bad .

 

[rinaldo]

Actually I don't think there was any opportunity to trade Kalynuk, with the college season truncated, and uncertainty about this year and next year's NHL seasons, teams were going to hoard draft picks.

Kalynuk is not Fox, he wasn't in high demand, you didn't see a flurry of stories of teams contacting him or being mentioned as possible landing spots. So in this environment, getting anything for him would have been a bonus.

Wrong the GM being incompetent didnt even try to trade him......this kind of loss can add up

 

[GKJ]

I think Fletcher had a pretty good idea what his intentions were a ways back given he managed to sign Allison and Laczynski in succession. Would've been nice to use as a sweetener at the deadline. Otherwise someone's gotta really like him like the Oilers did with Marody. If the Blackhawks really thought he was Nick Leddy, they wouldn't have nor should they have waited for him to become a free agent.

 

[renberg]

I see nothing that suggests Kalynuk was as good as Ghost coming out of college as a junior at 21, or York and Zamula right now.
He's probably better than Friedman coming out after 3 years of college play with lesser talent and similar statistics, but how much better?

If he doesn't make the Blackhawks this fall, he'll be 24 in 2021-22, fighting for a spot with a half dozen 1st to 3rd rd draft picks on a roster with 5 guaranteed NHL contracts for veteran defensemen.
So there's no guarantee he ever has a NHL career.

It's not like the Flyers had any control, they followed him closely, kept in touch, obviously he wanted to stay in the Midwest, because Chicago is not the best situation for him. Chicago has more young depth on defense in their organization.

I agree with your assessment of Kalynuk versus Ghost, York and Zamula. As far as Friedman goes, I'm not sure that i'd put Kalynuk ahead of him. Kalynuk was older and playing against college guys that he should have showed up because of his age and experience (most NHL potential collegiate players are gone after their second season at age 20 or third season at the last). I have watched him play since the Flyers drafted him and I was not overly impressed with him. He has some wheels which he benefited from being on the collegiate ice shield. He has a decent, not a great shot; good enough to run a college PP but not one that would make him first shot in the show. Physicality is not his greatest suit.
One other thing that grinds me, having been a former coach, albeit in another sport, is that Kalynuk was the captain of this year's Badger team. He was quoted as saying that it was the reason why he didn't go pro before last season. Yet this team that he captained vastly underperformed and had discipline problems. As a coach you rely on your captain to help push the players with their game and certainly corral the teammates off of the ice to keep them out of situations that might lead to suspensions. Something seems to be missing here with Kalynuk's leadership.

 

[rinaldo]

I think Fletcher had a pretty good idea what his intentions were a ways back given he managed to sign Allison and Laczynski in succession. Would've been nice to use as a sweetener at the deadline. Otherwise someone's gotta really like him like the Oilers did with Marody. If the Blackhawks really thought he was Nick Leddy, they wouldn't have nor should they have waited for him to become a free agent.

tampering indirectly or directly happens. They i am sure had an idea that there was no need to trade a pick for him.

when he signed those other 2, wyatt didst declare yet did he? it was after so maybe he didnt Kiev Fletcher any idea at all he was leaving college.

 

[GKJ]

tampering indirectly or directly happens. They i am sure had an idea that there was no need to trade a pick for him.

when he signed those other 2, wyatt didst declare yet did he? it was after so maybe he didnt Kiev Fletcher any idea at all he was leaving college.

It was after, but being unable to get him signed should've been the first hint and that should've gone back to last summer.