Roster Speculation 2015-16 Pt. I

[My Cozen Dylan]

Would something around Isles 1st, Grigorenko and Hodgson for Kessel be close.....is this in the ballpark? If not how much do we add or is this something that is not of interest. We minimize Kessel's contract by moving Hodgson in the deal as a tradable asset.

No. I read they're looking at something like FLA's 1st (11th)+Gudbranson+Huberdeau for Kessel and a B prospect.

 

[flashsabre]

Would something around Isles 1st, Grigorenko and Hodgson for Kessel be close.....is this in the ballpark? If not how much do we add or is this something that is not of interest. We minimize Kessel's contract by moving Hodgson in the deal as a tradable asset.

Kessel needs a fresh start in a new city in the worst way but I doubt that gets you Kessel. I would make that trade. Kessel got a bad rap in Toronto with the media but he is a major talent for what he does well (score) and him on Eichel's wing would be the quickest, most exciting duo in Buffalo since Lafontaine-Mogilny. He is a one way force though meaning the defensive side of the game is non existent.

I don't think he fits into what Murray is trying to build here but he would be fun to watch skating alongside Kane and Eichel.

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

I absolutely do not want anything to do with Kessel. Yes, he would score and probably be a lot of fun to watch next to Eichel. They would sell lots of tickets, not that there would be any seats left to sell in Buffalo. But all that regular season excitement goes out the window and doesn't matter one bit when the playoffs start. Kessel is not the type of player that will excel in the post-season. He'll get rubbed out along the boards when the other team is trying hard.

I have serious doubts about the Kane trade, but at least he's the type of player to still be productive in the playoffs with a forecheck and physicality.

 

[mikemcburn]

Seeing how the Hodgson+ trade concepts continue, I'll call it again - if he is traded before having a chance to regain value in a top six role to start the season, then bets it'll be in a goalie deal. For example, with Vancouver. Seriously. Consider:

To Sabres: Burrows, Markstrom
To Sabres: Hodgson+2nd/3rd

Burrows comes in at $4.0m, plays a game even Nolan would love, fits anywhere in the top 6, etc. (spoiler alert: I'm a big Burrows fan), and the Canucks gotta do something with 3rd string 25 year old Markstrom: "often called the best goalie not playing in the NHL — Markstrom has played 50 career games in the bigs with Florida and Vancouver — his body of work in the AHL is impressive. He went 22-7-2 for the Comets this season with a .934 save percentage and five shutouts... The best fit for Markstrom would be an NHL club where he could work in tandem with a designated starter and still get a good number of starts."

Canucks are also are thin up front with proven offense, aren't afraid to look at guys with questionable defensive styles (see: trade deadline deal for a small offensive project), and are desperate for picks (1 st, 0 2nds or 3rds).

In Hodgson, Sabres have that proven offense who doesn't especially fit any more, and a bucket of picks to play the wheeling 'n dealing game. Maybe plug Grigorenko into a package. More than picks, Canucks need some NHL ready talent to develop.

Swapping Burrows/Hodgson is like swapping dollar values, an older veteran character that fits the Sabres mold, for a younger proven guy whose value has diminished with a dismal campaign.

 

[Caroline Says ll]

I absolutely do not want anything to do with Kessel. Yes, he would score and probably be a lot of fun to watch next to Eichel. They would sell lots of tickets, not that there would be any seats left to sell in Buffalo. But all that regular season excitement goes out the window and doesn't matter one bit when the playoffs start. Kessel is not the type of player that will excel in the post-season. He'll get rubbed out along the boards when the other team is trying hard.

I have serious doubts about the Kane trade, but at least he's the type of player to still be productive in the playoffs with a forecheck and physicality.

Kessel has 21 points in 22 games in the playoffs. He plays essentially the way P.Kane plays. They both are effective at slowing play. Kessel will be no where as good, but he has produced.

 

[Sabre the Win]

Seeing how the Hodgson+ trade concepts continue, I'll call it again - if he is traded before having a chance to regain value in a top six role to start the season, then bets it'll be in a goalie deal. For example, with Vancouver. Seriously. Consider:

To Sabres: Burrows, Markstrom
To Sabres: Hodgson+2nd/3rd

Burrows comes in at $4.0m, plays a game even Nolan would love, fits anywhere in the top 6, etc. (spoiler alert: I'm a big Burrows fan), and the Canucks gotta do something with 3rd string 25 year old Markstrom: "often called the best goalie not playing in the NHL — Markstrom has played 50 career games in the bigs with Florida and Vancouver — his body of work in the AHL is impressive. He went 22-7-2 for the Comets this season with a .934 save percentage and five shutouts... The best fit for Markstrom would be an NHL club where he could work in tandem with a designated starter and still get a good number of starts."

Canucks are also are thin up front with proven offense, aren't afraid to look at guys with questionable defensive styles (see: trade deadline deal for a small offensive project), and are desperate for picks (1 st, 0 2nds or 3rds).

In Hodgson, Sabres have that proven offense who doesn't especially fit any more, and a bucket of picks to play the wheeling 'n dealing game. Maybe plug Grigorenko into a package. More than picks, Canucks need some NHL ready talent to develop.

Swapping Burrows/Hodgson is like swapping dollar values, an older veteran character that fits the Sabres mold, for a younger proven guy whose value has diminished with a dismal campaign.

im having troubles seeing why Vancouver would want Hodgson back? He had a down year and left on a sour note and from what I understood, that was the reason for the swap with Kassian.

 

[DazedandConfused]

im having troubles seeing why Vancouver would want Hodgson back? He had a down year and left on a sour note and from what I understood, that was the reason for the swap with Kassian.

It's like people forget where we got him from. Hey, maybe Buffalo will try and sign Derek Roy this summer, that would be new and exciting.

 

[flashsabre]

Kessel has 21 points in 22 games in the playoffs. He plays essentially the way P.Kane plays. They both are effective at slowing play. Kessel will be no where as good, but he has produced.

He is also like +11 in the playoffs as well so that arguement holds no weight. He showa up in the playoffs and with a real centre he would be even better.

The bigger concern would be his conditioning and lack of detail defensively.

 

[mikemcburn]

im having troubles seeing why Vancouver would want Hodgson back? He had a down year and left on a sour note and from what I understood, that was the reason for the swap with Kassian.

The sour note was after the trade, and on the part of the then (since fired) GM.

Going far back (pun intended), Hodgson had a back injury pre rookie year which the then coach (AV, now with Rangers) suggested via the media wasn't legit. Second eval by doctors discovered legit injury and took Hodgson what, a year? to fix, rehab and return (fyi: suggested reason for change in play from his scouting as a top tier two-way centerman). So yeah, coach was shown up to have put foot-in-mouth, but Hodgson never made a deal of it.

Going forward, kid was doing well, getting broken into the league properly in a sheltered 3C role but still putting up poitns, rookie of the month, etc. so the typical Vancouver media started nattering to question why he wasn't getting more ice time (incidentally - media just played the same crap with another Vancouver rookie this season; manufacturing drama).

Then, long after the Kassian/Hodgson deal (when the Canucks were booted from the 1st round of the playoffs arguably due a lack of offense) the media resumed its negative attention on the GM's decision to trade the offensively talented Hodgson for a non-NHL ready Kassian. Eventually the GM deflected that negative attention onto the player (Hodgson) with two sentences that inferred the kid was a character issue for some unspecified reason.

For his part, Hodgson was notably shocked at the time of the trade and afterward never spoke a bad word of anyone. Meanwhile some media played it up for drama effect and formerly big Hodgson fans became disgruntled (omg, how dare a kid not want to play for God's Gift The Canucks?!!!), starting the whole "Hodgson's daddy demanded ice time" crap.

Anyway, *if* there was ever a problem, it left with the former GM and coach. Only ones who might have a problem would be Hodgson whose rep was trashed (but who wouldn't have a say in a trade anyway), and some average joe fans who loved him then loved to hate him and would learn to rationalize loving him again. After all, God's gift to hockey is all things related to the Canucks, don't ya know?

 

[mikemcburn]

It's like people forget where we got him from. Hey, maybe Buffalo will try and sign Derek Roy this summer, that would be new and exciting.

More like, it's like some people know the actual scoop (not the rumors made up after the fact) and haven't forgotten a thing

 

[joshjull]

I absolutely do not want anything to do with Kessel. Yes, he would score and probably be a lot of fun to watch next to Eichel. They would sell lots of tickets, not that there would be any seats left to sell in Buffalo. But all that regular season excitement goes out the window and doesn't matter one bit when the playoffs start. Kessel is not the type of player that will excel in the post-season. He'll get rubbed out along the boards when the other team is trying hard.

I have serious doubts about the Kane trade, but at least he's the type of player to still be productive in the playoffs with a forecheck and physicality.

As has already been pointed out, he has been very productive in the playoffs. From purely hockey pov he would be a great add. He would tear up opposing teams playing with the talent we would have around him. But I'm not sure adding an 8mil scoring winger , with not much of a defensive game, is necessarily the way to go this offseason. Defensive holes and maybe a ROR would be better places to focus.

 

[Top 6 Spaling]

Do you think Cody Hodgson stays or goes? Are you expecting anything of value back if he is traded?

 

[mikemcburn]

Do you think Cody Hodgson stays or goes? Are you expecting anything of value back if he is traded?

For me, I think "yes", he's traded and value depends on when.

If this summer, then as a 20+ goal scorer reclamation project with TM selling him as a "good soldier" and big drooling hints that this dismal year was a one-off due in large part to a since fired coach and thick on the upside that the kid is still 2-3 years from his prime, needing only a change of scene to hit potential.

What does that get the Sabres though? A returning project? A vet with the size and character that fits TM's mold but who is a bit on the diminishing end of the career scale (aka: swapping contracts for a Burrows?)?

If he starts the season with the Sabres though, I'd predict he's put into a top 6 role and given every chance to regain his value, then his tenure with the Sabres will rely heavily on just how NHL ready the likes of Reinhart, etc. are, and how the depth with Larsson, Grigorenko, etc. flushes out.

 

[Top 6 Spaling]

For me, I think "yes", he's traded and value depends on when.

If this summer, then as a 20+ goal scorer reclamation project with TM selling him as a "good soldier" and big drooling hints that this dismal year was a one-off due in large part to a since fired coach and thick on the upside that the kid is still 2-3 years from his prime, needing only a change of scene to hit potential.

What does that get the Sabres though? A returning project? A vet with the size and character that fits TM's mold but who is a bit on the diminishing end of the career scale (aka: swapping contracts for a Burrows?)?

If he starts the season with the Sabres though, I'd predict he's put into a top 6 role and given every chance to regain his value, then his tenure with the Sabres will rely heavily on just how NHL ready the likes of Reinhart, etc. are, and how the depth with Larsson, Grigorenko, etc. flushes out.

Would you be open to something around Stalberg and Hodgson?

 

[mikemcburn]

Would you be open to something around Stalberg and Hodgson?

Dunno Stalberg ? Stats look unremarkable, what's your take?

Burrows I know more, having followed his earlier years - undrafted, earned his way in and up with raw heart and grit. Has had his infamous moments as a "pest", but really just a huge character guy who can play anywhere in the top 9, think he's got a few 20-30 goal seasons, but really you could bump him up or down no worries, cuz he'll do whatever is asked. And bonus, he just has a knack for scoring the right goals.

As much as like Hodgson for his talent and character, I like a Borrows that shade more cuz what he lacks in true talent, he brings with his heart on sleeve to the ice every shift. Just think Burrows would be a sweet fit with the Sabres.

 

[ZeroPT*]

shifting gears, if we can't get ROR, would signing Matthias be a bad move? Big and nasty, young-ish UFA.

H'ed be a good placeholder for a few years

 

[Top 6 Spaling]

Dunno Stalberg ? Stats look unremarkable, what's your take?

Burrows I know more, having followed his earlier years - undrafted, earned his way in and up with raw heart and grit. Has had his infamous moments as a "pest", but really just a huge character guy who can play anywhere in the top 9, think he's got a few 20-30 goal seasons, but really you could bump him up or down no worries, cuz he'll do whatever is asked. And bonus, he just has a knack for scoring the right goals.

As much as like Hodgson for his talent and character, I like a Borrows that shade more cuz what he lacks in true talent, he brings with his heart on sleeve to the ice every shift. Just think Burrows would be a sweet fit with the Sabres.

Stalberg is blazing fast and creates a ton of chances, but has no finish. Not great defensively. One of those guys that you expect to break through any second now but just hasn't. The few times he's had a top 6 role he's looked alright. Doesn't have a ton of value, but if you're looking for a change of scenery for Cody, I could see a fit.

 

[SamuraiArt]

Do you think Cody Hodgson stays or goes? Are you expecting anything of value back if he is traded?

Hope he stays long enough to regain some value. Not sure if there's a scoring line spot for him on this team next year, unfortunately.

 

[mikemcburn]

shifting gears, if we can't get ROR, would signing Matthias be a bad move? Big and nasty, young-ish UFA.

H'ed be a good placeholder for a few years

Shawn Matthias? Hmm... could be interesting. Saw him in spurts and lulls this last season. Maybe like a Foligno? Bottom 6, but can slip in and out of center....

 

[ZeroPT*]

I agree with the Foligno comparison. He's a bit more of a dink though. Should we miss out on ROR/Backes/Berglund and other shutdown C's I'd be very interested in signing him to a decent 3 year deal or something. I like him.

Another option for C that we haven't talked about is Bonino. I know Vancouver brought him in last year in Benning's first big deal, and it's well known that Desjardins likes him but if we dangle Grigo and a pick, maybe they bite?

 

[mikemcburn]

Hope he stays long enough to regain some value. Not sure if there's a scoring line spot for him on this team next year, unfortunately.

Gotta depend in part on what becomes of Grigorenko & Larsson (also potential trade options), how NHL-ready Reinhart really is, if Eichel signs or returns to BU, and presuming both Reinhart & Eichel are on the roster, then what the development plan for each is (ie: time more sheltered in the middle 6, break in on wing?).

In theory anyway, Hodgson's current predicament could be ideal for the Sabres - a top 6 gap-filler, center or wing, for the first few months/half season while he builds up his value and the youth gets feet wet, earning up to take his spot....

Anyway, if he's still on the roster in September and I were in charge, I would make room for him in the top 6 to start the season. The $4.2 is wasted in the bottom 6 indefinitely, and really despite his improved defensive play, there are just better options for that role (ie: Foligno, Gionta, arguably Larsson, etc.). So I'd make room for him in an offensive role to start the season and show case him - ala Stewart.

 

[mikemcburn]

I agree with the Foligno comparison. He's a bit more of a dink though. Should we miss out on ROR/Backes/Berglund and other shutdown C's I'd be very interested in signing him to a decent 3 year deal or something. I like him.

Another option for C that we haven't talked about is Bonino. I know Vancouver brought him in last year in Benning's first big deal, and it's well known that Desjardins likes him but if we dangle Grigo and a pick, maybe they bite?

Maybe on Bonino... Really, I thought he was underwhelming for a guy gift wrapped 2C. Admittedly though, he didn't exactly have a lot of quality and reliable offense on his wings....

Nah, but still, with Eichel/Reinhart projected as the defacto 1C/2C, where is there room for a far more average-at-best 2C Bonino unless it's taking that 3C from Larsson or Grigorenko - in which case, isn't it worth the risk to see if Larsson and/or Grigrenko can become a far better than average 3C?

I think the Canucks would love to get handles on Grigorenko (maybe even enough to sneak back Hodgson in the deal, lol), just figure the Sabres could do better in return than Bonino who I see as pretty much replicating a role already accounted for with a better option (ie: Larsson)...

 

[Sabretip]

shifting gears, if we can't get ROR, would signing Matthias be a bad move? Big and nasty, young-ish UFA.

H'ed be a good placeholder for a few years

After losing the draft lottery and likely the chance to get Babcock, something has to finally go the Sabres' way this summer, doesn't it?

 

[Heraldic]

After losing the draft lottery and likely the chance to get Babcock, something has to finally go the Sabres' way this summer, doesn't it?

It's interesting to see the timetable for Babcock making his decision.

I mean, O'Reilly is the perfect example of a hockey player Mike Babcock absolutely would make love with. And if Babcock for some reason is without a contract before the draft, I think Murray might conduct his overpayment to get a piece that Babcock loves.

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

Kessel has 21 points in 22 games in the playoffs. He plays essentially the way P.Kane plays. They both are effective at slowing play. Kessel will be no where as good, but he has produced.

Ehh...he's put those points up against Montreal (twice), Carolina, and Boston. Three pretty non-physical series and one tough one. I just don't see him being effective through a playoff grind all the way to the SCF.