Salary Cap: Roster going forward (Or: How the cap is coming to kill us)

[These Are The Days]

Callahan has a clause in his contract for the first couple of years anyway doesn't he? We can't even discuss a trade until like 2018 right?

 

[BoltSTH]

Is this what we are discussing here:

 

[2020 Cup Champions]

Callahan has a clause in his contract for the first couple of years anyway doesn't he? We can't even discuss a trade until like 2018 right?

The first four (this season was the first).

 

[Hoek]

That's what I have been saying to every "Trade Callahan" discussion here but it never sinks in.

 

[HoseEmDown]

That's what I have been saying to every "Trade Callahan" discussion here but it never sinks in.

Carle has a NTC clause as well be we discuss trading him everyday. We can ask anybody to waive if we want, they don't have to but they know it doesn't mean they're fully exempt from being moved.

 

[Brie]

After the way Yzerman went out in the media last summer to say that he really wanted to re-sign Cally I doubt he would want to trade him after only one or two years even if he didn't have a NTC, especially since he's done everything he's been brought in to do both on the ice and off it with the obvious influence he's had on the younger players, now did Yzerman see how good the young guys on the team would be by now (TJ, Palat, Kuch and Killorn)? Possibly but I doubt it changes much since every team needs experienced guys, especially next season because even if the young guys have more expereince at this point, going forward we're going to need guys that's been through a full season after a long playoff run the year before to get everyone ready to start over becuase that's not easy since now they have taste of coming so close to the winning the cup they are going to have to re-focus on the regular season if they want to make it back there.

 

[VinikToWinIt]

Well if we can keep Stamkos, Hedman, the triplets, one of Bishop or Vasi and Drouin you can build around those guys and have a solid chance at a cup every season. I hope these guys know how special it could be if they don't take the richer road. But that is a tough sell.

It all starts with Stamkos. His contract could set the tone for these guys. If he takes big money, it could have a ripple effect. If he takes a hometown discount, the others might appreciate that and do the same. I'm not saying this with any certainty, but teams look to their captain to set the example.

 

[The Gongshow]

Burn it all down and start fresh

 

[Sky04]

You guys do know clauses can be waived right? And in most cases if the team asks the player to waive, they usually do. No one wants to play for a team that doesn't want you...

 

[chasespace]

Carle has a NTC clause as well be we discuss trading him everyday. We can ask anybody to waive if we want, they don't have to but they know it doesn't mean they're fully exempt from being moved.

Callahan's is a full NMC for the first few years of his deal, I believe. Carle has to submit a list of teams if asked.

 

[Lord Stan 2020]

i dont get the callahan talk at all

as long as he pots 20 goals and plays his style and plays d im ok with callahan he brings more then points

he is a tough guy which we actually can lose a little more of he is a leader and good guy on the bench and on the ice i have no issues with his deal myself we need those types on certain lines hopefully true shut down lines with paquette boyle types they are as important to me in winning cups as all the so called offensive stars

what paquette and boyle and callahan did in playoffs to shut down other teams best offensive stars is flat out the best thing imho of the playoffs this season to me

i get others might not get that or only go x and o's but i get what it takes to win

i remember 150 point stevie and remember the years he was 80 and won cups

is a big difference but the dedication of the craft to keeping the other team off the board the pride you have to have to sacrifice your body and take a shot anywhere my hat is off to the warriors

also the fact that callahan brought us stralman and boyle i give him a huge leeway

he has changed this franchise night and day and i just hope the kids keep playing the same style and learning from him

maybe on last year of contract we look into this till then?? i like the man myself and everything he does

 

[Todd1a]

Callahan has a clause in his contract for the first couple of years anyway doesn't he? We can't even discuss a trade until like 2018 right?

3 more years nmc

 

[Todd1a]

i dont get the callahan talk at all

as long as he pots 20 goals and plays his style and plays d im ok with callahan he brings more then points

he is a tough guy which we actually can lose a little more of he is a leader and good guy on the bench and on the ice i have no issues with his deal myself we need those types on certain lines hopefully true shut down lines with paquette boyle types they are as important to me in winning cups as all the so called offensive stars

what paquette and boyle and callahan did in playoffs to shut down other teams best offensive stars is flat out the best thing imho of the playoffs this season to me

i get others might not get that or only go x and o's but i get what it takes to win

i remember 150 point stevie and remember the years he was 80 and won cups

is a big difference but the dedication of the craft to keeping the other team off the board the pride you have to have to sacrifice your body and take a shot anywhere my hat is off to the warriors

also the fact that callahan brought us stralman and boyle i give him a huge leeway

he has changed this franchise night and day and i just hope the kids keep playing the same style and learning from him

maybe on last year of contract we look into this till then?? i like the man myself and everything he does

Plus Callahan is our next captain after stamkos leaves curse of the captain Robert! Or do we make Hedman captain? Who ever we want gone make him captain see vinny and Marty. So make Matt carle captain cooper please.

 

[Todd1a]

you need to learn how to read what i write and second you are full of blank

on babcock i said i disliked the man i figured would stay didnt necessarily want him to originally thought for sure would stay then things changed and said he was probably gone

petry still shocks me hes from michigan he said his dream DREAM was to play for the wings the canadihates decided to throw a TON of money at him and he took it he would not get that deal from detroit so is probably his best move

he wanted to play for detroit but a 7 million dollar difference over 5 years is a lot of money for a kid like that

he is not a great top four honestly i think nestea will be as solid as petry or a similar player and I cannot see yzerman giving nestea that type of money if ever for a very very very long time must be some huge improvement in his overall game

stop misquoting me is annyoying if your talking in private go ahead and pull it up

i am pretty sure i told you hoped he left babcock thought would stay and knew as it changed and said he was gone is still shocking but he got paid the most money in league so dont blame him am much happier this happened as anyone knows when steve worked him him i used the word ahole and that is what he is to me

i make some predictions if they all come out wrong aint gonna change i do not buy into the bad luck BS that a lot of people live by im a glass over half full guy if dont like it you can ignore me seriously

i aint changing to make you feel safer lol get over it

i really think kucherov and hedman stay think pally and johnson stay long term they have very good situations

think stamkos stays cause says wants to and by all accounts vinik on down want him to

drouin is the big question i dont buy into the problem with cooper thing at all but does he stay and buy in if he has an off year etc..

these guys put a lot of pressure on selves maybe more then the organization or even fans put on them we seem to take it all in stride letting them develop for the most part but drouin is like the next coming so if he fails or falls short will he bite the bullet and work at his craft till he delivers will he become like connolly whom bolt 32 a long time ago pointed out attitude problems and issues real ones with cooper?

time will tell my buddy caught that i disagreed on connolly but he was right and he called it a couple years ago and that is why imho connolly is gone as much as his failings to step up was an attitude thing couldnt take criticism etc..

doesnt make him bad or anything just maybe didnt get to where needed to as fast as needed to hope that makes sense dont think connolly busts out or doesnt have a good nhl career but there were warnings as early as his first season and especially cooper calling him out at times and his reactions

is interesting to see the dynamics the guy im afraid of losing is killorn with another monster year does he go get paid or take another friendly deal
drouin have concerns on how he accepts things as he struggles or for his belief that he struggles over what he believes he should be etc..

again not trying to be a jerk your a good friend todd but you seriously are and have taken things out of context at times and is very annoying

i dont have to explain myself to you or anyone i appreciate and respect you enough to try

my predictions at times last year on wins etc.. failed

i am not going to change though

You can't get attached to these players or the triplets we lose at least two of those three! Assuming we keep Hedman and stamkos of course. It's just math assuming Hedman gets 8 million a season at least maybe 9. Stamkos gets 10 that's 18 million for two players. So kucherov gets 6 and Johnson and palat get 6 each let's say they do discounts there. So that's 36 million dollars you invest into 5 players. Let's assume vasy takes a stop gap deal like 4 million a season for 2 years at that point also. So out of six players we are paying 40 million to six players! Let's say by then the cap will be 80 million! Which I doubt it will. So now you need 16 or 17 more players for only 40 million to spend! I assume stralman and Callahan will still be here? So that's another 10.3 million you are up to 8 players now and you have spent 50.3 million dollars of the 80 million dollar salary cap. So 14 roster players left to sign with less then 30 million to spend. So who is your number 3,4,5 and 6 defenseman? Now if carle, Garrison and flipper are still here by then! It almost will be impossible to ice a playoff team.

 

[Lord Stan 2020]

You can't get attached to these players or the triplets we lose at least two of those three! Assuming we keep Hedman and stamkos of course. It's just math assuming Hedman gets 8 million a season at least maybe 9. Stamkos gets 10 that's 18 million for two players. So kucherov gets 6 and Johnson and palat get 6 each let's say they do discounts there. So that's 36 million dollars you invest into 5 players. Let's assume vasy takes a stop gap deal like 4 million a season for 2 years at that point also. So out of six players we are paying 40 million to six players! Let's say by then the cap will be 80 million! Which I doubt it will. So now you need 16 or 17 more players for only 40 million to spend! I assume stralman and Callahan will still be here? So that's another 10.3 million you are up to 8 players now and you have spent 50.3 million dollars of the 80 million dollar salary cap. So 14 roster players left to sign with less then 30 million to spend. So who is your number 3,4,5 and 6 defenseman? Now if carle, Garrison and flipper are still here by then! It almost will be impossible to ice a playoff team.

we got what five d men making like 5 million a year?? now?? and your worried on the core smdh

vasi aint gettin rich no time soon lol carle gone
garrison coburn etc..

other guys come up killorn is concern but others im not concerned at all myself we got a ton of good to great kids

its all gonna work out fine in next 3 years and expansion will hit in 2018 at the exact right time for this team for the long term

yes bishop will probably get moved

filppula and others we will be fine

 

[Lord Stan 2020]

im gonna go off top of head here
long term deals before 2018
stamkos 9.75 million
hedman 8.5 million
triplets 6 to 6.5 million each
killorn 3.75 million
stralman forget his number 4.65 is my guess what he makes
flipper will be moved in 2017 so til then 5 million?
callahan 5 million
drouin 2.5 to 4 million
vladdy 2.5 million bridge type deal
paquette 1.5 million
bolye 2.5 million
vasi under 2 million
brown gone carle gone
condra or whatever his name is 1.5 million

that is 68.9 without the kids below and moves we may make or be forced to make

garrison gone coburn not resiged tony d and koekkoek playing cheaply

the point is we can do this easily and move people as needed to keep the core

no problem im sick of hearing it from you when youve beaten a dead horse and are wrong in my humble opinion lol

we will be fine with some money to spare might lose a killorn too but is kids for that role if he wont play cheaply

the core of stamkos hedman triplets drouin stralman bishop or vasi is solid and the other pieces we will need will all work out

is a guy or two we will lose so need a kid or two to step up yearly

is simple im happy myself

now if stamkos breaks the bank ill be thinking about it and pissed but seriously do not see him doing that he wants cups he wants to compete year in year out he has to sacrifice a little cash not a ton but a little for that goal having the tax break and having the canadian dollar be a joke seriously imho helps us with stamkos

the rest is up to them do they want to stay together etc.. so far is a yes

is questions always will be we need a couple guys behind tony d and slater to prove they can step up in the future like soon or will be issues and will force our hand to move a guy like a flipper or whatever but the core is pretty dammed set

 

[Todd1a]

we got what five d men making like 5 million a year?? now?? and your worried on the core smdh

vasi aint gettin rich no time soon lol carle gone
garrison coburn etc..

other guys come up killorn is concern but others im not concerned at all myself we got a ton of good to great kids

its all gonna work out fine in next 3 years and expansion will hit in 2018 at the exact right time for this team for the long term

yes bishop will probably get moved

filppula and others we will be fine

I see coburn staying stevie yzerman does not do short term rentals he gave up a 1st and 3rd rounder for him. I'd guess he gets a new 3 year deal with us for the same money. we really don't have anyone to replace him on that right side? we have koekkoek to replace carle. I can't see sustr going into our top 4 ever. Anthony D does not have enough defense for that role yet! my goodness if cooper is hard on drouin he will be harder on anthony D.

 

[Todd1a]

we got what five d men making like 5 million a year?? now?? and your worried on the core smdh

vasi aint gettin rich no time soon lol carle gone
garrison coburn etc..

other guys come up killorn is concern but others im not concerned at all myself we got a ton of good to great kids

its all gonna work out fine in next 3 years and expansion will hit in 2018 at the exact right time for this team for the long term

yes bishop will probably get moved

filppula and others we will be fine

ya and saad is not getting rich anytime soon and you don't think if vasy takes bishops job he won't get paid a good bridge deal ?

 

[Todd1a]

im gonna go off top of head here
long term deals before 2018
stamkos 9.75 million
hedman 8.5 million
triplets 6 to 6.5 million each
killorn 3.75 million
stralman forget his number 4.65 is my guess what he makes
flipper will be moved in 2017 so til then 5 million?
callahan 5 million
drouin 2.5 to 4 million
vladdy 2.5 million bridge type deal
paquette 1.5 million
bolye 2.5 million
vasi under 2 million
brown gone carle gone
condra or whatever his name is 1.5 million

that is 68.9 without the kids below and moves we may make or be forced to make

garrison gone coburn not resiged tony d and koekkoek playing cheaply

the point is we can do this easily and move people as needed to keep the core

no problem im sick of hearing it from you when youve beaten a dead horse and are wrong in my humble opinion lol

we will be fine with some money to spare might lose a killorn too but is kids for that role if he wont play cheaply

the core of stamkos hedman triplets drouin stralman bishop or vasi is solid and the other pieces we will need will all work out

is a guy or two we will lose so need a kid or two to step up yearly

is simple im happy myself

now if stamkos breaks the bank ill be thinking about it and pissed but seriously do not see him doing that he wants cups he wants to compete year in year out he has to sacrifice a little cash not a ton but a little for that goal having the tax break and having the canadian dollar be a joke seriously imho helps us with stamkos

the rest is up to them do they want to stay together etc.. so far is a yes

is questions always will be we need a couple guys behind tony d and slater to prove they can step up in the future like soon or will be issues and will force our hand to move a guy like a flipper or whatever but the core is pretty dammed set

ya that can be done point is we can do this but it will not be easy at all. Carle, garrison and flipper all need to be moved and bishop traded. Your dreaming on stamkos if he only takes 9.75 the deal would be signed and sealed right now. I'm thinking he wants to break the bank 12 million per season 10.5 at the cheapest rate I see him going. he has the same agents as subban and ror. But coburn needs to be kept or a replacement needs to be traded for. because we don't have a in the house solution for that spot right now. Hedman seems like a guy that leaves money on the table and takes only 7 million a season. triplets I can see leaving money on the table a little but stamkos no way but time will tell. If stamkos wants cups like you said then lets see him do it to set the tone for the kids.

 

[LTIR Trickery]

Look at the two or three weeks Johnson was out. Vlad did fill in quite admirably and performed very well. The triplet line didn't seem like it missed a step. Johnson>>>>Vlad all day and everyday. Saying that line just stopped working because Johnson was out and we used a inferior center in his stead is being blind to be polite.

Dude Vladdy was slightly above replacement level, that isn't an overall assessment of his play, its just that he, at this point, is not as good as TJ and isn't really in the same realm yet. Hes filling out but has a ways to go.

 

[Todd1a]

Dude Vladdy was slightly above replacement level, that isn't an overall assessment of his play, its just that he, at this point, is not as good as TJ and isn't really in the same realm yet. Hes filling out but has a ways to go.

i'm hoping for better things from vladdy next year I was not impressed at all. he seems like he gets pushed around easy in the nhl by defenseman. Really needs to show up to camp much stronger next season.

 

[Werewolf]

Right now Vlad doesn't need to be as good as Johnson nor Filp. He needs to be better than our third line center which is Paquette. This year Vladdy gets the Drouin/Kuch treatment...fourth line/third line, etc. Next year Boyle's contract runs out...and Paquette slots in the fourth line Center. Vladdy gets locked in at third line center at that point. I figure Cooper stays with the same top 6 as in the playoffs. Drouin/Vladdy/Cally as third line or Drouin/Paquette/Cally? You never know with Cooper. However, Vladdy absolutely dominates the AHL...kid is going to be great, no doubt about it. Needs to bulk, gain some experience, and he'll be a hell of a player in a few years. Down in the AHL...Vladdy wasnt afraid to hit and had the confidence to take over games. Just needs a bit of time and confidence...kid is a stud.

 

[Todd1a]

Right now Vlad doesn't need to be as good as Johnson nor Filp. He needs to be better than our third line center which is Paquette. This year Vladdy gets the Drouin/Kuch treatment...fourth line/third line, etc. Next year Boyle's contract runs out...and Paquette slots in the fourth line Center. Vladdy gets locked in at third line center at that point. I figure Cooper stays with the same top 6 as in the playoffs. Drouin/Vladdy/Cally as third line or Drouin/Paquette/Cally? You never know with Cooper. However, Vladdy absolutely dominates the AHL...kid is going to be great, no doubt about it. Needs to bulk, gain some experience, and he'll be a hell of a player in a few years. Down in the AHL...Vladdy wasnt afraid to hit and had the confidence to take over games. Just needs a bit of time and confidence...kid is a stud.

brian boyle has two years left so your saying we trade boyle in his last year ?

 

[Werewolf]

brian boyle has two years left so your saying we trade boyle in his last year ?

Apologies, thought he got a 2 yr deal for some reason...but you are right he got a 3 year deal. Haven't thought about it enough to say trade him after this upcoming year...thought that would just be natural progression to get Paquette there.

 

[Lord Stan 2020]

I see coburn staying stevie yzerman does not do short term rentals he gave up a 1st and 3rd rounder for him. I'd guess he gets a new 3 year deal with us for the same money. we really don't have anyone to replace him on that right side? we have koekkoek to replace carle. I can't see sustr going into our top 4 ever. Anthony D does not have enough defense for that role yet! my goodness if cooper is hard on drouin he will be harder on anthony D.

i dont see how we can keep coburn garrison or flipper would have to go so doubtful seriously doubtful is why gave sustr two years ia a prove it deal
tony d is not drouin hate to tell you this

drouin might be as good as tony d on offense time will tell but tony d plays full 200 foot game better then drouin so far

tony d seems besides size a superstar to me on both ends he will lay the body he doesnt seem to make a lot of mistakes a year in ahl will tell a lot but i expect instant success

drouin never played hard on defense he is a learning process tony d in all can see hear etc.. never takes time off he attacks is why he was comparable to mcdavid in how well was scoring tony d attacks both ends and takes to net and scores

drouin is a facilatator be it maybe in time one of best in the nhl but right now he has to focus on covering the d zone and moving the puck quicker as plenty of people have said that is what tony d does its natural to him where drouin is more crafty maybe tony d is a north south player so to speak like palat with high end scoring ability but will lay you out no matter size etc.. the kid has no fear and has the extra gears so yeah i think coburn is gone when contract is up cause it think this year with injuries tony gets his cup of water and next year i think he makes the team not this season but next season?

i see greatness in that kid hes the real deal not saying drouin is not but at times drouin did take a shift off he admitted it ive watched a lot of tony d in utter amazement just hope the attitude is kept in check till needed but hes something rare

wish he was bigger but he seems to have it all
i have seen glimpses on drouin but is a head thing with him and if he listens he will be great he says the right things meaning he gets what cooper was laying out to him just like kucherov

tony is more ready on the d side he plays hard as hell maybe harder on that end then on offense just offense comes so easily for him so your comparison at least to me is shallow or not a good one