Roster Building XVII: Some Of Us Like Some Parts Of Our Group

[User13452]

Fast, Lemieux, MartyParty?

Rod ain’t sitting martinook

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

No one deserves to be scratched, really. I think that’s where the Bunting speculation came from.

What about a guy like Tyler Johnson as a 13th forward? Good pro that has won a lot. Versatility in the event of injury is the selling point. A little more skill on the wing relative to Lemieux. An experienced center to slot above Ponomarev on the organizational depth chart, as well.

 

[bleedgreen]

Who is sitting if DuClair plays?

We can rotate the fourth line and there will be injuries. Duclair could maybe play on any of the first three lines. It would be a nice problem to have.

 

[Unsustainable]

Even with out retained on Hertl. Might be the easiest to acquire, and fit the core.

 

[TheReelChuckFletcher]

No one deserves to be scratched, really. I think that’s where the Bunting speculation came from.

What about a guy like Tyler Johnson as a 13th forward? Good pro that has won a lot. Versatility in the event of injury is the selling point. A little more skill on the wing relative to Lemieux. An experienced center to slot above Ponomarev on the organizational depth chart, as well.

TJ wouldn't be a bad idea if we swing and miss on players with term remaining, but he wouldn't be my first choice. If I was going to acquire a veteran 13th forward, I'd personally try my darnedest to get a player like Kyle Okposo who hasn't won the hardware yet.

 

[User13452]

Not sure what Minnesota will end up doing but a guy like Hartman who has some term and only making 4 million a year after this season could be a nice addition.

 

[chaz4hockey]

Which two of them, because Svech takes one of their spots…cough, cough….Lemieux.

Right it’s either fast or martinook. Not sure RBA would sit either

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Canes have the 2nd ranked PP in the NHL this year and the 4th ranked PK. The two areas of "weakness" are
1) Goaltending
2) 5v5 (goal scoring 14th ranked + goals against 13th ranked, which is related to #1)

Given that, and the names we've been throwing around, for reference, here are some numbers.

5v5 points:
Drury: 16 in 484 minutes
Martinook: 16 in 630 minutes
KK: 14 in 599 minutes (1 is against EN)
TT: 14 in 589 minutes. (2 are against EN)

Elias Lindholm: 17 in 699 minutes (3 are against EN)
Henrique: 17 in 567 minutes (3 are against EN)
Hertl: 16 in 712 minutes (2 are against EN)
Duclair: 11 in 612 minutes
Tyler Johnson: 6 in 416 minutes
Kaako Kappo: 5 in 328 minutes

Clearly there are other factors to consider: the team they play for, line mates, some of these players bring more to the table than just scoring, future potential, and a 49(ish) game sample size doesn't define the player; but if we are going to pay top dollar for a rental (or a guy with a large salary), we need to ensure we improve on what we have.

I think 2C is a need personally. I've always liked Lindholm and think he would have been a good add, but there's no denying he's struggled this year. This isn't advanced or "fancy" stats saying it, it's just raw production. I suspect the situation in Calgary was a big part of it. Joining Vancouver, with its high flying offense, he should see a jump in his numbers.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

There are a plethora of guys who should be out to pasture that could be acquired. Okposo, TJ, Carter, etc. those guys aren’t adding anything to the roster though. They aren’t a depth addition, they would be emergency additions to the roster.

Since we look at down trodden assets the 6 teams that come to mind are Washington, Calgary, Pittsburgh, Buffalo, Montreal, and Ottawa.
Washington doesn’t have much worth adding
Pittsburgh just has Smith, everyone else is too much of a risk (Rakell, Karlsson, Graves) as Pittsburgh isn’t going to retain.
Buffalo has a ton of players who don’t play the right way coupled with too much term and money
Ottawa is looking for veterans to help turn their team around, which sounds like the guys that will help us aren’t available (except Chychrun). Chychrun isn’t going to be in the distressed asset price range though.
Calgary’s distressed assets are going to carry too much risk (Hub and kadri). We missed the distressed boat on Coleman and Markstrom last offseason. They don’t do rebuilding so a good asset like Andersson is off the table.
Montreal’s distressed have no potential to turn it around as they have been distressed for a while (Anderson, Armia, etc).

Now a slew of distressed assets could become available if the arena deal for the Yotes falls through, again. But I have a sneaky suspicion that the announcement is held off until the offseason to prevent all the negative vibes that will create.

Is it wrong to hope for Zona’s failure so we can profit? Other than that we are limited on adding to the roster.

 

[CanesUltimate11]

I mean.....
One of these things is not like the other five...

Seven point seven million dollars.

We really need to get Chatfield done.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

Yea, he is oddly overlooking that Orlov’s stats are still reeling from the suffering that occurred with TDA on his right side

 

[FlyingSquirrels]

Right it’s either fast or martinook. Not sure RBA would sit either

Correct. Whoever thinks RBA will sit one of "his boys" for ANY new acquisition, has not been paying attention.

 

[Chrispy]

There are a plethora of guys who should be out to pasture that could be acquired. Okposo, TJ, Carter, etc. those guys aren’t adding anything to the roster though. They aren’t a depth addition, they would be emergency additions to the roster.

Since we look at down trodden assets the 6 teams that come to mind are Washington, Calgary, Pittsburgh, Buffalo, Montreal, and Ottawa.
Washington doesn’t have much worth adding
Pittsburgh just has Smith, everyone else is too much of a risk (Rakell, Karlsson, Graves) as Pittsburgh isn’t going to retain.
Buffalo has a ton of players who don’t play the right way coupled with too much term and money
Ottawa is looking for veterans to help turn their team around, which sounds like the guys that will help us aren’t available (except Chychrun). Chychrun isn’t going to be in the distressed asset price range though.
Calgary’s distressed assets are going to carry too much risk (Hub and kadri). We missed the distressed boat on Coleman and Markstrom last offseason. They don’t do rebuilding so a good asset like Andersson is off the table.
Montreal’s distressed have no potential to turn it around as they have been distressed for a while (Anderson, Armia, etc).

Now a slew of distressed assets could become available if the arena deal for the Yotes falls through, again. But I have a sneaky suspicion that the announcement is held off until the offseason to prevent all the negative vibes that will create.

Is it wrong to hope for Zona’s failure so we can profit? Other than that we are limited on adding to the roster.

Washington: Would you consider Pacioretty as a rental? $2M, he fit well in the few games he played, he likes the team so he'd be likely to waive his NMC for a playoff run.

I think he's a likely target if you're looking for offense/shooting and he can stay healthy through early March.

 

[The Faulker 27]

I hear this guys available.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

Washington: Would you consider Pacioretty as a rental? $2M, he fit well in the few games he played, he likes the team so he'd be likely to waive his NMC for a playoff run.

I think he's a likely target if you're looking for offense/shooting and he can stay healthy through early March.

That ship is likely sailed.

 

[bleedgreen]

Canes have the 2nd ranked PP in the NHL this year and the 4th ranked PK. The two areas of "weakness" are
1) Goaltending
2) 5v5 (goal scoring 14th ranked + goals against 13th ranked, which is related to #1)

Given that, and the names we've been throwing around, for reference, here are some numbers.

5v5 points:
Drury: 16 in 484 minutes
Martinook: 16 in 630 minutes
KK: 14 in 599 minutes (1 is against EN)
TT: 14 in 589 minutes. (2 are against EN)

Elias Lindholm: 17 in 699 minutes (3 are against EN)
Henrique: 17 in 567 minutes (3 are against EN)
Hertl: 16 in 712 minutes (2 are against EN)
Duclair: 11 in 612 minutes
Tyler Johnson: 6 in 416 minutes
Kaako Kappo: 5 in 328 minutes

Clearly there are other factors to consider: the team they play for, line mates, some of these players bring more to the table than just scoring, future potential, and a 49(ish) game sample size doesn't define the player; but if we are going to pay top dollar for a rental (or a guy with a large salary), we need to ensure we improve on what we have.

I think 2C is a need personally. I've always liked Lindholm and think he would have been a good add, but there's no denying he's struggled this year. This isn't advanced or "fancy" stats saying it, it's just raw production. I suspect the situation in Calgary was a big part of it. Joining Vancouver, with its high flying offense, he should see a jump in his numbers.

Well Henrique can play center but also plays wing as well so he’s versatile but not a righty like Lindy. Not a bad rental if we would move KK to the fourth, could be a longer term solution if we extend him but he’s about to hit the market in his 30’s so he may have a destination or two in mind.

Duclair I like for us as he’s always undervalued a bit, he’s bounced around despite production. With his numbers down he may come as a cheap rental that could also be extended….hopefully even short term. He’s athletic and scored 30 goals recently. He’s playing on a crap team, I think it’s fair to say with him the numbers reflect the team more than the player. He doesn’t fix the true problem of 2C but he can score, he’s fast and can be taught the system. Quality depth that could fit on any line.

I can’t see Hertl making sense long term with the contract. I don’t think we would’ve signed him to it so I doubt we’d trade for it. Good player, and he would help for sure at a position of need.

TJ would come cheap and would be depth, Kaako is an interesting experiment but the Rangers probably want to recoup some value there. A better move for a rebuilding team that might spend a little more for the long term gain. Distressed asset though so I’m sure we look at it.

 

[AhosDatsyukian]

I hear this guys available.

why is Jordan Staal playing in a beer league?

 

[chaz4hockey]

It is an interesting dilemma the Canes find themselves in. I agree with BBA with re: to our needs but yet the market doesn't seem to have the superior assets we would want available to trade for, let alone a proper price. Our top 12 + Pono + Lemieux needed for injury or as muscle versus Fl's chuckleheads are pretty solid (now that Martinook is on fire, why would they trade him ).

Re forwards-
I suspect they would have to trade one of a Bunting, Fast, Drury or Martinook (with each providing different cap space) along with youth/draft picks. Odds of that happening are low.

Re: G's-
Now with Freddie on the ice, I suspect they will just go with what they have versus trade in a very limited market.

Re: D-
Canes still have an expired contract problem with their D core. With Pesce now playing much better (and Orlov too despite a recent couple of game hiccups) the group play recently has been outstanding. However, this could be an area that I believe they would be willing to tinker with for the right younger asset to preserve their SC opportunity run.

Summing, I suspect Canes will either surprise us with a HR trade or do nothing.

btw: in the recent Athletic article re: contract discussions I didn't see anything re: RBA. It's been very quiet on that end too.

 

[MinJaBen]

It is an interesting dilemma the Canes find themselves in. I agree with BBA with re: to our needs but yet the market doesn't seem to have the superior assets we would want available to trade for, let alone a proper price. Our top 12 + Pono + Lemieux needed for injury or as muscle versus Fl's chuckleheads are pretty solid (now that Martinook is on fire, why would they trade him ).

Re forwards-
I suspect they would have to trade one of a Bunting, Fast, Drury or Martinook (with each providing different cap space) along with youth/draft picks. Odds of that happening are low.

Re: G's-
Now with Freddie on the ice, I suspect they will just go with what they have versus trade in a very limited market.

Re: D-
Canes still have an expired contract problem with their D core. With Pesce now playing much better (and Orlov too despite a recent couple of game hiccups) the group play recently has been outstanding. However, this could be an area that I believe they would be willing to tinker with for the right younger asset to preserve their SC opportunity run.

Summing, I suspect Canes will either surprise us with a HR trade or do nothing.

btw: in the recent Athletic article re: contract discussions I didn't see anything re: RBA. It's been very quiet on that end too.

I think a guy that @Boom Boom Apathy didn't evaluate that might be an available forward is Giroux. He'd have to wave to come here and he has one more year on his contract, but he would be a near perfect fit for a forward addition, especially if he was the pivot on the second line. He is getting up there in age, but he has been nearly a PPG player the last two years in Ottawa, so the drop off for one more year is likely not terrible if age starts to catch up. He also would be a RH draw which would be huge as well. Drury, our 1st and another asset would be well worth bringing him in for two playoff runs if he'd be up to it.

 

[bleedgreen]

I think a guy that @Boom Boom Apathy didn't evaluate that might be an available forward is Giroux. He'd have to wave to come here and he has one more year on his contract, but he would be a near perfect fit for a forward addition, especially if he was the pivot on the second line. He is getting up there in age, but he has been nearly a PPG player the last two years in Ottawa, so the drop off for one more year is likely not terrible if age starts to catch up. He also would be a RH draw which would be huge as well. Drury, our 1st and another asset would be well worth bringing him in for two playoff runs if he'd be up to it.

I didn’t think he’d be a good fit in Ottawa but he’s been great there. I’d be on board, and at his age/level of experience I think he and Rod would get on the same page pretty quick. I like that he’s got another year. I would think they’d want to keep him though. They have to feel they’re on the edge of competitiveness and Giroux is pretty clearly working well with the group.

 

[Stickpucker]

What old and busted barn find forwards are out there?

Giroux? Tank? Couture? Toffoli? Kadri?

I think our front office could care less about warts if the $ is correct.

I think a guy that @Boom Boom Apathy didn't evaluate that might be an available forward is Giroux. He'd have to wave to come here and he has one more year on his contract, but he would be a near perfect fit for a forward addition, especially if he was the pivot on the second line. He is getting up there in age, but he has been nearly a PPG player the last two years in Ottawa, so the drop off for one more year is likely not terrible if age starts to catch up. He also would be a RH draw which would be huge as well. Drury, our 1st and another asset would be well worth bringing him in for two playoff runs if he'd be up to it.

It's only fitting he comes to the team that pioneered Claude Giroux adjusted stats.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

there is a 1130 Gary Bettman presser today. could be our Zona answer but like i said earlier, im not holding my breath.

 

[CandyCanes]

Giroux would be a dream add to this team and slot in as our #2 center. Doubt he's available. Senators probably feel like they can compete next year, so why move on from a point per game player that you have under contract for next season.

If we're looking to improve 5on5, Giroux would be a huge add. He'd lead this Canes team with 27 5on5 pts. Jarvis would be 2nd at 24. Let alone Giroux is a right handed center, that's winning 57.5% of his faceoffs.

 

[AhosDatsyukian]

I like our group. Wouldn't make any deadline trades if Freddie returns to the ice before the deadline.

 

[Lempo]

there is a 1130 Gary Bettman presser today. could be our Zona answer but like i said earlier, im not holding my breath.

Must not speculate.