Speculation: Roster Building Thread 2019-20: Part XXVIII

[bobbop]

I am not convinced Kadri being out makes a trade for Kreider more likely. It may make it less likely. Kadri is a top 9 center. They may wish to get more depth down the middle. I just don't trust that Sakic will be less stingy because of this injury. I don't get the sense he's feeling pressure to win the cup this year.

Blues and Bruins and Caps are the teams that seem to be up against their cup contention windows. Maybe the Rangers can use the Avs to up other offers, but i feel like Gorton already knows the likely return for Kreider from any teams that are truly serious. He's just going to wait to see if he can make them a touch sweeter at the deadline. I doubt the Avs are one of those teams Gorton is focused on.

Someone leaked the "eight interested teams" storyline to the press. Assume, Pittsburgh was one, now it's seven. 1-2 more may surface as the deadline gets closer.

You are right, Gorton knows what the market is. I'm sure he has talked with each team and they have exchanged names IF the Rangers make Kreider available. That's how it works.

 

[NYRFANMANI]

Not really sure how one could possibly come to such a conclusion but ok.

What about the rebuild smacks of not being committed to it?

Idk. Maybe it's because we aren't bottom dwellers. Maybe because we haven't traded Kreids and Georgie yet ...

This is year 3 of the rebuild and it looks to be the last to me. Shesty will be the starter next year and we will be ridden of Staal, we're going to be competing for the playoffs big time.

Whilst the D and G prospect pool looks to be set, the O is still fishy to me. There is a drop off after Krav (and Barron). We still lack that surefire sharpshooter.
But then again, this is the draft to get it done then.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Nobody is saying Kreider is a great player BUT his particular skill set in extremely difficult to replace..just the facts

I think most of us are in agreement on that.

The bigger question is what are people (and more importantly, management) willing to sacrifice in order to keep him? Because it isn't as simple as dumping Buchnevich and Strome.

 

[mas0764]

Buch to Edmonton has made sense since the off-season. He would fit what they need as far as a support top-6 player who shouldn't break the bank as a RFA this off-season.

The Rangers can retain on him for this season as his contract is up at the end of the year which will help them fit him in. Long term they have the space to fit him.

Then they need to get a time machine and go back and give us the 8th overall pick or somehow convince Anaheim to send us Trevor Zegras.

I'm bitter.

 

[NikC]

I think you hit the nail on the head.

When Panarin was signed, it was all "But what about the rebuild?! We'll be too good too quick! We need room for the kids to grow!"

Panarin was replacing Kreider with an upgrade a year early, IMO, or at least preparing for that possibility. Why pay Kreider $7/yr for 50 points when you could pay Panarin $11/yr for 120 points?

You can make an argument for not paying Kreider, but these are 2 different players altogether.
Panarin doesn't replace Kreider....

 

[NYRFANMANI]

I think this board, as a result of certain names tossed out there, has one level expectation on a return for Georgiev. Conversely, I think the market may be more conservative.

Specially on goalies. Past years negative experiences should be counted in. If we make out like gangbusters on the deal, so be it. Certainly not expecting it.

(also, can totally see the Rongos doing the Rongo thing and go three goalies to the end. lol)

 

[E-Train]

Kreider will go for the Hayes deal, maybe the prospect is a bit higher regarded than Lemieux was this time last year.

Fast should get a Rykov type and a 3rd.

Strome, ADA and Georgiev all stay.

Buch 50/50. That’ll be it

 

[mas0764]

Because together the team has 2 legitimate line.

For now.

In addition, how will Zibanejad respond w/out Kreider on his wing? Whos replaceing him?

Uh.... Kaapo Kakko? Vitali Kravtsov? Filip Chytil? Someone we draft in the top 10 this year?

I don't care if we suffer for it next year. Great, we get yet another top pick then. Of course I don't believe we will suffer that much because I think Kakko and Panarin and Kravtsov and Chytil pick up that slack sooner rather than later. So I'm super not worried.

"What am I gonna do next year" is an easy and completely non worrisome answer: I'll suck again while the kids turn into the superstars they are gonna be, and add more talent through the draft in the process. Duh.

The much harder question is how to afford $7m Chris Kreider when he's playing on the third line, and you're trying to pay Panarin, Kakko, Kravtsov, Zibanejad's new contract extension, Chytill and others who all play more minutes ahead of him, and there's still 4 years and a NMC left on his contract.

Yikes.

I think I'll figure out a way to manage without a 50 point speedy power forward for a season or two. Yes, Kreider is a relatively unique talent. But no, t hat talent is not so impactful as to be irreplaceable. He's much more valuable to a competing team than to one that still isn't planning to contend for another 2 seasons or so.

 

[mas0764]

The Rangers are not getting Newhook! Not for any combination of Kreider/Strome/Fast/Lundqvist.

I accept that's very likely the truth.

But if I were in charge then the Avs should accept that they aren't getting Kreider.

I'll friggin sit on him before giving him to the Avs for a first and Jost or some nonsense.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Some people talk about Chris Kreider as if he's irreplaceable. He's not Ovechkin

 

[mas0764]

You can make an argument for not paying Kreider, but these are 2 different players altogether.
Panarin doesn't replace Kreider....

I think long term, he very much does.

Maybe they don't play the same, but Panarin is better at just about everything.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

Some people talk about Chris Kreider as if he's irreplaceable. He's not Ovechkin

But he could be

/s

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

But he could be

/s

Only after I quoted you, did I see the /s

 

[True Blue]

Idk. Maybe it's because we aren't bottom dwellers.

Being cellar dwellers would be a sign that they are serious about a rebuild? What would you have them do? Fine players for trying to win?

Maybe because we haven't traded Kreids and Georgie yet ...

Maybe Gorton is waiting for the best possible return? Maybe Georgiev is not going anywhere? Or maybe they should just cut Kreider to hasten their demise?

This is year 3 of the rebuild and it looks to be the last to me. Shesty will be the starter next year and we will be ridden of Staal, we're going to be competing for the playoffs big time.

When this year ends, it will be 2.25 years of a rebuild and only two drafts as such.

First of all, what is the issue? That this team may be better next year? That signifies that they are not serious about the rebuild? Second of all, they are trying for the playoffs this year. They will not make it. How does this comment make sense in your "not serious about a rebuild" view? Should they not be playing Shesterkin? What is "big time"?

Whilst the D and G prospect pool looks to be set, the O is still fishy to me. There is a drop off after Krav (and Barron). We still lack that surefire sharpshooter.

They have had exactly two drafts since declaring a rebuild. What exactly are you looking for them to have acquired in the past two drafts other than what they did? Or could possibly get more in a deal? And how does this make you feel like they are half-assing the rebuild?

But then again, this is the draft to get it done then.

Yeah, still not getting your original sentiment

 

[Edge]

Some people talk about Chris Kreider as if he's irreplaceable. He's not Ovechkin

I like Kreider. I like him a lot. I liked him when he wasn’t the boards consensus pick in 2009, and I’d follow him if he played for another team.

He brings value to the Rangers and would be a significant loss. But I think some of the comments border on elevating him to an almost revered level.

I also don’t think the inherent quest is to “replace” Kreider on a skill by skill or attribute by attribute basis, especially in the immediate aftermath of a potential trade.

It might mean a different LW, in combination with other players at different positions. It might result in a different look - one that lacks some of the qualities Kreider possesses, but brings other qualities he doesn’t. It might mean that we have a second line LW playing in that slot instead of a first line LW playing in that slot. But it might also mean that we have another vet in the lineup that we wouldn’t have had otherwise.

Like so many conversations, I think we get fixated on the principle of having all or nothing. And I think this roster is, and will be more nuanced than that. But so many of these conversations are hard to pin down without actual numbers.

It’s one thing to want Kreider. It’s another thing to agree on how much to pay him. And depending on where that number sits, it might not be much of a debate at all.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

I just don't think Kreider would accept a contract offer that makes an extension worth it for the Rangers.

 

[Good Intentions]

Some people talk about Chris Kreider as if he's irreplaceable. He's not Ovechkin

He doesn’t have to be Ovechkin to be irreplaceable. Respectfully, you seem to be more of a stat head. Kreider’s value is beyond the points column.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

He doesn’t have to be Ovechkin to be irreplaceable. Respectfully, you seem to be more of a stat head. Kreider’s value is beyond the points column.

I actually watch the games, thanks. For a player that disappears as regularly as Kreider, I don't see the appeal in signing him for 7m a year

 

[SA16]

If people want to sign Kreider to a 7x7 deal and think Hall is going to get under 10M (which he won't) then why would we possibly re-sign Kreider instead of trying to sign the far superior player for just 3M/year more?

 

[Kupo]

Some people talk about Chris Kreider as if he's irreplaceable. He's not Ovechkin

6 points his last 17 playoff games. I respect his speed and size and work around the net, but people speak of him like he’s an unstoppable force when he’s on the ice.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

6 points his last 17 playoff games. I respect his speed and size and work around the net, but people speak of him like he’s an unstoppable force when he’s on the ice.

And sometimes he is

 

[Kupo]

And sometimes he is

Sometimes isn’t enough for me to accept a 50M contract until he’s 36 when we’re going to have a plethora of players that need new contracts.

 

[RGY]

If people want to sign Kreider to a 7x7 deal and think Hall is going to get under 10M (which he won't) then why would we possibly re-sign Kreider instead of trying to sign the far superior player for just 3M/year more?

Because the $3 million more per year can go towards one of the kids 2nd contracts? I dont know seems pretty logical to me.

 

[charliemurphy]

I actually watch the games, thanks. For a player that disappears as regularly as Kreider, I don't see the appeal in signing him for 7m a year

This right here folks... facts.

 

[UAGoalieGuy]

Also Hall has been quite not like himself this season and has some pretty major injury concerns in addition to the comments regarding the extra money to resign the younger players.