Rickard Rakell

[WhatTheDuck]

ducks are a budget team, they have to play guys on ELC's, maybe more than they should. in the end rakell's performance has very little to do with why anaheim is no longer playing. it's easy to say replace him until you look at anaheims financial situation moving forward

he's 21 and just had his first full season, pretty ridiculous there is so much uproar over essentially a rookie player

I think Rakell wore out a bit as the playoffs went on, not unlike most of our young players, but overall he had a very successful first full season for a young center. He still needs to improve his strength and endurance but I see no reason not to expect him to do so.

We could use some added minor league talent down the middle but as far as our NHL group goes I think we're just fine. You can expect similar seasons out of the three veterans, so any improvement by Rakell is an improvement to the group as a whole.

 

[nbducksfan19]

This IS binary. Either practice will improve a skill, or you are flawed in some fashion such that practice will not improve that skill. Unless you're arguing he is physically or mentally flawed in some manner that prevents him from progressing with faceoffs, he SHOULD improve with practice. You're correct, it's quite simple. Unless you're willing to commit to that position, there's really no argument to be made to the contrary. If you want to talk what someone has or has not said, I don't recall saying that Rakell hadn't practiced enough because he was lazy, or because he was of poor character, or that he had time that he spent doing other things, or even that I was referring to this year. Yet, I'm making low blows against his character. I do not believe that's he ever would have been slotted as a center if he was fundamentally incapable of taking faceoffs effectively, and thus there are actually no reasons for why he could not improve. Saying "he's young and needs experience" is another way of saying - he needs practice. That's all experience is.

Come up with a rational reason he had only one (very poor) faceoff move that does not involve a lack of practice. Regardless of what center he was up against, using whatever technique, with whichever handedness, he used that same technique. Poorly. When it didn't get him repeatedly thrown out. Why couldn't he develop another one? An injury? A mental block? A lack of intellectual ability? The coaching staff told him to keep failing that way?

That is not the same thing. You said he didn't practice enough; you can control that. Him being young and needing more experience, while true, is not something Rakkel can change.

It is funny because you just refuted your own point. There are tons of logical reasons someone could practice a ton but not show statistical improvement. Injury, other players having film on him, his wingers being ineffective at retrieving pucks, he simply he may not be naturally good at faceoffs, ect. Perhaps he was using that faceoff move because it was simply his best one (even if it was not incredibly effective). There a tons of centers who struggle on the dot - for some of them it severely affects their livelihood, and yet they do not get much better at it - do you think those guys are not practicing?

You will notice I have not made an statements suggesting he did practice- simply that neither I, or you, know. Which is why you are wrong to speak in absolutes as if you know things you just don't. Unless you are a part of the ducks training staff, in which case i would be thrilled to hear your inside information.

There is a reason multiple posters do not understand/are questioning your logic, that should tell you something, and I will leave it at that.

 

[Nurmagomedov]

Raks wasn't good, no point arguing that. But it is just a fact that we are going to have to rely on young players progressing to improve. Not just Raks but the goalies and d-men as well. Plus Silf, Etem, Sekac etc. Maybe Wagner can bring some competition to the center spot do drive Rakell forward but that's about it. Outside help isn't coming at least until the trade deadline.

Practising does make you better but it doesn't do it overnight. And there's still limits to what you'll be able to do. Fowler will never have a good slapper, Maroon will never be a good skater. Maybe Raks will never be good at faceoffs, there's plenty of tenured centers in the league who are not. Doesn't mean you dump him, especially as he did show a fair bit of NHL ability this season. Even more especially as you have a budget to adhere to.

 

[TheJoeMan]

If face-offs were so easy to figure out in practice that's all centers would do and they entire league would be 50%. Some players are good at some things, some are good at others, some are good at everything. I think it's a joke to suggest Rakell doesn't practice enough at face-offs as if anyone here watches every single practice. Getzlaf isn't good at face-offs either. His numbers improved a bit this year due to the new hash-marks but he's still resorting to that stupid shoot-it-forward move that drives me crazy.

Face-offs are all about timing, reading the linesman and getting help from your wingers. Toews rarely won a draw clean. What he does is tie up his opponent and either win it with his feet or his wingers dig it out. A lot of the time winning or losing a draw is as much on all three forwards as it is on the center.

Ricky didn't have a great playoffs but this was his first real taste of it after his first full season. He improved by leaps and bounds this year. Keep in mind by the same age Bonino was barely cracking an NHL roster and it would take another three years for him to equal the amount of scoring Rakell has amassed so far and Bonino sucked at face-offs too. This kid is moving in the right direction and I feel like he's shouldering a hell of a lot of blame for our fourth line center. He's a role player. The blame needs to stay firmly on the top guys who are paid top-dollar to lead us to a championship.

 

[The Midnight Burrito]

He's probably received the most criticism of the playoffs. That is irksome. Meanwhile Etem gets another pass and is penciled in for 10-15 goals next year. I didn't say a word up until now, but it's getting ridiculous.

So don't pass him, I guess. Etem is pretty much giving me what I expect at this point. Rakell was given an important role and sucked. He's not the reason we're out but a better 3C would have helped. But, here's hoping Rakell's development goes smoother than Etem's.

 

[Ducks DVM]

That is not the same thing. You said he didn't practice enough; you can control that. Him being young and needing more experience, while true, is not something Rakkel can change.

It is funny because you just refuted your own point. There are tons of logical reasons someone could practice a ton but not show statistical improvement. Injury, other players having film on him, his wingers being ineffective at retrieving pucks, he simply he may not be naturally good at faceoffs, ect. Perhaps he was using that faceoff move because it was simply his best one (even if it was not incredibly effective). There a tons of centers who struggle on the dot - for some of them it severely affects their livelihood, and yet they do not get much better at it - do you think those guys are not practicing?

You will notice I have not made an statements suggesting he did practice- simply that neither I, or you, know. Which is why you are wrong to speak in absolutes as if you know things you just don't. Unless you are a part of the ducks training staff, in which case i would be thrilled to hear your inside information.

There is a reason multiple posters do not understand/are questioning your logic, that should tell you something, and I will leave it at that.

Multiple posters have also agreed with me. Your failure to understand what I'm saying does not mean my logic is flawed. There are a ton of hypothetical situations that could be at play, you are correct. Occam's razor says its a practice thing. You are correct, I can't absolutely confirm that. Then again, I can't absolutely confirm that bigfoot doesn't exist either. People are getting bent out of shape because they think I'm saying Rakell has a character flaw, and I've never said or implied that. I made a factual statement that over the course of his life, he hasn't practiced enough to be better than he is. Literally the only way that is an incorrect statement is if he CANNOT be any better than he is right now, and that's a far more unsupportable statement than anything I've said.

I'm going to speak in absolutes because the idea that he's topped out at his age is pretty ludicrous for someone multiple coaches have decided is a center, and the fact that he has only that one move. He should have many. He should mix them up. He should occasionally tie the other center up so his wingers CAN help him. He's not injured in a fashion that restricts him to that one move or he would have been rested at some point during the season. His wingers aren't forcing him to that one move (and he is typically beat cleanly regardless, so they're irrelevant). If it's his best move, that pretty much speaks to my point that he hasn't practiced enough - it's a horrible move in many of the situations he uses it, and there's a word for forwards who are horrible at faceoffs - "wing".

I am of the opinion that anyone can improve anything with practice. The truly gifted can do more with less practice, but it is possible for someone less innately gifted to be better than someone who is if they outwork them in practice. And I don't believe that anyone can't improve at all. I do believe that most people do not practice at the level of intensity required to be the best in their field, and that most people with a good amount of talent usually don't apply themselves 100% - because they don't have to. I include myself in that assessment. That doesn't mean that they get a free pass for not working as hard as the guy who isn't nearly as blessed but actually does apply themselves to their maximum potential. You may disagree with your world view, and that's your right.

 

[nbducksfan19]

Multiple posters have also agreed with me. Your failure to understand what I'm saying does not mean my logic is flawed. There are a ton of hypothetical situations that could be at play, you are correct. Occam's razor says its a practice thing. You are correct, I can't absolutely confirm that. Then again, I can't absolutely confirm that bigfoot doesn't exist either. People are getting bent out of shape because they think I'm saying Rakell has a character flaw, and I've never said or implied that. I made a factual statement that over the course of his life, he hasn't practiced enough to be better than he is. Literally the only way that is an incorrect statement is if he CANNOT be any better than he is right now, and that's a far more unsupportable statement than anything I've said.

I'm going to speak in absolutes because the idea that he's topped out at his age is pretty ludicrous for someone multiple coaches have decided is a center, and the fact that he has only that one move. He should have many. He should mix them up. He should occasionally tie the other center up so his wingers CAN help him. He's not injured in a fashion that restricts him to that one move or he would have been rested at some point during the season. His wingers aren't forcing him to that one move (and he is typically beat cleanly regardless, so they're irrelevant). If it's his best move, that pretty much speaks to my point that he hasn't practiced enough - it's a horrible move in many of the situations he uses it, and there's a word for forwards who are horrible at faceoffs - "wing".

I am of the opinion that anyone can improve anything with practice. The truly gifted can do more with less practice, but it is possible for someone less innately gifted to be better than someone who is if they outwork them in practice. And I don't believe that anyone can't improve at all. I do believe that most people do not practice at the level of intensity required to be the best in their field, and that most people with a good amount of talent usually don't apply themselves 100% - because they don't have to. I include myself in that assessment. That doesn't mean that they get a free pass for not working as hard as the guy who isn't nearly as blessed but actually does apply themselves to their maximum potential. You may disagree with your world view, and that's your right.

Who? Also, you use "literal" for things which are not "literal". All in all, this is silly, I wish Rakkel would have practiced shooting more through the course of his life so he had a shot like Ovechkin, or at the very least Kessel. Alas, he is young and I am sure he will continue to get better, with practice of course...

 

[Ducks DVM]

Who? Also, you use "literal" for things which are not "literal". All in all, this is silly, I wish Rakkel would have practiced shooting more through the course of his life so he had a shot like Ovechkin, or at the very least Kessel. Alas, he is young and I am sure he will continue to get better, with practice of course...

I'm assuming you can read for yourself.

I agree, it is silly. When you're interested in an honest debate we can do this again some time.

 

[nbducksfan19]

I'm assuming you can read for yourself.

I agree, it is silly. When you're interested in an honest debate we can do this again some time.

That's code for no one.

and exactly what makes this debate dishonest?

at this point agree to disagree. What we can agree on is that Rakkel needs to improve in taking faceoff's. Who knows maybe a new coach could help with that..

 

[Ducks DVM]

That's code for no one.

and exactly what makes this debate dishonest?

at this point agree to disagree. What we can agree on is that Rakkel needs to improve in taking faceoff's. Who knows maybe a new coach could help with that..

No, it's code for read the posts that say "Rakell needs practice".

I never said practice would turn Rakell into Toews at the faceoff dot. Making absurd statements to imply that what's being said is as equally absurd is a garbage debate technique.

As is criticizing semantics while not actually answering the question that was posed to you. Or even proving that your semantics criticism was accurate.

I actually think that getting Oates in as an assistant would do wonders for both the PP and the team faceoff %, but thats never going to happen. Not a bad idea though.

 

[nbducksfan19]

No, it's code for read the posts that say "Rakell needs practice".

I never said practice would turn Rakell into Toews at the faceoff dot. Making absurd statements to imply that what's being said is as equally absurd is a garbage debate technique.

As is criticizing semantics while not actually answering the question that was posed to you. Or even proving that your semantics criticism was accurate.

I actually think that getting Oates in as an assistant would do wonders for both the PP and the team faceoff %, but thats never going to happen. Not a bad idea though.

Everyone says he needs practice? That does not support your statements one iota. Nice try though.

 

[duxfever]

No, it's code for read the posts that say "Rakell needs practice".

I never said practice would turn Rakell into Toews at the faceoff dot. Making absurd statements to imply that what's being said is as equally absurd is a garbage debate technique.

As is criticizing semantics while not actually answering the question that was posed to you. Or even proving that your semantics criticism was accurate.

I actually think that getting Oates in as an assistant would do wonders for both the PP and the team faceoff %, but thats never going to happen. Not a bad idea though.

What would you do with Rakell? Where do you see him fitting? What do you think of his development?

I'm curious because it really just seems like you have a bone to pick with the guy and he is your scapegoat. It is not Rakell's fault that he was probably thrust into a spot he was not ready for since BM did not acquire anyone else and, therefore, Rakell did not have the proper amount of practice to live up to your ridiculous expectations for a 21 year old. I think the guy did a damn good job this year even after a somewhat disappointing postseason (at least his one point was an OT winner).

Rakell was respectable against Winnipeg (47.9%) and Calgary (48.9%) in the dot. He definitely struggled against the better centers that Chicago had, which is to be expected due to being young and not having as much time to develop.

The biggest annoyance about your argument is the insinuation that Rakell has not practiced enough or he could have done more. You just do not know that. For all we know, he has practiced enough with the time he has played the game (practice and games) and done what the coaches have asked, but it has not been enough yet to yield results, YET.

 

[The Midnight Burrito]

What would you do with Rakell? Where do you see him fitting? What do you think of his development?

I'm curious because it really just seems like you have a bone to pick with the guy and he is your scapegoat. It is not Rakell's fault that he was probably thrust into a spot he was not ready for since BM did not acquire anyone else and, therefore, Rakell did not have the proper amount of practice to live up to your ridiculous expectations for a 21 year old. I think the guy did a damn good job this year even after a somewhat disappointing postseason (at least his one point was an OT winner).

Rakell was respectable against Winnipeg (47.9%) and Calgary (48.9%) in the dot. He definitely struggled against the better centers that Chicago had, which is to be expected due to being young and not having as much time to develop.

The biggest annoyance about your argument is the insinuation that Rakell has not practiced enough or he could have done more. You just do not know that. For all we know, he has practiced enough with the time he has played the game (practice and games) and done what the coaches have asked, but it has not been enough yet to yield results, YET.

Gat damn, tell a kid he needs to work harder if he wants to improve and the HF army mobilizes.

 

[duxfever]

Gat damn, tell a kid he needs to work harder if he wants to improve and the HF army mobilizes.

Not really the argument at all, but okay. Of course I agree Rakell still needs to work hard and get better, but I also understand that he is not near the player he is going to be because he has not had the time to develop. This is why expectations sometimes need to be tempered for younger players and patience needs to be instilled. The FO gets it.

 

[Sojourn]

I'm not sure why people are ******** their pants over the idea that Rakell wasn't effective. He wasn't. In the end he was hugely sheltered and he still wasn't good. Does anyone disagree with that? Does anyone disagree that we'd have had a better roster in the playoffs with Bonino rather than him? I'd like to hear a rational reason why, because I can't think of one.

He might be due for a big step up next season, he was actually starting to look pretty good at times later in the regular season. But his potential didn't make our fourth line not crap.

The problem is that, I think, it's easy to focus on those good stretches Rakell had and overlook some of the less impressive ones. Unfortunately, what we got from him in the playoffs, when it mattered the most, was the less impressive Rakell. He's a young kid, and he's going to have ups and downs.

I think DaDucks has a bit of an agenda in his defense of Rakell, though. He was the one who seemed confident young guys like Holland and Rakell would surpass the play of Koivu, from last season. Not all of us were convinced, pointing out that experienced , and for good reason it seems.

Ultimately, I think Rakell was as expected. At least, as I expected. He showed some promise, but not with any kind of consistency. I think some were quick to suggest he had arrived this season. It was an encouraging season from him, but that's as far as I'd take it. My issue isn't with Rakell, specifically. He can't really help the fact he's a young kid who has a lot to learn, but there was no contingency. If he struggled, which he did, the Ducks had no one who could step in and take the responsibility. All that could be done is cut into his ice time, shelter him, and hope he still manages to do something... which he didn't.

 

[snarktacular]

What should we do with Rakell? Sign a vet center, slot him in wing with occasional center duties. Or rotate him with some other guys. If he surpasses vet center, then trade the vet.

 

[duxfever]

What should we do with Rakell? Sign a vet center, slot him in wing with occasional center duties. Or rotate him with some other guys. If he surpasses vet center, then trade the vet.

This would be ideal. I like Rakell's skill set. I would move Etem and Palmieri before I moved Rakell.

 

[Paul4587]

What should we do with Rakell? Sign a vet center, slot him in wing with occasional center duties. Or rotate him with some other guys. If he surpasses vet center, then trade the vet.

Yeah or move the vet to wing. Or move Thompson to wing. Moving from C to W is a fairly easy transition and the extra depth will only help in the postseason.

I know it's been said 100 times but I wonder if we're still playing right now if we hadn't let MP22 go.

 

[The Midnight Burrito]

Not really the argument at all, but okay. Of course I agree Rakell still needs to work hard and get better, but I also understand that he is not near the player he is going to be because he has not had the time to develop. This is why expectations sometimes need to be tempered for younger players and patience needs to be instilled. The FO gets it.

You've no idea what my expectations were. Nor DVM's for that matter. Regardless, our expectations can't go back in time and transform his faceoff performance into something not terrible. It can only make us feel less bad about how terrible they were, which is where I suspect all these spirited defenses are coming from.

 

[The Midnight Burrito]

What should we do with Rakell? Sign a vet center, slot him in wing with occasional center duties. Or rotate him with some other guys. If he surpasses vet center, then trade the vet.

I mentioned fisher before. Is he still pending ufa?

 

[duxfever]

You've no idea what my expectations were. Nor DVM's for that matter. Regardless, our expectations can't go back in time and transform his faceoff performance into something not terrible. It can only make us feel less bad about how terrible they were, which is where I suspect all these spirited defenses are coming from.

Well would you mind informing me what your expectations were? Did you expect him to be a 50%+ guy in the dot?

 

[duxfever]

I mentioned fisher before. Is he still pending ufa?

Yes. Fisher is a guy I would love to have. He might be too expensive though.

 

[Ducks DVM]

What would you do with Rakell? Where do you see him fitting? What do you think of his development?

I'm curious because it really just seems like you have a bone to pick with the guy and he is your scapegoat. It is not Rakell's fault that he was probably thrust into a spot he was not ready for since BM did not acquire anyone else and, therefore, Rakell did not have the proper amount of practice to live up to your ridiculous expectations for a 21 year old. I think the guy did a damn good job this year even after a somewhat disappointing postseason (at least his one point was an OT winner).

Rakell was respectable against Winnipeg (47.9%) and Calgary (48.9%) in the dot. He definitely struggled against the better centers that Chicago had, which is to be expected due to being young and not having as much time to develop.

The biggest annoyance about your argument is the insinuation that Rakell has not practiced enough or he could have done more. You just do not know that. For all we know, he has practiced enough with the time he has played the game (practice and games) and done what the coaches have asked, but it has not been enough yet to yield results, YET.

I made one comment that he could have worked harder on one skill, and also blamed the entire rest of the organization for the situation. I got attacked for that opinion, and have defended my viewpoint. If that's your opinion of a whipping boy, I don't know what to say.

The most annoying thing about your argument is the insistence that he couldn't possibly be any better than he is or have worked harder in the course of his entire hockey career. I did get a good chuckle out of TJM using Getzlaf's faceoff % as a rookie as a comparable when the discussion revolves around effort/practice though, considering that consistent effort was the knock on him coming into the league.

I'm fine with giving Rakell the season to see if he continues to develop. Hopefully he finally develops a shot, because virtually all of his goals are as fluky as Etem's, and he hit enough posts early in the year to indicate it should improve. Hopefully he learns some more faceoff moves. Hopefully he continues to figure out when not to try fancy dangles at this level. If he doesn't, then I want a legitimate 3C rental at the deadline and park his ass on the wing for the playoffs.

 

[Getzmonster]

I don't mind Rakell as our #3/4C, my beef is that we no longer have competition for that spot. Rakell has it on lockdown for better or worse. Maybe Wagner adds some of that next season, he's not as offensive, but it's something.

 

[KaseMeOutside]

What should we do with Rakell? Sign a vet center, slot him in wing with occasional center duties. Or rotate him with some other guys. If he surpasses vet center, then trade the vet.

take a look at the FA market
then find someone better who will be financially viable here