Remaining CBJ games with no fans? (COVID-19 pandemic thread)

[KCbus]

Ohio has 3 cases, none in central Ohio. 15 are under investigation or being tested. That's 0.0001% of the state population - and all the confirmed cases are in northeast Ohio. Now, if we were actually testing at the scales of, say, South Korea...then we might have a different answer.

All in Cuyohoga County, if I'm not mistaken. But while that isn't "Central Ohio", it isn't Fiji, either. It's certainly not out of the realm of possibility that someone from Columbus could have been in that county recently on business.

But my issue with the Governor's recommendation is why there is a distinction for outdoor and indoor events. Going to a Crew game isn't any less likely to result in an infection (statistically, very low right now) than going to a Blue Jackets game. The virus doesn't just dissipate up in the air.

I'd be lying if I said I understood that part.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

I'd be lying if I said I understood that part.

It’s a surface and contact -borne illness. Outdoor events have surfaces and contact.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

If we reach a point where going out in public is stupid, it’s already too late. Canceling live attendance at sporting events and other mass gatherings for 3 weeks won’t make it go away.

Well, I don't think the idea is "wait three weeks, and it'll be over." I think it's more like "hopefully we'll have a better idea of what the hell is going on by then."

There’s a thing called ‘flattening the curve.’ I’m not an expert but it’s about not compressing the time that everyone comes into contact with it. If you can spread that time out, it is less taxing on medical facilities and resources.

 

[Monk]

There’s a thing called ‘flattening the curve.’ I’m not an expert but it’s about not compressing the time that everyone comes into contact with it. If you can spread that time out, it is less taxing on medical facilities and resources.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/outl...us-response-seems-so-outsized/?outputType=amp

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/outl...us-response-seems-so-outsized/?outputType=amp

Let’s be careful about bringing political opinions, even in links, but yes there’s a bit of that ‘flattening’ in that piece.

 

[Monk]

Let’s be careful about bringing political opinions, even in links, but yet there’s a bit of that ‘flattening’ in that piece.

Fair enough. Feel free to delete or pull out the relevant "curve flattening" part (I'm on my phone so can't do that too easily) . It popped up in my news feed and that bit of the article tied in nicely to your comment.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

Fair enough. Feel free to delete or pull out the relevant "curve flattening" part (I'm on my phone so can't do that too easily) . It popped up in my news feed and that bit of the article tied in nicely to your comment.

Nope, I think (hope?) the link can be read in the spirit in which it was shared.

Found the things where I saw the term first:

How canceled events and self-quarantines save lives, in one chart

 

[banshee72]

I'm on team overreaction on this one. However, at the same time, I think the situation is a little more serious than some people think. If you really think that there are only 3 cases in Ohio and none in central Ohio, you are probably kidding yourself. The virus takes an average of 5 days to show symptoms and sometimes as many as 12. Many people only show mild symptoms such as the common cold. If what they are saying is correct and it can be spread while carriers are asymptomatic, this whole thing is likely much bigger than anyone knows. You have to keep in mind that what is being reported is just CONFIRMED cases...in all likely hood we are probably looking at at least 10x that number.

 

[MoeBartoli]

The Sharks next home games will be in an empty arena. Assuming the Jackets continue to play with the arena open, does anyone know if they are refunding tickets for those who choose not to attend because of the virus?

 

[Cyclones Rock]

Fair enough. Feel free to delete or pull out the relevant "curve flattening" part (I'm on my phone so can't do that too easily) . It popped up in my news feed and that bit of the article tied in nicely to your comment.

It was a political hit piece. Period.

 

[Speedy Sanderson]

CBJ just released a statement that games will go on with fans in the stands if they want to attend.

 

[Iron Balls McGinty]

The Sharks next home games will be in an empty arena. Assuming the Jackets continue to play with the arena open, does anyone know if they are refunding tickets for those who choose not to attend because of the virus?

I’m going to guess no. It’s not really different than anyone who chooses not to attend due to a cold or other conflict in my mind.

 

[banshee72]

I would agree. I think at some point its either going to be all or nothing. If they start t0 issue refunds to people they might as well just pull the plug and say no fans.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

Blue Jackets statement regarding Coronavirus COVID-19

...it has been determined that our scheduled games, including this Thursday vs. Pittsburgh and Saturday vs. Nashville, will go on as scheduled and be open to ticketed fans that wish to attend.

 

[Iron Balls McGinty]

I would agree. I think at some point its either going to be all or nothing. If they start t0 issue refunds to people they might as well just pull the plug and say no fans.

It is one thing to issue refunds to people if they have no option to attend. It is another if they have the option to attend and don't go. I'm not forced to go to any games I have tickets for and they wouldn't refund me if I decided not to go because of a cold or working late or whatever. I can't see any scenario where any event will offer refunds unless it is cancelled or people are actually barred from attending.

 

[Lumbus]

Nm

 

[banshee72]

I agree 100%. I think the minute they start offering refunds the minute they are basically admitting to the fans that it may be unsafe for them to be there. I think it's either has to be you play the game with the fans or you don't. Right now they have chosen to play on with the fans. If this blows up bigger, they may have to revisit that, but I think you are right, I dont see a scenario where they start refunding tickets....unless they ban fans from the arena

 

[spintheblackcircle]

bad decision

 

[Lumbus]

Nope, I think (hope?) the link can be read in the spirit in which it was shared.

Found the things where I saw the term first:

How canceled events and self-quarantines save lives, in one chart

Hi, doctor here. Just want to lend a bit of medical/scientific perspective to this conversation.

If you haven't yet, I'd highly recommend reading the article DSL linked to. It contains a lot of important information. This novel coronavirus, COVID19, is here to stay and is not going anywhere soon. The recommendations that Governor De Wine has made aim to help slow down the spread of this virus. This is important for many reasons.

For one, this country's hospital resources are already stretched so thin. About 90% of intensive-care hospital beds are already taken, masks that healthcare workers wear to prevent the spread of the virus are extremely limited, and workers must go into quarantine for 14 days if they're known to have been exposed to or test positive for coronavirus. There just aren't enough doctors, nurses, pharmacists, etc... to care for patients if too many get exposed and have to be quarantined.

By slowing down the spread of the virus with things like these social distancing policies, the burden placed on hospitals will be eased, and patients will be able to get the care that they need. This is the "flattening of the curve" that was mentioned earlier in this thread.

The reason the number of confirmed coronavirus cases is so low is that hospitals and local health agencies simply do not have many test kits and are thus unable to test very many people.

There's new research coming out that shows coronavirus has a mortality rate approaching 10% and greater for people above 70 years old with underlying health problems. Yes, a younger generally healthy patient will essentially only experience cold and flu-like symptoms.

But these policies of canceling/avoiding large events are meant to limit the spread of the virus and keep safe those around us that are most vulnerable. And history (1918 flu pandemic) shows that these actions work.

 

[Monk]

It was a political hit piece. Period.

I apologize if it offended you, didn't mean to. I found the curve flattening part relevant and interesting.

 

[Cyclones Rock]

I'm taking a break from games until this virus scenario plays out a bit. The primary reason is that I have an elderly and frail mother who is 88 years old in a nursing home. The mortality rate is roughly 20% from what I've read for her demographic. Better safe than sorry.

If I did not have this situation, I would continue to go to games. While I'm not a spring chicken, I'm still not in a high risk (for mortality) demographic.

Age of Coronavirus Deaths

COVID-19 Fatality Rate by AGE:

*Death Rate = (number of deaths / number of cases) = probability of dying if infected by the virus (%). This probability differs depending on the age group. The percentages shown below do not have to add up to 100%, as they do NOT represent share of deaths by age group. Rather, it represents, for a person in a given age group, the risk of dying if infected with COVID-19.

AGE	DEATH RATE confirmed cases	DEATH RATE all cases
80+ years old	21.9%	14.8%
70-79 years old	8.0%
60-69 years old	3.6%
50-59 years old	1.3%
40-49 years old	0.4%
30-39 years old	0.2%
20-29 years old	0.2%
10-19 years old	0.2%
0-9 years old	no fatalities

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

*Death Rate = (number of deaths / number of cases) = probability of dying if infected by the virus (%). The percentages do not have to add up to 100%, as they do NOT represent share of deaths by age group.
In general, relatively few cases are seen among children.

Coronavirus Age, Sex, Demographics (COVID-19) - Worldometer

***I'll assume this info is accurate as I have no way to prove or disprove it***

 

[Lumbus]

Here's a great visual of the "flatten the curve" message:

And here is a great visual representation of how 2 different major cities responded to the 1918 flu pandemic. One city (St. Louis) canceled all large public events and implemented social distancing policies to halt its spread. The other city (Philadelphia) did not. The difference is stark:

Hi, doctor here. Just want to lend a bit of medical/scientific perspective to this conversation.

If you haven't yet, I'd highly recommend reading the article DSL linked to. It contains a lot of important information. This novel coronavirus, COVID19, is here to stay and is not going anywhere soon. The recommendations that Governor De Wine has made aim to help slow down the spread of this virus. This is important for many reasons.

For one, this country's hospital resources are already stretched so thin. About 90% of intensive-care hospital beds are already taken, masks that healthcare workers wear to prevent the spread of the virus are extremely limited, and workers must go into quarantine for 14 days if they're known to have been exposed to or test positive for coronavirus. There just aren't enough doctors, nurses, pharmacists, etc... to care for patients if too many get exposed and have to be quarantined.

By slowing down the spread of the virus with things like these social distancing policies, the burden placed on hospitals will be eased, and patients will be able to get the care that they need. This is the "flattening of the curve" that was mentioned earlier in this thread.

The reason the number of confirmed coronavirus cases is so low is that hospitals and local health agencies simply do not have many test kits and are thus unable to test very many people.

There's new research coming out that shows coronavirus has a mortality rate approaching 10% and greater for people above 70 years old with underlying health problems. Yes, a younger generally healthy patient will essentially only experience cold and flu-like symptoms.

But these policies of canceling/avoiding large events are meant to limit the spread of the virus and keep safe those around us that are most vulnerable. And history (1918 flu pandemic) shows that these actions work.

 

[Lumbus]

Edit: Ireland (Ireland!!) canceled its St. Patrick's Day Parades)

One last important note that I'd like to make...

The USA simply has not tested very many people. Every other country has tested significantly more people than USA (South Korea has tested over 700x as many people per capita). We just don't know yet where the virus is.

I can confidently presume that Ohio has more than 3 cases. The problem is our system just doesn't have the capability to confirm that at this point.

Please, please do whatever you can to keep yourself and those around you safe.

From CDC data:

 

[Johansen2Foligno]

Curious to see what attendance is like.

 

[Lumbus]

I'm taking a break from games until this virus scenario plays out a bit. The primary reason is that I have an elderly and frail mother who is 88 years old in a nursing home. The mortality rate is roughly 20% from what I've read for her demographic. Better safe than sorry.

If I did not have this situation, I would continue to go to games. While I'm not a spring chicken, I'm still not in a high risk (for mortality) demographic.

Age of Coronavirus Deaths

COVID-19 Fatality Rate by AGE:

*Death Rate = (number of deaths / number of cases) = probability of dying if infected by the virus (%). This probability differs depending on the age group. The percentages shown below do not have to add up to 100%, as they do NOT represent share of deaths by age group. Rather, it represents, for a person in a given age group, the risk of dying if infected with COVID-19.

AGE	DEATH RATE confirmed cases	DEATH RATE all cases
80+ years old	21.9%	14.8%
70-79 years old	8.0%
60-69 years old	3.6%
50-59 years old	1.3%
40-49 years old	0.4%
30-39 years old	0.2%
20-29 years old	0.2%
10-19 years old	0.2%
0-9 years old	no fatalities

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

*Death Rate = (number of deaths / number of cases) = probability of dying if infected by the virus (%). The percentages do not have to add up to 100%, as they do NOT represent share of deaths by age group.
In general, relatively few cases are seen among children.

Coronavirus Age, Sex, Demographics (COVID-19) - Worldometer

***I'll assume this info is accurate as I have no way to prove or disprove it***

Can confirm, this is in line with the best data available. The caveat is that we really just do not know the scope of what we're dealing with at this point. Eventually we will once USA's testing capacity increases and more accurate numbers are reported.

I have elderly loved ones too. Keep doing what you're doing and keep your mother safe