Post-Game Talk: Red Wings - 14 Penguins - 64

[drpepper]

The more things change; the more they stay the same.

Datsyuk on Lovejoy two years ago and yesterday.

 

[Waffle Fries]

Letang, an admitted emotional player on the ice, was frustrated with Red Wings goaltender Petr Mrazek. There were several incidents in the Detroit crease throughout the game. One resulted in a Pittsburgh goal being waved off. Another caused Mrazek to fall to the ice.

The Pens weren’t pleased about the situation. And Letang vocalized it with the officials.

“I’m an emotional guy on the ice,†Letang said. “On that particularly I was just frustrated with the play of the goalie.â€

But Letang wasn’t going to give details of what was said that resulted in his ejection.

“It stays on the ice,†Letang said. “It’s in the past so I’ll keep it in the past.â€
http://penguins.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=758334&cmpid=pit-fb-penguins

I would love to know what he said. Interesting that it was about Mrazek. I had some choice words about him myself

 

[Satrebil]

Wings fan here. I've have not seen the Penguins go off the rails like that in a long time. What gives?

 

[plaidchuck]

Lol zetterberg is that you?

 

[MtlPenFan]

Wings fan here. I've have not seen the Penguins go off the rails like that in a long time. What gives?

Dunno. Team gets accused of being dirty and diving, yet your goalie acted like he was literally killed.

The way he fell back, it was like that slo-mo death scene in Platoon.

 

[Will Hunting]

Wings fan here. I've have not seen the Penguins go off the rails like that in a long time. What gives?

I will try to give you a solid answer, no flaming. It happens against the Flyers sometimes (well, quite a lot actually). Yesterday, the frustration was kinda understandable. Bad game vs Boston the other day and then bad start vs DET. The refs haven´t made us any favors either with those 5on3s and misconducts, then a disallowed goal. I mean, why is it so hard to understand the frustration? They are humen after all.

 

[Satrebil]

I'll just put this here.

http://www.tsn.ca/c-mon-ref-third-man-in-not-in-this-case-1.232409

 

[plaidchuck]

What a joke. A pro league that officiates based on reputation.

 

[SHOOTANDSCORE]

No kidding. At least wrestling is entertaining.

 

[TheSniper26]

Big expectations?
Lets say you have a team where the four go to players are two centers, a defender and a goalie. The two centers are first and second in the league on ppg, the defenseman leads all such in ppg and us having his best ever season also from a defensive perspective (at least minus the first month of the season). The goalie? He us having his best ever season statistically.

Add to this, the team spends to the cap and used plenty of futures this season to further top up.

That's the Pens. If we should not have great expectations, who should?
When we consistently don't deliver when needed, it is only natural that people try to look beyond the numbers. No easy truths, but clearly there's more to winning than points per game for individuals.

Took me a bit to get back to this but of course there's more to winning than ppg. But the post I was responding to was basically dismissing Crosby's production as meaningless. And I'm sorry but that's a pretty spoiled attitude. There are a lot of teams in this league that would kill to get a guy who's outproducing the league in a "down year". Production doesn't just happen. Nobody falls ass backwards into the scoring lead. Crosby's great but he's not Mario. He can't coast around racking up points on absurd skill alone. The guy has to work pretty hard for every point and he has this season.

Can he be better? Sure. He hasn't played his best this season and there's no denying that. But he's been nowhere near as bad as this board pretends. It seems like the "Crosby sucks; Geno carries the team!" narrative was set pretty early on this season and true objectivity hasn't come anywhere near the discussion since. I'm ok with big expectations but the hyperbole and double standards have gotten pretty old.

 

[Hophog]

What a joke. A pro league that officiates based on reputation.

The odd thing is that I think most of us figured this out years ago but apparently the Pens are the last to know. I was hoping the Johnson would put an end to all of the talking to the officials but I'm not sure that anyone can control this team.

It's even obvious in the beer league I play in. Certain players have a reputation for whining and the ref's seem to go out of their way to let things go against these players. I'm pretty sure they get a little bit of a kick out of it and probably joke around about it with the other officials when they aren't playing hockey.

I understand the point of the Captain telling the refs about a call they might have missed but beating it into the ground and making the official have to try to explain himself does nothing but make him dislike you.

At any rate, I'd like to see the Pens coach make a rule that there is no talking to the officials under any circumstances. I suppose Crosby should be able to say his peace but I really think he's probably a lot of the problem, with the officials, starts with him. I honestly think that just shutting up and letting the coach and GM, if need be, handle it with the league. I believe more of a message would be sent if they just went about their job, like Horny seems to do and earn some respect from the officials rather than trying to make them see how stupid they are. I'm fairly certain officials have big egos so you're not going to win by constantly putting them on the spot, in my opinion. I guess I'm stating the obvious but it baffles me that the Penguins and their coaches can't seem to figure it out.

 

[Jules Winnfield]

BB is just another third liner now. Another failed first round pick.

He will develop elsewhere and be a 20+ goal scorer per year, mark my words.

I'm convinced this organization cannot develop any players themselves and rely on young talent to make their choice simple for them to keep them.

Outside of top picks in the draft and the luck of Maatta and Letang, who have the Pens developed recently? Exactly.

 

[madinsomniac]

He will develop elsewhere and be a 20+ goal scorer per year, mark my words.

I'm convinced this organization cannot develop any players themselves and rely on young talent to make their choice simple for them to keep them.

Outside of top picks in the draft and the luck of Maatta and Letang, who have the Pens developed recently? Exactly.

Basically, outside of Letang, few players for the Pens are drafted and make a star name for themselves unless they are NHL ready out of the box and are in the league as 18 or 19 year olds... they just don't give them the NHL minutes in the correct roles to develop them... they would rather play a 35+ year old vet on the decline than a young guy in the top 6 despite NHL regular season games being relatively meaningless...

 

[WayneSid9987]

I imagine Letang saying "do you not see him flopping? is this a joke?".
Refs already in a tizzy from Downie and Kunitz and T'ed him up, the max.

 

[Giskard]

Basically, outside of Letang, few players for the Pens are drafted and make a star name for themselves unless they are NHL ready out of the box and are in the league as 18 or 19 year olds... they just don't give them the NHL minutes in the correct roles to develop them... they would rather play a 35+ year old vet on the decline than a young guy in the top 6 despite NHL regular season games being relatively meaningless...

The problem is that we have nobody to try in a top-6 role. Bennett was already broken from Bylsma & co., and I'm fine with him as 3rd line to try to go back on the right path without the pressure of top-6 duties.
Who else do we have? Rust was given some top-6 time, and perform good in some games, but he is not really top-6 material, but will be a good bottom-6. Megna totally disappear this year and Wilson got injured in his first game. The only other name is Kapanen and since we only have a 2nd in this draft, I don't expect our top-6 pool to improve a lot.

 

[ColePens]

I imagine Letang saying "do you not see him flopping? is this a joke?".
Refs already in a tizzy from Downie and Kunitz and T'ed him up, the max.

Oh I bet it was a looooooot more spirited than that. I bet he said some darn good things to him.

 

[Michael8771*]

Like many here I'm highly disappointed in the direction this team has taken. There's quite a few systemic issues that haven't been remedied and in fact have been fortified. Lack of Discipline and accountability chiefly among them. Double standards, passed over uneven efforts, lack of adjustments and on and on. I love my team, but it's rather difficult to respect them ATM.

There's been some good decisions made, but for every such good one there are two or three you just shake your head at.

 

[Ogelthorpe]

The fact that officials openly acknowledge that they make or do not make calls, based on reputation or how a team acts is a joke. Do the Pens need to act more professional? Yes. However, so do the refs. These guys get six figure salaries to call an impartial and fair game. If the way a team acts causes them to "teach them a lesson" by allowing other teams to get away with stuff while they hammer said team with penalties, that is essentially fixing the game, which is a crime!

I'm sorry but part of the reason refs make so much is the fact that they will have to put up with some crap. If they are to fragile to take some chirping, they don't deserve the job, or the money that goes with it. A lot of people have jobs where they put up with way more ****, and get paid way less. If someone goes over the line and you want to give them a 10, fine, but when that player returns, if he gets roughed, or hooked, or tripped, call it, because that is your job. IF the player needs taught a lesson, it's up to the league to do it, not the officials. In fact, if refs overstep their boundaries and purposely screw a team to prove a point, the league should punish them too.

 

[Coastal Kev]

The fact that officials openly acknowledge that they make or do not make calls, based on reputation or how a team acts is a joke. Do the Pens need to act more professional? Yes. However, so do the refs. These guys get six figure salaries to call an impartial and fair game. If the way a team acts causes them to "teach them a lesson" by allowing other teams to get away with stuff while they hammer said team with penalties, that is essentially fixing the game, which is a crime!

I'm sorry but part of the reason refs make so much is the fact that they will have to put up with some crap. If they are to fragile to take some chirping, they don't deserve the job, or the money that goes with it. A lot of people have jobs where they put up with way more ****, and get paid way less. If someone goes over the line and you want to give them a 10, fine, but when that player returns, if he gets roughed, or hooked, or tripped, call it, because that is your job. IF the player needs taught a lesson, it's up to the league to do it, not the officials. In fact, if refs overstep their boundaries and purposely screw a team to prove a point, the league should punish them too.

I blame the Penguin organization. They should be raising holy hell with the league and should push severe punishment for Referee bias.

 

[Ugene Magic]

I blame the Penguin organization. They should be raising holy hell with the league and should push severe punishment for Referee bias.

This should come from everyone, teams, players and the fans.

 

[billybudd]

The fact that officials openly acknowledge that they make or do not make calls, based on reputation or how a team acts is a joke. Do the Pens need to act more professional? Yes. However, so do the refs. These guys get six figure salaries to call an impartial and fair game. If the way a team acts causes them to "teach them a lesson" by allowing other teams to get away with stuff while they hammer said team with penalties, that is essentially fixing the game, which is a crime!

I'm sorry but part of the reason refs make so much is the fact that they will have to put up with some crap. If they are to fragile to take some chirping, they don't deserve the job, or the money that goes with it. A lot of people have jobs where they put up with way more ****, and get paid way less. If someone goes over the line and you want to give them a 10, fine, but when that player returns, if he gets roughed, or hooked, or tripped, call it, because that is your job. IF the player needs taught a lesson, it's up to the league to do it, not the officials. In fact, if refs overstep their boundaries and purposely screw a team to prove a point, the league should punish them too.

It may be ridiculous, but it's a reality the Penguins have to accept until it changes.

Powerplays are at a 50 year low and Colin Campbell keeps tabling material on diving at every GM meeting because he thinks too many powerplays are illegitimate. Wants to send lists of people to the refs so they'll know who's allowed to be tripped and who isn't.

Just shut up and don't make the refs your enemy, no matter how bad they are.

It'll be this way until there's a new vice president of hockey ops. Was hoping it would be Shanahan, but the NHL ain't matching Rogers' money.

 

[Reality Check]

Anyway, this organization sucks. Detroit is the softest team in the league, and they completely punked us. Guess what that makes us? I still cannot wrap my head around why anyone in their right mind would think being soft as butter is a winning formula in a physical sport. I can't imagine any other organization, in any other sport saying 'we have too many big, physical, aggressive players. We need to replace them with small, weak, timid guys.'

Again, Detroit is a soft team, but look at what their D did to Horny around the net, and then compare that to our D. It's laughable.

The biggest misconception about Detroit over the past 15+ years is that they're soft. Because the likes of Don Cherry and others conclude toughness with physical play and that's it. And despite being revered as a god-like figure in Canada, perhaps that's why he has no cup rings to show for it.

Mental toughness was always just as important. But it's even more so now and I'd argue that it always was.

Just take a look at the lack of composure Pittsburgh had on Sunday. And, frankly, the past few years in the playoffs. It goes from the top on down.

There is a reason why a team like San Jose has never been able to get over the hump. THAT'S a soft team.

 

[plaidchuck]

This officiating is getting to FIFA levels of bad. "Working" officiating, officiating based on reputation and bias, etc. Is like something you would see in soccer in third world countries.

Say what you want about the nfl and mlb, but they have a handful of bad calls per year while the nhl has them nightly.

 

[lastcupever75]

The 2nd goal was certainly bad. However the 1st was a deflection through a triple screen so I don't blame him there.

.

what the heck is a triple screen? there were 2 players there, and they werent top of his crease either.

how about being on top of your angles? look at how low he is in his butterfly. STAND up a bit and these slightly deflected pucks hit him in the pads