Menzinger
Kessel4LadyByng
It would be Dermott since their minutes/usage are pretty similar. But I think he'd stay as the 7th D and they'd rotate guys in as need be and ride the hot hand
Tribute Rasmus Sandin Discussion Thread
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It would be Dermott since their minutes/usage are pretty similar. But I think he'd stay as the 7th D and they'd rotate guys in as need be and ride the hot hand
Sandin is WAY better than Dermott. Sandin already passed him in my opinion. Sandin and TJ Bordie would make a good pair. Dermott can play with Holl or his Bogo is singed back they can continue to be the 3rd pair.
Le Cobra
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Le Cobra
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i think they will complement each other the same way Marner does Matthews. They could be our two greatest defensemen in a half century
BlueBaron
Registered User
wonder if Rasmus is going to be PP1 from here on out. I suggested this last week. He looks extremely natural quarterbacking the PP. Far more than Rielly even. Has way more patience and presents far more variance up top. Hope he gets a god look. And realistically having Mo on PP2 is not a horrible thing either
Well everyone can have an opinion .. Dermy is much faster skater both forwards and backwards .. Dermy has da harder shot wrister and slapper .. Sandin has much better hockey IQ, core strength and offensive upside .. Both of them need experience to learn pro hockey defense which takes 5-7 years to develop ... Dermy is closer on the learning curve to get to a final product .. but my GUESS right now is Sandin will improve his foot speed with Barb (which is really his largest single skill he needs to develop) and has a higher upside .. but lots of GUESS work in that .. to me I think there are 2 future top 4's for sure .. added to Brodie and Muzzy gives us 4 guys who are damn good and a solid defense for years to come
BertCorbeau
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Sandin's got a better shot than Rielly IIRC ... So that's a plus.
The PP needs more shooting threats from those positions.
The PP needs more shooting threats from those positions.
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What's even more encouraging is that Sandin actually has a decent shot, unlike Rielly's muffins.
Petrus
Registered User
If Sandin performs well these last remaining games, would any of you guys be comfortable with letting Rielly go (via UFA or Trade) next year, given our cap constraints?
If Sandin is all that then we run with an elite defense core next year and go for the back to back
We're almost certainly not going to trade a guy the coach plays 24 minutes a game (#1) because our rookie looks good. I doubt we let our #1 walk either, he'd have to want wayyyyyy too much money if he's going to end up in another jersey.
With all due respect, we don't have any cap constraints next year or in future years. We have 3 ELC deals that will be on our roster come next year, we will have a cheaper version of Freddy that performs equally or better at a lesser cost than 5 million per. If there is any money that needs to be moved it will be Kerfoot, and the team will be able to resign Hyman comfortably and still keep Rielly.
That all said, yes trading Rielly is an option. It is a major risk as well. Rielly plays a ton of minutes for us and is better than this board gives him credit for. He has tremendous skill, but lacks hockey sense at times. I would only trade Reilly if we were getting a high quality defenseman in return. I only say this because I fear Mo's contract demands in a couple years time. It would be a shame to just let him walk for nothing, And its my opinion that Sandin will be the better defenseman at that time. Making it hard to give Mo the #1 D-man money that he will deserve at that time
Petrus
Registered User
If Sandin is all that then we run with an elite defense core next year and go for the back to back
We're almost certainly not going to trade a guy the coach plays 24 minutes a game (#1) because our rookie looks good. I doubt we let our #1 walk either, he'd have to want wayyyyyy too much money if he's going to end up in another jersey.
Let say Rielly wants 6.5m x 7 ..... do we agree to Rielly's ask knowing that Sandin could prove to be just as effective? I think at some point we have to throw Sandin to the wolves (give him full time duty with a responsible partner) and see what we have.
Ya I mean Sandin doesn't necessarily have a bomb either. I'd say their shots are very comparable TBH. I think the key difference is Rasmus is just far better at picking his spots and always being in a position to put one on net. They both walk the blue with their heads up very nicely, and both have the ability to change the angle with a cut back. However Rielly just hasn't done that all year. 95% of the time Mo receives the puck on the PP, he walks for 2-3 strides to draw that high PK'er to the middle of the ice and then he dishes back to the wall it came from or the far side wall. He almost never presents himself as a shooter. Reason being is his body is almost always parallel to the goal line. Especially when he walks from the LW wall to the middle of the ice. He barely ever skates backwards with the puck when walking the line. Which essentially tells everyone he is not shooting because his only shooting options would be a backhand from the point or a change in direction + shot which takes too long.. Sandin walks the line more laterally and you can freeze frame at every point in his stride and he'd present himself as a shooting option. It keeps penalty killers honest by having to keep that shooting lane closed, which then makes Matthews and Marner more open. If the PK'ers cheat to either wall Sandin is always in a position to get it off. But I don't really think his shot is overly heavy IMO. He's just extremely gifted offensively and see's the play develop way better than Mo in terms of the PP. I honestly think Rasmus' offensive instincts are on the same level as Mitch, Willy, and Auston TBH. I am not saying he is as gifted offensively at the current moment, He just thinks the game at that same level as them. Which is hugely beneficial on the PP, because he reads passing lanes prior to them being open.
some beautiful examples of Rasmus' ability to manage play from the blue line on the PP in this video. Prime example of what I was suggesting is the Petan goal at 3:15, and the Tavares goal at 4:27
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We're trying to win cups. We're trying to ice the best roster that we can to win as many hockey games as possible. Trading away Morgan Rielly to give Sandin a real good look is rebuilding team stuff. Sandin can steal the job just like anyone else can. But even better we'll just run with Rielly-Muzzin-Sandin down the left side the same way that the Lightning run Hedman-McDonagh-Sergachev down the left side. Sergachev gets 22 minutes a night and is their #3, he's developed just fine.
If Rielly wants 6.5m x 7 then we sign that 100%. Man, that's an easy number. Normally people are scared of 8m+ and that's where the obvious no's are.
If Sandin develops into a #1 defenseman and fully supplants Rielly then I can imagine the scenario where we trade Rielly for the space or in a hockey deal. But it's not realistic to expect that in the next year, before it's time to sign Rielly.
Seeing what you have with someone like Sandin does not come with the cost of letting your 1D go and not replacing him with a similar caliber defensemen. We have probably about 3-5 seasons before we're forced to choose between paying Sandin as a high-end top 4 or trading him. We need to take the cheap quality option for now while not sacrificing defence in other areas if we can afford both.
I find it strange that all players with poor shots can't improve them with relative ease to really good shots. I mean an NHL career can be 15+ years.
I was just going to post this. While I'm happy that Sandin is getting a good look from the Leafs, I wish Liljegren would be given the same chance to prove himself on the team. Sandin has been given more games since he was drafted and even some powerplay time to see how he does. Liljegren on the otherhand can barely get into games and even when he does he usually doesn't get much ice time and hardly any powerplay time.
Seems like Liljegren has always been the black sheep among Leafs prospects even though by all accounts he's made significant improvements to his game. Really wish they would at least give him a few games down the stretch and see how he does.
nuck
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Reilly's next deal is the kicker because they will have other second contracts on the horizon. Left shot D without a great defensive game are replaceable. Not to pick on MR but this club is so biased to forward salaries that it is a given a Dman has to walk on water to take a bite of that, especially with Hyman's next deal coming. To me Morgan has to be a wrecking machine in a deep playoff run or he is an automatic move. Affording both can't mean a $6M+ D man unless you have decided something like Robertson has booted Willie out of the top 6.
StevenB
Registered User
Lily is getting overcooked in the minors after missing development time cause of mono. I have no problem letting Liljegren cook in the minors until the organization really feels like he can step into our team and contribute. Until then there’s no need to rush Liljegren given our current situation.I was just going to post this. While I'm happy that Sandin is getting a good look from the Leafs, I wish Liljegren would be given the same chance to prove himself on the team. Sandin has been given more games since he was drafted and even some powerplay time to see how he does. Liljegren on the otherhand can barely get into games and even when he does he usually doesn't get much ice time and hardly any powerplay time.
Seems like Liljegren has always been the black sheep among Leafs prospects even though by all accounts he's made significant improvements to his game. Really wish they would at least give him a few games down the stretch and see how he does.
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MattySnipes
Registered User
Should've been playing much earlier in year but whatever, cap issues is the excuse used so I'll let it go.
He's been excellent. Hope he isn't moved. His brain, poise, and confidence mixed with cojones to stand up for himself is really making him a dynamic threat on D.
He's been excellent. Hope he isn't moved. His brain, poise, and confidence mixed with cojones to stand up for himself is really making him a dynamic threat on D.
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