Post-Game Talk: Rangers vs. Islanders: It's Miller Time

[tors10]

I think it's just the NY Rangers Goal Song, think it was written for the team.

They are just yelling "Goa-oh-oal!" and "Hey! Hey! Hey-hey-hey!"

thanks i got it. i meant the one from flo rida. let it roll!

 

[BlueshirtBlitz]

Asham had one good shift last game where he chipped the puck past a guy to get into the offensive zone and then shot it. Boyle does stuff like that too. Neither of them can score, but Boyle is infinitely superior at everything else besides fighting. Boyle over Asham on the fourth line, and its not even close.

 

[mas0764]

thanks i got it. i meant the one from flo rida. let it roll!

Oh sorry, I misread your question.

 

[16 To Stanley*]

At what point is his lack of production not a slump and is who he is? He "slumped" all of the last season till the last half dozen games and first 3 or so playoff games. I think you have it reversed, his good play is what's not the norm. Good play on offense, of course.

You realize no fourth liner provides offense at a high level. He can provide more offense than most other fourth liners, while being valuable in many other aspects of the game, which is very important. He's never going to be a top 6 player and I don't expect him to be. He scored 20 goals 2 seasons ago and everyone got high high hopes. That's not who he is, he's a very valuable bottom 6 player who is good in the defensive aspects of the game and will chip in 15-30 points a season.

 

[Bardof425*]

You realize no fourth liner provides offense at a high level. He can provide more offense than most other fourth liners, while being valuable in many other aspects of the game, which is very important. He's never going to be a top 6 player and I don't expect him to be. He scored 20 goals 2 seasons ago and everyone got high high hopes. That's not who he is, he's a very valuable bottom 6 player who is good in the defensive aspects of the game and will chip in 15-30 points a season.

Exactly he is a 4th liner. right now he is the odd man out. Maybe soon that changes. But if it does, he should play on the 4th line. I think that result will eliminate alot of the bickering here.

 

[Bardof425*]

Asham had one good shift last game where he chipped the puck past a guy to get into the offensive zone and then shot it. Boyle does stuff like that too. Neither of them can score, but Boyle is infinitely superior at everything else besides fighting. Boyle over Asham on the fourth line, and its not even close.

Asham handles the puck better and shoots the puck better. And again these two are not vying for the same spot. Ash is our resident tough guy and he is needed each night. BB is battling Halpern, Powe and the kids for playing time. I don't see the point of continuing to argue Boyle vs. Asham.

 

[Bardof425*]

He'll be in for Asham. And I honestly I'm super excited about what I saw from Miller, but the kid had a lot of defensive lapses. Let's see how he plays for the next 10 games rather than the high he's been on for the past 2. Not rooting against him by any means, but taking the wait and see approach with a kid who's 19 years old.

I don't think Asham's a waste like Rupper/Boogy and Brashear were. But he doesn't bring what Boyle brings. He can't PK, he can't be put out there against other teams top lines, can't take faceoffs, etc. Basically, he's just not as good. I know your blind hatred for Boyle will disagree with this because Asham has an offensive chance here and there and tries to make nifty moves with the puck (which never seem to work) but anyone with a view of the game knows Boyle>>Asham.

I DONT HATE BOYLE. I just think he is bad with the puck and should be a 4th liner getting limited ES time and regular PK time. I have a view of the

 

[Bardof425*]

He'll be in for Asham. And I honestly I'm super excited about what I saw from Miller, but the kid had a lot of defensive lapses. Let's see how he plays for the next 10 games rather than the high he's been on for the past 2. Not rooting against him by any means, but taking the wait and see approach with a kid who's 19 years old.

I don't think Asham's a waste like Rupper/Boogy and Brashear were. But he doesn't bring what Boyle brings. He can't PK, he can't be put out there against other teams top lines, can't take faceoffs, etc. Basically, he's just not as good. I know your blind hatred for Boyle will disagree with this because Asham has an offensive chance here and there and tries to make nifty moves with the puck (which never seem to work) but anyone with a view of the game knows Boyle>>Asham.

A view of the game? What does even mean? Boyle is overrated by this fan base, this coach and the those who announce our games. But many on this board have eyes, are not distracted by him being a nice guy and see him for what he is; an average 4th line center with almost no offensive ability at all. if you watch the Devils or the Bruins you will see 4th line players that can wear their opponent down with puck protection. They may not have great shots and so they don't score alot, but they do have a role in the O-zone. BB does not have these skills and subsequently is an average 4th line. And his FO skills are good but let's not pretend he's Craig McTavish here.

Asham has a different role one which has kept him in the league for a long time. He is not a goon. he is with a new team in a new system. As the year goes on his positioning and instincts with the puck will improve and he will bury a few with the shot that he has. He is a better player than BB and he can fight which is invaluable on this current roster, unless you want to dress Stu Bickle.

 

[toewsintangibles]

http://www.behindthenet.ca/nhl_stat...3+5+4+6+7+8+13+14+29+30+32+33+34+45+46+63+67#

If we sell Boyle for a bag pucks and replace him with JT Miller, we need somebody to start WAY more in our defensive zone. The reason why Kesler went from 40 goals to 20 goals is because the Nucks lost Malhotra who was playing a Boyle-like role on that team..

I'd say keep Boyle on 4th line

 

[Kershaw]

http://www.behindthenet.ca/nhl_stat...3+5+4+6+7+8+13+14+29+30+32+33+34+45+46+63+67#

If we sell Boyle for a bag pucks and replace him with JT Miller, we need somebody to start WAY more in our defensive zone. The reason why Kesler went from 40 goals to 20 goals is because the Nucks lost Malhotra who was playing a Boyle-like role on that team..

I'd say keep Boyle on 4th line

Terrible puck possession, terrible puck possession everywhere.

 

[NYRantLftyC19]

http://www.behindthenet.ca/nhl_stat...3+5+4+6+7+8+13+14+29+30+32+33+34+45+46+63+67#

If we sell Boyle for a bag pucks and replace him with JT Miller, we need somebody to start WAY more in our defensive zone. The reason why Kesler went from 40 goals to 20 goals is because the Nucks lost Malhotra who was playing a Boyle-like role on that team..

I'd say keep Boyle on 4th line

Not to mention we will undoubtedly have more injuries as the season progresses, and if we get that far, no team goes through the playoffs without some injuries to their forwards. Boyle is a valuable guy to have to play on the bottom two lines. If we trade him we will lose depth that we already don't have.

 

[16 To Stanley*]

A view of the game? What does even mean? Boyle is overrated by this fan base, this coach and the those who announce our games. But many on this board have eyes, are not distracted by him being a nice guy and see him for what he is; an average 4th line center with almost no offensive ability at all. if you watch the Devils or the Bruins you will see 4th line players that can wear their opponent down with puck protection. They may not have great shots and so they don't score alot, but they do have a role in the O-zone. BB does not have these skills and subsequently is an average 4th line. And his FO skills are good but let's not pretend he's Craig McTavish here.

Asham has a different role one which has kept him in the league for a long time. He is not a goon. he is with a new team in a new system. As the year goes on his positioning and instincts with the puck will improve and he will bury a few with the shot that he has. He is a better player than BB and he can fight which is invaluable on this current roster, unless you want to dress Stu Bickle.

Boyle is an ABOVE AVERAGE fourth liner. And why is fighting in the game relevant anymore. O right, it's not. This isn't the 70's where you need to dress a fighter. That time has passed. Boyle is a better rounded player than Asham.

You're acting like Asham is going to start burying a ton of chances as well. The most goals he scored in his career was 15, that was 10 years ago. the last two, he's had a whopping 5 goals. Over the last 5 years, his totals have amount to 6, 8, 10, 5 & 5. Why are you expecting that to suddenly change?

this is coming from someone who actually liked the asham signing (and the way he's played as well). But, if we're talking about an odd man out (and i'm still not convinced JT & Kreider are sticking here through the season, miller more so), but if they do, i think it will be Asham who becomes the expendable. Boyle just brings so much more. You're not supposed to rely on your 4th line for offense, if they chip in, it's a bonus.

 

[toewsintangibles]

Terrible puck possession, terrible puck possession everywhere.

http://behindthenet.ca/fenwick_2012.php?sort=6&section=close

Actually we are doing better than last year on 5on5

Too bad our PP is still locked out and Lundqvist is playing like a regular NHL starter and not a vezina candidate

 

[BlueshirtBlitz]

Terrible puck possession, terrible puck possession everywhere.

Oh well. We did just fine without great possession numbers last year.

 

[Bardof425*]

Boyle is an ABOVE AVERAGE fourth liner. And why is fighting in the game relevant anymore. O right, it's not. This isn't the 70's where you need to dress a fighter. That time has passed. Boyle is a better rounded player than Asham.

You're acting like Asham is going to start burying a ton of chances as well. The most goals he scored in his career was 15, that was 10 years ago. the last two, he's had a whopping 5 goals. Over the last 5 years, his totals have amount to 6, 8, 10, 5 & 5. Why are you expecting that to suddenly change?

this is coming from someone who actually liked the asham signing (and the way he's played as well). But, if we're talking about an odd man out (and i'm still not convinced JT & Kreider are sticking here through the season, miller more so), but if they do, i think it will be Asham who becomes the expendable. Boyle just brings so much more. You're not supposed to rely on your 4th line for offense, if they chip in, it's a bonus.

That is just not true. In fact fighting is up this year and we are doing our fair share. And I expect that Ash gets more comfortable in the system he will get more offensive opportunities. In listing his goal amounts you are ignoring his minimal playing time. He has skills, that is evident. This is a guy who was a monster scorer in juniors; he has hands and a shot. he is not as quick as he once was but he can play and we need his toughness.

 

[OverTheCap]

I've always maintained that Boyle is a 3rd-4th line tweener, and this season he has looked more like a 4th liner than a 3rd liner.

He hasn't been working nearly as hard as he has in years past, which is probably a major reason why Torts benched him. This is Boyle's 4th season as a Ranger and he has looked far too comfortable out there. Complacency has set in, there was no one to push him until Miller came along. If Boyles comes back motivated he will be a welcome addition to the 4th line.

 

[egelband]

we've seen enough of boyle to know what he is. not very good in the offensive zone. not at all, actually. but a good defender and a big body. kind of...the rangers mascot. not a 'zero' at all. and a defensively-reponsible center has value. but on offense, he is arrrrful.

 

[egelband]

I've always maintained that Boyle is a 3rd-4th line tweener, and this season he has looked more like a 4th liner than a 3rd liner.

He hasn't been working nearly as hard as he has in years past, which is probably a major reason why Torts benched him. This is Boyle's 4th season as a Ranger and he has looked far too comfortable out there. Complacency has set in, there was no one to push him until Miller came along. If Boyles comes back motivated he will be a welcome addition to the 4th line.

i agree that boyle looks slack out there. but i'd also say that it's probably not a lack of effort as much as a lack of focus. these guys all put out effort. i'd say... but sometimes their heads aren't locked-in. i don't know how to explain it. but i don't buy that guys just go out and skate around aimlessly. they do try. it's just that they're not in synch. and a player out-of-synch is useless. overthinking, underthinking....whatever. it happens to boyler a lot too.

 

[mrhockey193195]

Boyle was a big part of our success last year. Anyone looking past that because of 1 win that he wasn't a part of, really doesn't understand the value of a bottom-6 player.

He's been slumping, as does every NHL player at some point or another. He will be fine and is an important piece going forward.

Thank you. Finally, a voice of reason on these boards.

 

[Blue Blooded]

Terrible puck possession, terrible puck possession everywhere.

4 games is a small sample, especially when the player only averages 9 mins per game, but Benn Ferriero put up ridiculous Corsi against tough competition for the Rangers. Quite surprising!

How did he play himself into Torts' doghouse and down to Hartford? I thought he played well in all his games as a Ranger.

 

[16 To Stanley*]

That is just not true. In fact fighting is up this year and we are doing our fair share. And I expect that Ash gets more comfortable in the system he will get more offensive opportunities. In listing his goal amounts you are ignoring his minimal playing time. He has skills, that is evident. This is a guy who was a monster scorer in juniors; he has hands and a shot. he is not as quick as he once was but he can play and we need his toughness.

there's a reason Asham gets minimal playing time and that's because he is a 4th liner. A step above a goon. he's not a prust because he can't kill penalties or be as good defensively but he's not a boogaard either.

Basically what you're saying, is if Asham was getting Nash-Like minutes, he might pot 20 because of his skill. That's wonderful (and completely unfounded), but he'll never get big minutes and in fact, will probably get less because he's playing under torts who rides his top lines harder than anyone in the league.

I really don't think boyle is amazing. I just think that he was over-used in a lot of situations the past couple years. But if he's strictly used as a 4th liner and penalty killer he would be one of the best in the league. Since he isn't, people expect him to be better than that, fact is, he's not. But now with our youngsters coming up and taking spots in the lineup, while solidifying our top 9, boyle becomes a wonderful asset on that third line. An asset more valuable & versatile than Asham.

 

[Kershaw]

http://behindthenet.ca/fenwick_2012.php?sort=6&section=close

Actually we are doing better than last year on 5on5

Too bad our PP is still locked out and Lundqvist is playing like a regular NHL starter and not a vezina candidate

I checked the same fenwick ratings yesterday (before the game) and we were around 20th. I think behindthenet might have an error, because it didn't seem like we dominated the Isles 5on5 to warrant such a jump in fenwick rankings.

 

[NYRFANMANI]

Stralman was very good

It has been 4 games. He gonna be a steal ...

10 in. The team is gonna be fine! Let's go Rangers!

 

[Pizza]

What is forgotten by many is that until Boyle had Tort's as a coach, he was a marginal NHLer. Now any team in the league would take him in a heart beat. Boyle will be back, and likely better than before imo. The obtuse, willfully ignorant view of Boyle, his role and value to the team are beyond silly around here. The guy is an asset. If he wasn't, he would be gone yesterday.

 

[JCrusher*]

What is forgotten by many is that until Boyle had Tort's as a coach, he was a marginal NHLer. Now any team in the league would take him in a heart beat. Boyle will be back, and likely better than before imo. The obtuse, willfully ignorant view of Boyle, his role and value to the team are beyond silly around here. The guy is an asset. If he wasn't, he would be gone yesterday.\

Still dont understand the LOVE for Boyle. I mean he is ok i guess but poeple get mad because others are critical of Boyle. the reason we are critical is because he has sucked. The two kids have done more in 2 games than Boyle has done. Now i have no problem bringing Boyle to the 4th line but he better start haveing better games