Proposal: Rangers-Lightning

[FireGorton]

That was Gorton’s one bad trade. Either that, or the scouts had a brain fart when it came to Howden and Hajek and Gorton was convinced by them that they would be better.

He also traded a top 40 pick and a 3rd rounder for Brendan Smith.... He thought Brendan Smith had more value than Zuc. He traded 2 2nds for Eric Staal when he had Brass,Step and Hayes down the middle with Dom Moore.... He traded Ryan Graves and got nothing in return. He acquired McQuaid because he thought he was better than Tony D or realized buying out Girardi was dumb. He signed Shatty during a rebuild and bought him out. He gave up a first,Pionk and 2 2nds for Fox and Trouba two players he could have for free except for money this coming season. The only moves he did great with were the ones where the GM(Chia) or terrible Owner(Eugene) outshine his stupidity.Rangers have been rebuilding for 5 years and still look like another 3 years before being contenders

 

[bernmeister]

Only on HF would fans of each team think there is no basis for a trade between a team that is in a serious salary cap crunch with a 22-year old potential top-pairing LHD (a position the Rangers desperately need) who currently sits at third on their depth chart, and one of the top 20-year old prospects in the world, who many project to be a top four, if not top pairing, RHD, who can slot in nicely in their top four once he arrives in the NHL within another year or two, and will be on an ELC to boot. Fans think they will simply be able to move 2 of Killorn, Johnson, Palat and Gourde in a flat cap world where 2/3 of the league already sit at a place where they can't really take more cap on. Funny.

How does Victor Hedman/Ryan McDonagh-Nils Lundkvist sound? How does Mikhail Sergachev-Adam Fox/Jacob Trouba sound? I understand both fanbases are absolutely smitten with both players, as they should be, but to me there is certainly a basis for a trade. Don't want Georgiev because of the impending expansion draft? Fine. Totally fair. You can easily tweak the offer and change the third piece so it is better balance for Tampa.

I guess I'm in the minority here, but I would 100% do a trade around Nils + Carolina's pick + something else for Sergachev. You have to give to get. Oh, and btw, the Lightning do not have a first-round pick in this year's draft. This gives them extra draft capital, and they are simply one of the best run organizations in the NHL and do a good job finding talent anywhere. A draft pick, even if it sits at 22, is certainly an asset gained for them. Also from a Rangers salary cap perspective, essentially they're replacing the money (and likely a bit more) the front office paid Skjei to pay somebody who will likely be worth it. Figure out the second cap move later.

No interest in moving Nils L.
Repurposing Deangelo into futures should be the alternative we choose.

 

[bernmeister]

That was Gorton’s one bad trade. Either that, or the scouts had a brain fart when it came to Howden and Hajek and Gorton was convinced by them that they would be better.

I don't have a problem w/either McD or Nash deals.
Let's remember Hajek was lights out 5 games in before injured shoulder separation.
We dropped the ball on him.
Howden still green, but I DO see upside with him.

Did we have better offers that was the ?.

Now the Miller-Namest debacle, that is another story.

 

[smoneil]

Value aside, it doesn't work for either team. It doesn't address the needs for TB, and it ignores the salary cap and the expansion draft implications for the NYR (you can basically add a salary cap casualty and an additional expansion draft casualty to the Rangers' side of that trade ledger).

Trade is a non-starter. TB can find their cap space by shifting some of the deck chairs rather than by pawning the fine china. The Rangers aren't Cup contenders this year anyway, so it makes more sense for them to see what they have in Miller, Hajek, playing one of Fox/ADA on the left, etc.

 

[One Winged Angel]

Sergachev scored 40 points too as a rookie playing PP2 and playing 3 minutes less a game. He also did that as a 19 year old rookie not a 21/22 year old.

And he’s plateaued since.

What Fox has on Sergachev is the ELC and expansion exemption.

Thank you for further proving why Fox is more valuable.

Besides that they are very similar players with Sergachev being bigger and more physical. The value between the two is very similar but we don't want or need to trade Sergachev so we aren't going to make a deal for the sake of it, we would need an incentive to trade him.

You’re not getting Fox for him, never mind Fox and a 1st.

It simply doesn’t work like that because you say so.

 

[One Winged Angel]

He also traded a top 40 pick and a 3rd rounder for Brendan Smith.... He thought Brendan Smith had more value than Zuc. He traded 2 2nds for Eric Staal when he had Brass,Step and Hayes down the middle with Dom Moore.... He traded Ryan Graves and got nothing in return. He acquired McQuaid because he thought he was better than Tony D or realized buying out Girardi was dumb. He signed Shatty during a rebuild and bought him out. He gave up a first,Pionk and 2 2nds for Fox and Trouba two players he could have for free except for money this coming season. The only moves he did great with were the ones where the GM(Chia) or terrible Owner(Eugene) outshine his stupidity.Rangers have been rebuilding for 5 years and still look like another 3 years before being contenders

Buying out Girardi was the right move. Where is he now?

If we’re going to hold Ryan Graves against Gorton, go ahead, but that move isn’t killing them at all. He’s a 4D at best. Good to have? Sure. Difference maker? World beater? Nope, not even close.

Eric Staal was one last stab at trying to win a cup, he was out of shape. That trade hasn’t come back to bite them in any such way, 4 years later. I’m more than ok with that.

Are you really complaining about the Fox deal? He should have been a Calder finalist and was the team’s best defender this year. That’s why they made that move and it was the right move. Trouba when not attached to Skjei or Smith will be much better.

 

[pld459666]

He also traded a top 40 pick and a 3rd rounder for Brendan Smith.... He thought Brendan Smith had more value than Zuc. He traded 2 2nds for Eric Staal when he had Brass,Step and Hayes down the middle with Dom Moore.... He traded Ryan Graves and got nothing in return. He acquired McQuaid because he thought he was better than Tony D or realized buying out Girardi was dumb. He signed Shatty during a rebuild and bought him out. He gave up a first,Pionk and 2 2nds for Fox and Trouba two players he could have for free except for money this coming season. The only moves he did great with were the ones where the GM(Chia) or terrible Owner(Eugene) outshine his stupidity.Rangers have been rebuilding for 5 years and still look like another 3 years before being contenders

Rebuilding for 5 years??

16-17 - 2nd round of the playoffs. Trade Stepan and Raanta for Tony D and 7th overall
17-18 - Letter to kick off rebuild sent 02/18

So, an argument can be made that Stepan started the process, 3.5 years ago.

Not 5.

The idea that there's another 3 years to go is both absurd and disingenuous at best.

 

[Lindberg Cheese]

Rebuilding for 5 years??

16-17 - 2nd round of the playoffs. Trade Stepan and Raanta for Tony D and 7th overall
17-18 - Letter to kick off rebuild sent 02/18

So, an argument can be made that Stepan started the process, 3.5 years ago.

Not 5.

The idea that there's another 3 years to go is both absurd and disingenuous at best.

Agree, we open a New window next year. Pretty good considering the shape of the team 2/18.

 

[FireGorton]

Buying out Girardi was the right move. Where is he now?

If we’re going to hold Ryan Graves against Gorton, go ahead, but that move isn’t killing them at all. He’s a 4D at best. Good to have? Sure. Difference maker? World beater? Nope, not even close.

Eric Staal was one last stab at trying to win a cup, he was out of shape. That trade hasn’t come back to bite them in any such way, 4 years later. I’m more than ok with that.

Are you really complaining about the Fox deal? He should have been a Calder finalist and was the team’s best defender this year. That’s why they made that move and it was the right move. Trouba when not attached to Skjei or Smith will be much better.

Girardi retired and his contract would be off the books now. He cost the team 1.11 cap space in 21,22,23 for Brendan Smith during a rebuild. Buying out Girardi to sign Brendan Smith was not the right move and ironic you are saying if Trouba wasn’t stuck with Gorton’s overpaid toys in Skjei and Smith he would be better. Ryan Graves would be an upgrade over Smith,Staal or Skjei. Graves next to Trouba or Tony D looks a lot better and he’s young enough to grow with the core. Eric Staal didn’t bite them? Why did they trade for him in the first place when Girardi and Staal has serious injuries. Girardi playing with cracked knee cap and Marc had serious ankle problems. Those injuries are the bigger reason they fell apart. It seemed the smart move at the deadline was to look for D help like Justin Schultz or Jakub Kindl. Adam Fox would be a NY Ranger now for free and they would have 2019 2nd round pick and 2020 2nd round pick. Trouba was traded for a first and Pionk.I wanted Heinola a puck moving LHD. Trouba got paid to be a 10 Dman and you are saying he needs someone to carry him. Mac never had those issues from 15/16-17/18 with the Rangers. Skjei was doing fine until Gorton thrusted into the top D pairing spot where he got exposed just like Shattenkirk and now Trouba. Gorton traded tons of picks and has one series win to show for it in 5 years. If Rangers don’t win a round next season he has the same amount of series wins as Sather did except he took over a better talented roster to kickstart rebuild

 

[TGWL]

He also traded a top 40 pick and a 3rd rounder for Brendan Smith.... He thought Brendan Smith had more value than Zuc. He traded 2 2nds for Eric Staal when he had Brass,Step and Hayes down the middle with Dom Moore.... He traded Ryan Graves and got nothing in return. He acquired McQuaid because he thought he was better than Tony D or realized buying out Girardi was dumb. He signed Shatty during a rebuild and bought him out. He gave up a first,Pionk and 2 2nds for Fox and Trouba two players he could have for free except for money this coming season. The only moves he did great with were the ones where the GM(Chia) or terrible Owner(Eugene) outshine his stupidity.Rangers have been rebuilding for 5 years and still look like another 3 years before being contenders

The Smith trade wasn't bad. The smith contract was bad. Smith came in and performed well. We had 12 playoff games that year. That's hardy a bad trade.

The Staal trade was not very good for a few reasons. 1) Staal's performance was slipping and he wasn't able to carry a meh line. 2) Staal wasn't hardly put in a position to succeed. (Although I don't think Staal would have worked out regardless of how he was utilize. Staal's play was terrible before we traded for him.

Ryan Graves wasn't going to get a shot but it was a worthless trade that didn't need to happen. D-men are hard to predict in the AHL. You can look atrocious and then look good in the NHL. Gap control is much different and in the AHL the players are punching all over the rink. Bad trade indeed.

I never like the "You can have this player for free if you wait" approach. It rarely works out in the teams favor. I wasn't a fan of the Trouba contract, but I think we all saw that coming. Paying 2 2nds for Fox I'm quite fine with. NYR don't need to stock prospects right now. We need ready NHL ready, young players. Ready Prospects, or at least ready to compete in training camp.

 

[TGWL]

Trouba was traded for a first and Pionk.I wanted Heinola a puck moving LHD.

Just because Jets used that pick to draft Heinola doesn't mean we would have taken Heinola. The odds of that happening aren't very high. Maybe we draft McMichael instead? Of course after Trouba's first you probably rather have either of those players, but it's not like Gorton had glasses to look in the future. Making bad trades and making trades that turn out bad are different.

 

[FireGorton]

Rebuilding for 5 years??

16-17 - 2nd round of the playoffs. Trade Stepan and Raanta for Tony D and 7th overall
17-18 - Letter to kick off rebuild sent 02/18

So, an argument can be made that Stepan started the process, 3.5 years ago.

Not 5.

The idea that there's another 3 years to go is both absurd and disingenuous at best.

Traded Hagelin and letting MSL walk were huge signs of rebuild. Trading Brass for younger version of him with upside plus a 2nd was another huge sign. Look at the Metro and ask yourself are we better. Caps(nope),Flyers(nope),Pens(nope),Isles(nope), Hurricanes(nope). The only teams I see falling off in year 2 or year 3 is Flyers and Isles. Letter to the fans meant nothing just look at Trouba,Fox and Panarin moves which were all win now moves while Gorton felt Haley was more value able than Chytil.....

 

[Raspewtin]

Rangers have RD and forward prospects which don't exactly seem like Tampa needs unless they're just dying to clear money and use him to do it.

Nils is appealing cause he's on an ELC and is probably one of the better D prospects in hockey rn but until he's on NA ice he probably doesn't have the value that makes trading him enticing.

Fox + Carolina 1st.

Fox is better than Sergachev now and will be in the future so no.

 

[FireGorton]

Just because Jets used that pick to draft Heinola doesn't mean we would have taken Heinola. The odds of that happening aren't very high. Maybe we draft McMichael instead? Of course after Trouba's first you probably rather have either of those players, but it's not like Gorton had glasses to look in the future. Making bad trades and making trades that turn out bad are different.

First year? No I hated that trade the first day but all the smart fans said Pionk sucks and how great Trouba is. They didn’t realize he was being sheltered by Big Buff logging top minutes. You are right about draft since Rangers love going off the board with picks but a rebuilding team should not be giving up assets for a guy who was one year away from being a UFA. Adam Fox the best Gorton should’ve offered was a 3rd rounder and if they didn’t want it oh well get him right about now for free. Is he a great player sure but rebuilding teams should not be overpaying for guys who never played a game in NHL. I could live with Fox or Trouba trade but doing both is costing them 6 million cap space this coming year and hurt the rebuild.

 

[pld459666]

Traded Hagelin and letting MSL walk were huge signs of rebuild. Trading Brass for younger version of him with upside plus a 2nd was another huge sign. Look at the Metro and ask yourself are we better. Caps(nope),Flyers(nope),Pens(nope),Isles(nope), Hurricanes(nope). The only teams I see falling off in year 2 or year 3 is Flyers and Isles. Letter to the fans meant nothing just look at Trouba,Fox and Panarin moves which were all win now moves while Gorton felt Haley was more value able than Chytil.....

Trading Hagelin was the right move to make. He's been overpaid the moment he signed 4x4.

Letting Martin St. Louis walk and retire was ALSO the right move to make.

Trading Brassard for Mika and a 2nd was a smart move to make

The last one may hint at a rebuild, but you would have to be def, dumb, blind and stupid to NOT make that Trade if you are any GM outside of Ottawa.

Not this season coming, but the 21-22 season, I expect that we are going to be better than Caps/Pens/Islanders with a good chance at being better than the Flyers as well as Giroux, Voracek and JVR are already showing signs of decline as they enter the back nine of their careers

Fox was not a win now move as he was a complete unknown prior to lacing up an NHL Skate this year.

Trouba was acquired 4 months after turning 25. He's entering the prime years of his career timed exactly when the team is set to turn the corner. There was ZERO expectations that this team could compete this year and that's AFTER they signed Panarin.

I get it, you are not a fan of Gorton, I myself have some issues with some of the choices he's made, but trying to re-write history by lumping in the Hagelin and MSL decisions is a significant leap.

 

[pld459666]

Also, it's not like Eric Staal was a scrub. He had aa bad season in Carolina and that filtered to NYR, but he did post 65 and 76 point seasons clearly indicating that he had plenty in the tank.

 

[pld459666]

Back to thread topic (sorry for contributing to the derailment)

Would love to acquire Sergachev and would have no issues parting with Nils to get that done.

I think Nils can be a special player. I believe that Mikhail already is. Not to mention that he is exactly what this team needs. For me the age gap is marginal at best.

Not sure what else TB would want, but if the basis of a deal was centered around Nils and 22OA plus a kicker for Sergachev, I would have to consider that deal very very carefully.

 

[FireGorton]

Trading Hagelin was the right move to make. He's been overpaid the moment he signed 4x4.

Letting Martin St. Louis walk and retire was ALSO the right move to make.

Trading Brassard for Mika and a 2nd was a smart move to make

The last one may hint at a rebuild, but you would have to be def, dumb, blind and stupid to NOT make that Trade if you are any GM outside of Ottawa.

Not this season coming, but the 21-22 season, I expect that we are going to be better than Caps/Pens/Islanders with a good chance at being better than the Flyers as well as Giroux, Voracek and JVR are already showing signs of decline as they enter the back nine of their careers

Fox was not a win now move as he was a complete unknown prior to lacing up an NHL Skate this year.

Trouba was acquired 4 months after turning 25. He's entering the prime years of his career timed exactly when the team is set to turn the corner. There was ZERO expectations that this team could compete this year and that's AFTER they signed Panarin.

I get it, you are not a fan of Gorton, I myself have some issues with some of the choices he's made, but trying to re-write history by lumping in the Hagelin and MSL decisions is a significant leap.

Hags was willing to take much less. MSL being kicked out the door led to Staal trade which was bad. I agree Brass trade was smart but messed up MSL informed him he was traded. If Fox was not a win now move why give up two high 2nd rounders for him. Trouba was 25 great but Pionk was 24 and proved to be better than Trouba last year at half the cost. If they couldn’t compete after signing Panarin why bother signing him?Why not let the younger players develop which is the point of a rebuild.Gorton has changed the plan so many times. Why didn’t he trade Kreider or Fast if they couldn’t “compete”?

 

[One Winged Angel]

Girardi retired and his contract would be off the books now. He cost the team 1.11 cap space in 21,22,23 for Brendan Smith during a rebuild. Buying out Girardi to sign Brendan Smith was not the right move and ironic you are saying if Trouba wasn’t stuck with Gorton’s overpaid toys in Skjei and Smith he would be better.

If you think Girardi was going to leave far more actual salary on the table, then I don’t know what to tell you. That means you don’t understand the difference between cap hit and actual salary owed and how it pertains to a buyout. So before we even continue this part of this conversation, you need to figure that out on your own.

Girardi wasn’t bought out to sign Smith. That’s you making an asinine and unfounded claim to prop up the argument that you think you have. Girardi was bought out because he was horrible and declining fast. His body was broken. He was done. He was able to retire because he wasn’t making much in actual salary on his new deal and is getting his money from the buyout. That wouldn’t have been able to occur in NY.

Ryan Graves would be an upgrade over Smith,Staal or Skjei. Graves next to Trouba or Tony D looks a lot better and he’s young enough to grow with the core.

Again, no one is arguing that Ryan Graves wouldn’t help, but you’re acting as if this is Calgary letting go of Martin St. Louis. Graves is a 4D at best. He got his chance elsewhere. Good for him. You can continue to cry over it if you’d like. Shit happens.

Eric Staal didn’t bite them? Why did they trade for him in the first place when Girardi and Staal has serious injuries. Girardi playing with cracked knee cap and Marc had serious ankle problems. Those injuries are the bigger reason they fell apart. It seemed the smart move at the deadline was to look for D help like Justin Schultz or Jakub Kindl.

You want to tell me what happened with those picks they sent to Carolina for Eric Staal? Who they turned out to be? Where they are now? I’ll wait.

If you think Marc Staal and Dan Girardi weren’t part of the problem, I don’t know what to tell you. Their injuries weren’t the reason they lost. They didn’t win because it was Gorton’s last stab at a cup and Eric Staal didn’t work. That’s why he traded Brassard months after they lost to Pittsburgh. He knew the run with that core was dwindling.

Justin Schultz and Jakub Kindl? Lmfao. Schultz was the exact opposite of what they needed at that time and Kindl was out of the NHL at 29 years old after the end of the 16-17 season. I’m supposed to take you seriously when you’re suggesting names like this? Hahaha get real.

Adam Fox would be a NY Ranger now for free and they would have 2019 2nd round pick and 2020 2nd round pick.

And you’d have a young team that’s 1 year behind in it’s development with 6 years left of Artemi Panarin. You probably don’t and will refuse to understand this due to your hatred of Gorton, but I’ll explain it anyway. Gorton had a plan to get the elite piece in Panarin and build a young team around him and Zibanejad. Fox was part of the equation. By trading early for Fox, it helps Fox and the team as a whole develop quicker, so they could possibly win a cup during Panarin’s prime years. They don’t have him for 8 years and by the time his deal ends, he’ll be 35 and on the decline. They also have to try to win while players are on their ELC’s and have the ELC’s stagger in different years so they can manage the cap. I don’t think you have a grasp on how many ELC’s this team will have expiring within a 1-2 season span.

Trouba was traded for a first and Pionk.I wanted Heinola a puck moving LHD. Trouba got paid to be a 10 Dman and you are saying he needs someone to carry him.

Now you’re putting words in my mouth. Saying that he would perform better without Skjei or Smith is completely different from saying he needs to be carried. Now you’re getting desperate because your argument is shit. Trouba performed like a 1D in Winnipeg in 2019 when he had a capable partner. Skjei and Smith are not capable of playing top pairing minutes, which you even admit to below in the case of Skjei.

Mac never had those issues from 15/16-17/18 with the Rangers.

Uh yeah he did. He wasn’t nearly as good in 2015 and 2016 as he was in 2014 and 2017. Part of that was Girardi.

Skjei was doing fine until Gorton thrusted into the top D pairing spot where he got exposed just like Shattenkirk and now Trouba.

LMFAO WHAT?!? Skjei has regressed EVERY SEASON since his rookie year. Now I know I don’t have to take you seriously.

Gorton traded tons of picks and has one series win to show for it in 5 years. If Rangers don’t win a round next season he has the same amount of series wins as Sather did except he took over a better talented roster to kickstart rebuild

Incoherent and worthless drivel, being that they officially started to rebuild during Gorton’s 3rd season. Your judgement is skewed because you want to use him as a scapegoat. I’m done replying to someone who is as lost as you are.

 

[pld459666]

Hags was willing to take much less. MSL being kicked out the door led to Staal trade which was bad. I agree Brass trade was smart but messed up MSL informed him he was traded. If Fox was not a win now move why give up two high 2nd rounders for him. Trouba was 25 great but Pionk was 24 and proved to be better than Trouba last year at half the cost. If they couldn’t compete after signing Panarin why bother signing him?Why not let the younger players develop which is the point of a rebuild.Gorton has changed the plan so many times. Why didn’t he trade Kreider or Fast if they couldn’t “compete”?

Hags was willing to take much less? Are you his agent? What do you consider much less? Because if the number is now more than 25% less, then it's a non-starter. I liked Hageln's hustle, but more than 3 per would have been a mistake. That clearly was a cap decision. Carl Hagelin is not a player you make room for.

MSL was not kicked out the door. If he thought for any minute that he had gas in the tank, he would have kept playing.

Would you trade Fox today for a late 1st rounder? I wouldn't and while I too was upset about what we gave up to get him, we would not had had him until this past August, NOT 2019. and that's assuming he would have signed with us. Odds are he would have, but maybe someone else piques his interest. I would MUCH rather have the player than the two picks.

Pionk put up better numbers than Trouba. He was not better. Trouba also played with a guys not names Morrisey which helped Pionk a great deal.

Panarin, an elite level player for nothing but $$ sign me up all day.

Regarding Kreider/Fast, at some point you have to STOP acquiring picks and prospects, stop rebuilding the foundation and start looking at turning the corner. You can rebuild in perpetuity or you can look to see what the effort was all about. Throwing youngsters to the wolves is not rebuilding. It's careless and negligent. Surrounding them with actual talent to augment their growth is the much better path.

Getting #2 last year and #1 this year combined with the players that are already here, young and old, will allow this team to turn the corner in 1-2 years..

 

[FireGorton]

Hags was willing to take much less? Are you his agent? What do you consider much less? Because if the number is now more than 25% less, then it's a non-starter. I liked Hageln's hustle, but more than 3 per would have been a mistake. That clearly was a cap decision. Carl Hagelin is not a player you make room for.

MSL was not kicked out the door. If he thought for any minute that he had gas in the tank, he would have kept playing.

Would you trade Fox today for a late 1st rounder? I wouldn't and while I too was upset about what we gave up to get him, we would not had had him until this past August, NOT 2019. and that's assuming he would have signed with us. Odds are he would have, but maybe someone else piques his interest. I would MUCH rather have the player than the two picks.

Pionk put up better numbers than Trouba. He was not better. Trouba also played with a guys not names Morrisey which helped Pionk a great deal.

Panarin, an elite level player for nothing but $$ sign me up all day.

Regarding Kreider/Fast, at some point you have to STOP acquiring picks and prospects, stop rebuilding the foundation and start looking at turning the corner. You can rebuild in perpetuity or you can look to see what the effort was all about. Throwing youngsters to the wolves is not rebuilding. It's careless and negligent. Surrounding them with actual talent to augment their growth is the much better path.

Getting #2 last year and #1 this year combined with the players that are already here, young and old, will allow this team to turn the corner in 1-2 years..

Quick Hits: The future of NHL advertising, Carl Hagelin may have wanted to stay, NHL top 200 players Hags said he would take less but was never given a chance. I would say Fox was signing with us the way he conducted interviews and won’t go into detail. The difference is now you know he could play at NHL as he could’ve easily turned into a Matt Gilroy type which is why a 3rd was more than fair value considering that’s what Vesey went for and where Fox was drafted.

Trouba put up better numbers with Morrissey as well. It reminds me of Anton situation where Sather bet Staal was the glue in that pairing and turned out to be wrong. It seems Gorton did the same thing except this is more costly at cap hit and cost a 1st round pick. I hope Trouba and Gorton prove me wrong with him becoming that Norris trophy contender that Gorton paid him as such. I get it that at some point you have to go for it but Sakic and Stevie Y have ran circles on how to operate and conduct business. Funny thing is people bash Sather for “going for it” with Marc Staal and Dan Girardi contracts. He traded firsts and 2nds like Gorton and got crucified.

If Rangers don’t win a series next year Gorton will have same amount of series win as Sather did in his first 5 years except Gorton was handed a cup contending roster. I agree about not throwing young kids to the wolves which is why I don’t get people saying we need to upgrade 2C because they don’t like Strome who is a perfect stopgap and show young kids the right way of playing. Signing vets to cheap deals like Boyle or Brass would’ve been smarter instead of guys like McKegg or Haley.

 

[mrmovies779]

Quick Hits: The future of NHL advertising, Carl Hagelin may have wanted to stay, NHL top 200 players Hags said he would take less but was never given a chance. I would say Fox was signing with us the way he conducted interviews and won’t go into detail. The difference is now you know he could play at NHL as he could’ve easily turned into a Matt Gilroy type which is why a 3rd was more than fair value considering that’s what Vesey went for and where Fox was drafted. Trouba put up better numbers with Morrissey as well. It reminds me of Anton situation where Sather bet Staal was the glue in that pairing and turned out to be wrong. It seems Gorton did the same thing except this is more costly at cap hit and cost a 1st round pick. I hope Trouba and Gorton prove me wrong with him becoming that Norris trophy contender that Gorton paid him as such. I get it that at some point you have to go for it but Sakic and Stevie Y have ran circles on how to operate and conduct business. Funny thing is people bash Sather for “going for it” with Marc Staal and Dan Girardi contracts. He traded firsts and 2nds like Gorton and got crucified. If Rangers don’t win a series next year Gorton will have same amount of series win as Sather did in his first 5 years except Gorton was handed a cup contending roster. I agree about not throwing young kids to the wolves which is why I don’t get people saying we need to upgrade 2C because they don’t like Strome who is a perfect stopgap and show young kids the right way of playing. Signing vets to cheap deals like Boyle or Brass would’ve been smarter instead of guys like McKegg or Haley.

Paragraphs-they are your friend

 

[bbny]

Only on HF would fans of each team think there is no basis for a trade between a team that is in a serious salary cap crunch with a 22-year old potential top-pairing LHD (a position the Rangers desperately need) who currently sits at third on their depth chart, and one of the top 20-year old prospects in the world, who many project to be a top four, if not top pairing, RHD, who can slot in nicely in their top four once he arrives in the NHL within another year or two, and will be on an ELC to boot. Fans think they will simply be able to move 2 of Killorn, Johnson, Palat and Gourde in a flat cap world where 2/3 of the league already sit at a place where they can't really take more cap on. Funny.

How does Victor Hedman/Ryan McDonagh-Nils Lundkvist sound? How does Mikhail Sergachev-Adam Fox/Jacob Trouba sound? I understand both fanbases are absolutely smitten with both players, as they should be, but to me there is certainly a basis for a trade. Don't want Georgiev because of the impending expansion draft? Fine. Totally fair. You can easily tweak the offer and change the third piece so it is better balance for Tampa.

I guess I'm in the minority here, but I would 100% do a trade around Nils + Carolina's pick + something else for Sergachev. You have to give to get. Oh, and btw, the Lightning do not have a first-round pick in this year's draft. This gives them extra draft capital, and they are simply one of the best run organizations in the NHL and do a good job finding talent anywhere. A draft pick, even if it sits at 22, is certainly an asset gained for them. Also from a Rangers salary cap perspective, essentially they're replacing the money (and likely a bit more) the front office paid Skjei to pay somebody who will likely be worth it. Figure out the second cap move later.

I think your reasoning is very sound. Value wise it is extremely fair for both sides. I personally would not do it from the Rangers point of view though, because Sergachev will need to be paid and Lundkvist on an ELC should be worth his weight in gold. Only thing I would note on Tampa's side is they may not want to lose Sergachev and wait a year for Lundkvist, thus weakening their roster for a year.

 

[ICanMotteBelieveIt]

I mean expansion draft exempt, 2 more years of ELC, slightly better offensively and less sheltered than Sergachev is in Tampa... at worst they're a wash

Also RHD.

 

[ICanMotteBelieveIt]

We paid a 1st and Nolan Foote for Blake Coleman. New Jersey didn't want to move him since he was a good player for them and had an additional year left. We had to pony up whatever it took to get Jersey to trade him. We really wanted the player and thought he would be a key piece for us so we were ok with doing so.

So if you want Sergachev and we aren't willing to trade him we aren't going to do it for something you might think is fair value. It'll be something that we can't turn down.

This is completely off topic; didn't you used to be a Blackhawks fan or am i thinking of someone else? If my memory isn't complete shit (i wouldn't rule that out) how come you changed teams?