Post-Game Talk: Rangers @ Islanders | 1/16/20

3 Stars of the Game


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mrhockey193195

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Nov 14, 2006
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Denver, CO
Just finished watching. My thoughts:

- What a f***ing hockey game. What a game! Intensity, hatred, great chances, great goaltending, bad officiating (more on that later)...too few games these days have this level of emotion. And it's not about fighting or cheap shots. It's about intensity and passion, even when within the rules of the game.

- I have such a man-crush on Mika. He's a 200 foot superstar, and he seems like such a nice guy off the ice too. This is the first time we've "developed" a star center since Ratelle...right? He's at a level beyond Stepan, and I love Step. Only other names that come to mind: Turcotte, Kisio, Ridley...none of them were close to that level.

- Georgiev is a monster. One or two bad games here or there shouldn't deflect from the fact that the guy has been stellar and consistent this season. I know the three-goalie system is untenable, and in my heart I want Henrik to stay through his contract as the #1 / 1A, but trading Georgiev would be a very, very tough pill to swallow if we decide to go that route.

- In all of 2:09, you saw the good & the bad of ADA. In fairness, we haven't seen much of the bad this season. And even if that's part of the package going forward, he's so damn good that it's easy to overlook. His "argument" with Quinn on the bench was, to me, clearly nothing more than Quinn scolding him and ADA being pissed at the refs and generally amped up. That looked like positive frustration and stress, not contention or anything concerning.

- Four months ago, I never would have considered the thought of re-signing Strome. Now, seeing how much chemistry he has with Panarin, I am firmly in the re-sign camp. Don't be fooled, not everyone can play with Panarin. The fact that Strome is over-performing with him is not a negative, it's a positive. It allows Zib to slot in on another line and gives us so much balance in our top 6.

- How delusional am I that I'm holding out hope Kreider takes a 6 x $6MM contract to stay here? I want him to be a part of our future. I love that guy.

- A small moment during the game where I felt like an "insider": Lindgren & Lee going at it late in the third. I watched those two training and skating this summer in "Da Beauty League" in Minneapolis. Not saying that these guys are automatically friends because they train together (with 30 or 40 other MN guys), but I always love those back stories. Kind of like when Girardi and Cally came up together after playing together in Guelph, or Zucc and Malkin going at it despite being friends and teammates from Magnitogorsk. As a huge aside, it's one of the reasons I actually love Pierre McGuire on NBC talking about players who were teammates in junior or on peewee teams...I actually think that adds a ton to the intrigue of a matchup.

- I don't mean to be melodramatic, but it feels like every time Kakko has a prime chance he makes the wrong decision. He shoots when he should pass. He passes when he should shoot. He's patient when he should act fast, and he rushes when he has a ton of time. The only reason I'm not overly concerned is I know how much skill this guy has and I see all the elements of a really, really good player. But boy...seeing basically no progress in the last three months is starting to make me antsy.

- Not that any of you should know what my post history is off hand, but I almost never complain about the refs. It's a tough job that has practically no upside. You get paid peanuts, you're always booed by the fans, millionaires players on both teams are always cursing you out. If you do a perfect job, you get no accolades...just fewer complaints. Frankly, I hate when players complain about the refs, it's a bad look. Tonight - the refs definitely weren't their best. There's no conspiracy, no anti-Rangers bias. It happens sometimes. It was frustrating, in particular the slash on ADA, the Boychuck knee on Kreider, and the Panarin "dive". Just glad we got the W so it doesn't linger and we can move on.
 
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bl02

Registered User
Jan 13, 2014
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Larry Brooks said, on Duguay’s pod cast, he believes it’ll be Shesterkin starting on Sunday.

I know it’s Brooks. Just throwing it out there lol.
And it should be Shesterkin and the obviously Georgiev on Tuesday. Hank is a consummate professional he will deal with it. Right now that's best for the team. Having Hank play more than either of the younger goalies doesn't make sense.
 

bl02

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Jan 13, 2014
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What a win against their biggest rival!

Major props to the club for elevating their game to overcome a deficit against a red hot netminder.

Not convinced this club will be sellers.
Still feel JG may have the toughest job (decision wise) down the stretch especially considering the three goalie situation. One of Hank or AG have to go. But you're right if we are within 4 points or so come the TDL not 100 percent sure Kreider gets traded.
 
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Levitate

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Jul 29, 2004
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I like a lot of what I"m seeing out of Kakko right now, doing a lot more than he was before christmas

it hasn't all come together for him yet but he's playing the puck more and looking to make thing shappen more. Getting more touches, the points will come

I bet he does well after the all star break
 

Maximus

Registered User
Dec 23, 2003
8,502
3,140
Doylestown, PA
And it should be Shesterkin and the obviously Georgiev on Tuesday. Hank is a consummate professional he will deal with it. Right now that's best for the team. Having Hank play more than either of the younger goalies doesn't make sense.

Exactly and I said the same previously. It's obvious that Georgie will get the Islanders again and Shesty has sat too long and so he needs to get the Carolina game on Sunday...not even a question about it.

This team is moving forward with youth and into the future and tho Hank is still here and as you astutely state, he's a professional and he knows his role has changed. Tho it likely won't happen, it would be awesome, if he would accommodate to the rebuild even more than he has and drop his no move clause.

Sure he wants to retire as a Ranger, he can still do that and do what Leetch did and go ahead and waive his no trade clause and allow the Rangers to deal him to a contender for a Cup and than come back in a few years and watch his number get retired to the rafters which will certainly happen.
 
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bl02

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Jan 13, 2014
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I like a lot of what I"m seeing out of Kakko right now, doing a lot more than he was before christmas

it hasn't all come together for him yet but he's playing the puck more and looking to make thing shappen more. Getting more touches, the points will come

I bet he does well after the all star break

I agree he's been better. Still obviously we criticize for not shooting the damn puck but he's possessed the puck better and seems to be playing better without the puck as well (which i'm sure is making the coach happy).
 

Maximus

Registered User
Dec 23, 2003
8,502
3,140
Doylestown, PA
I like a lot of what I"m seeing out of Kakko right now, doing a lot more than he was before christmas

it hasn't all come together for him yet but he's playing the puck more and looking to make thing shappen more. Getting more touches, the points will come

I bet he does well after the all star break

He was noticeable tonight no doubt as he was active and did some nice things. That said, it's not going to be until next year after Kakko has had a full offseason training regimen of power skating, strength training and such until he starts to become the player we know he'll be for us.

So IMO what we see of him now is very likey what we will be getting going forward the rest of the season. I've accepted this and I'm OK with it. He's a young pup...only 18 years old. Just wait till he fills out and starts to skate better and keep up with the pace of the league, with his elite skill set, he's going to be a beast.

We as a fan base just need to be a bit more patient with him...that's all!
 
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Captain Lindy

Formerly known as Kreider Beast
Apr 1, 2006
15,632
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What could we posssibly get for him? I don't see a big return unfortunately
He's (Kreider) fine right where he is.

The Rangers used a smart strategy tonight and played rope a dope, knowing the Piles would come out all fired up. Rangers used it to their advantage with Georgie playing out of his mind. The team sure has confidence in him and it's great to see.
 

Rongomania

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Dec 31, 2017
3,845
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Inwood
Pidto does the Knicks games now, no?

He seems like a guy who's opinion I would trust deeply on Basketball ... uhhhh .. Knicks are so f*cked they hired the most vanilla of all the vanilla .. Bill Pidto .. there's this whole 'zero enthusiasm' thing he does every time he speaks. Makes Giannone seem like prime Sam.
 

Stasis

Mad Decent
Oct 25, 2009
1,896
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NYC & MTL
What could we posssibly get for him (Buchnevich)? I don't see a big return unfortunately

Definitely nothing anywhere close to what we'd get for Kreider but a b prospect and 2nd/3rd rounder is possible. He's 24 and projects to be a 45-50 pt winger that can (theoretically) play either side pretty well. He can slot into a lot of teams top 6 and at his cap + being an RFA, can be attractive that way.

The issue is more that I don't see anyone offering much for him at the TDL unless they already have some interest or have in the past.

The other, bigger, issue is that we can't keep Kreider, Strome and ADA. And I absolutely think we should keep Strome and ADA. Strome because he clearly has chemistry with Panarin and we're lacking center depth with him in the mix let alone without. Tony because he's a team player. He's in it, he's a glue guy the team loves and when he's fired up you can see the effect it has on everyone and the game. He doesn't need to fight to do that. Him, Lemmy, etc... a competitive team needs these guys. And that's without mentioning that's he's an absolute stud offensively. Wait 'til he's not under Ruff on defense structure. See: Pionk.

I want to keep Kreider too but at 6-7M for 7 years? That's gonna suck sooner than later, as much or more than the Trouba deal. We want him because he fits now, right now, and has and will for another 2-3 years and we don't wanna break this apart. We want to keep this and grow the rookies. But we can't keep everyone. If we're moving Kreider and Georgie we need some good returns and the focus should be less on another 1st rounder and more on a game ready prospect or young player. It's a shame Kakko hasn't shown what he will be (and I do believe he'll be a stud) yet because I'd say we should move both Kreider AND Buch if the Kreider return involved a decent young winger. There's a lot more to it than that but I'll save it for the roster build thread.
 
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Anthony5967

Registered User
Dec 24, 2015
7,754
5,484
Strong Island, NY
The Isles postgame thread was VOMIT. Ripping Fox for choosing NY and how if it wasn't for NYC the NYR wouldn't have Panarin or Fox. Crying about the refs, saying the Zibanejad goal wasn't conclusive enough. They wanted "Ross the Plug" to target Lindgren and DeAngelo. Oh, and one guy said "what's with these shi**y goalies playing well against us"? HAHAHAHA. You know they're hurting.
 

Ola

Registered User
Apr 10, 2004
34,601
11,603
Sweden
Just finished watching. My thoughts:

- What a ****ing hockey game. What a game! Intensity, hatred, great chances, great goaltending, bad officiating (more on that later)...too few games these days have this level of emotion. And it's not about fighting or cheap shots. It's about intensity and passion, even when within the rules of the game.

- I have such a man-crush on Mika. He's a 200 foot superstar, and he seems like such a nice guy off the ice too. This is the first time we've "developed" a star center since Ratelle...right? He's at a level beyond Stepan, and I love Step. Only other names that come to mind: Turcotte, Kisio, Ridley...none of them were close to that level.

- Georgiev is a monster. One or two bad games here or there shouldn't deflect from the fact that the guy has been stellar and consistent this season. I know the three-goalie system is untenable, and in my heart I want Henrik to stay through his contract as the #1 / 1A, but trading Georgiev would be a very, very tough pill to swallow if we decide to go that route.

- In all of 2:09, you saw the good & the bad of ADA. In fairness, we haven't seen much of the bad this season. And even if that's part of the package going forward, he's so damn good that it's easy to overlook. His "argument" with Quinn on the bench was, to me, clearly nothing more than Quinn scolding him and ADA being pissed at the refs and generally amped up. That looked like positive frustration and stress, not contention or anything concerning.

- Four months ago, I never would have considered the thought of re-signing Strome. Now, seeing how much chemistry he has with Panarin, I am firmly in the re-sign camp. Don't be fooled, not everyone can play with Panarin. The fact that Strome is over-performing with him is not a negative, it's a positive. It allows Zib to slot in on another line and gives us so much balance in our top 6.

- How delusional am I that I'm holding out hope Kreider takes a 6 x $6MM contract to stay here? I want him to be a part of our future. I love that guy.

- A small moment during the game where I felt like an "insider": Lindgren & Lee going at it late in the third. I watched those two training and skating this summer in "Da Beauty League" in Minneapolis. Not saying that these guys are automatically friends because they train together (with 30 or 40 other MN guys), but I always love those back stories. Kind of like when Girardi and Cally came up together after playing together in Guelph, or Zucc and Malkin going at it despite being friends and teammates from Magnitogorsk. As a huge aside, it's one of the reasons I actually love Pierre McGuire on NBC talking about players who were teammates in junior or on peewee teams...I actually think that adds a ton to the intrigue of a matchup.

- I don't mean to be melodramatic, but it feels like every time Kakko has a prime chance he makes the wrong decision. He shoots when he should pass. He passes when he should shoot. He's patient when he should act fast, and he rushes when he has a ton of time. The only reason I'm not overly concerned is I know how much skill this guy has and I see all the elements of a really, really good player. But boy...seeing basically no progress in the last three months is starting to make me antsy.

- Not that any of you should know what my post history is off hand, but I almost never complain about the refs. It's a tough job that has practically no upside. You get paid peanuts, you're always booed by the fans, millionaires players on both teams are always cursing you out. If you do a perfect job, you get no accolades...just fewer complaints. Frankly, I hate when players complain about the refs, it's a bad look. Tonight - the refs definitely weren't their best. There's no conspiracy, no anti-Rangers bias. It happens sometimes. It was frustrating, in particular the slash on ADA, the Boychuck knee on Kreider, and the Panarin "dive". Just glad we got the W so it doesn't linger and we can move on.

Great stuff!
 

Morten

Registered User
May 24, 2014
387
255
Suck it isles, just lost their Stanley Cup :sarcasm:

and holy crap being stuck listening to their commentators is bad
 

Ola

Registered User
Apr 10, 2004
34,601
11,603
Sweden
It's a weird and kinda sad place to be in right now tbh. Shesty needs to play, to reply to your earlier query on who would play vs. CBJ but I have a feeling they'll go with Hank. They can't sit him forever, or at least, they won't do him like that even if he's seemingly our third goalie atm (too small of a sample size for Shesty in the NHL yet, though I do think he will be a beast) and I think it'd be silly and weird to not let Georgie finish this Islanders series. It's his series right now and he's definitely invested in it. Tuesday should absolutely be Georgiev. Shesty needs to play more NHL games. We can't sit Hank forever.

Goalie conundrums are terrible to deal with. We've seen it with Montreal, and with Vancouver among others. Ours is particularly frustrating. Shesty has performed extremely well at every level and league he's played at/in, and his brief 2-game NHL stint showed that he can do it here too. He is, I truly believe, going to be one of the league's best goalies moving forward, period. There will likely be some speed bumps, but I don't think they'll be major or last long. I think he's pretty much ready for prime time. Then we have Georgiev who has proven several times over that he can be a starter in this league. He's got 64 NHL games on his resume over 3 seasons and in front of varying degrees of weak defense (structurally or otherwise) and while he's definitely had some very poor outings, he's shown that he bounces back and has progressed very nicely. And he's shown that he can absolutely steal games and be a stud. At 23. He'd be a better starter for a lot of teams in the league already, the only question is how he'll handle a larger load of 50-60 games or so, and personally I think he'd be fine with that as he's adjusted well and been introduced smoothly (this is the one area where I could see some small hiccups with having Shesty play that much right away which wouldn't be ideal).

And then we have Hank. The contract is one year too long. That's what it boils down to right now. A LOT of our questions and issues would be resolved if Hank's contract ended this season. For one, removing his $8.5M would allow us to keep both Strome and DeAngelo easily, which I truly think we should even if we move one later. Secondly, it would allow us to re-sign him as a backup for a year or two at a much lower salary and I think he'd do that. Play with Shesty, understanding that he's the backup who's easing in the new generation (who idolized him as a kid, too) and giving him a chance to maybe see us compete again and make a run before he retires (BIG maybe, but still) while still getting to play and semi-coach along with Allaire. That'd be our best case scenario imo, while having Huska and maybe some other vet in the AHL.

In either situation we have to move Georgiev. And that sucks. Because I want to see him continue to develop and be awesome for us, and we've all (well, most of us) grown attached to the guy! We can't keep Georgiev and Shesty. We could for a year if Hank retired fully, which is the other way things could work out for us (and we know the org would give him any job he wants and pay him as much as his current contract does next year, easily) by signing Georgiev to a decent contract and having a tandem of him and Shesty, which would still ease Shesty in and would likely increase Georgiev's trade value in the long run. But ultimately, either way, we're gonna have to move one of the two since both, imo, will be starters and we can't have a 2 starter situation for long. And as much as I love Georgie, and think he'll be awesome somewhere else which will hurt to see, I think Shesty is the one to keep. I felt weird about moving Cam, and then Raanta too... but trading Georgiev feels worse.

Ok, rant off. Point is Shesty needs to play and Hank won't sit forever. So, I have no idea how they handle this other than trading Georgiev for, hopefully, a nice return. We can't risk losing Shesty. What I'd give to have both for a cup run though, damn.

Good points, but I am not as worried about them. I am usually pretty touchy about these things. But the red flag for me is when someone don’t play at all. If everyone plays regularly, I am not worried. I bet these guys got a bit of a show down going on in practice. That can never be bad.
 
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