Confirmed with Link: Randy Lee to be arraigned in Buffalo court

[BonkTastic]

The sad double standard here isn't along the lines of sexual preference, it's along the lines of salary and job descriptions.

NHL players get away with this kind of behavior. All. The. Time. Pro athletes and pervy behaviour go hand in hand like bread and butter. If it ends up that Lee is guilty of what he is accused of doing, then he certainly deserves whatever repercussions come his way... but when players do exactly the same thing to young women, everyone just turns the other way. Sure, every once and a while you get a Kane situation and there's a bit of public attention paid to it, but it largely all gets swept under the carpet.

Heck, this is a league where some people still admire Bobby Hull, a guy who might be one of the biggest pieces of human garbage ever to lace skates in this league, but he was good at hockey so no one ever talks about it.

Sad that it took an exec doing this for it to get any attention in the league, and even sadder that however the Lee situation plays out, it won't change anything when players continue to be perv-bags, because they're somehow exempt from it.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

The sad double standard here isn't along the lines of sexual preference, it's along the lines of salary and job descriptions.

NHL players get away with this kind of behavior. All. The. Time. Pro athletes and pervy behaviour go hand in hand like bread and butter. If it ends up that Lee is guilty of what he is accused of doing, then he certainly deserves whatever repercussions come his way... but when players do exactly the same thing to young women, everyone just turns the other way. Sure, every once and a while you get a Kane situation and there's a bit of public attention paid to it, but it largely all gets swept under the carpet.

Heck, this is a league where some people still admire Bobby Hull, a guy who might be one of the biggest pieces of human garbage ever to lace skates in this league, but he was good at hockey so no one ever talks about it.

Sad that it took an exec doing this for it to get any attention in the league, and even sadder that however the Lee situation plays out, it won't change anything when players continue to be perv-bags, because they're somehow exempt from it.

theres something ive always thought about this and known.. but im not good enough with my words to make it not sound offensive.

 

[hawthy]

This organization is maybe one moderately significant negative story away from being discussed in the history books of ineptitude and shame of poorly run pro-sports teams, if not there already.

Given that the NHL Draft is a week and a half away and free agency less than three weeks away, I trust we have the right people running things to get us etched in.

 

[BonkTastic]

theres something ive always thought about this and known.. but im not good enough with my words to make it not sound offensive.

Like... Offensive in general?

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

The sad double standard here isn't along the lines of sexual preference, it's along the lines of salary and job descriptions.

NHL players get away with this kind of behavior. All. The. Time. Pro athletes and pervy behaviour go hand in hand like bread and butter. If it ends up that Lee is guilty of what he is accused of doing, then he certainly deserves whatever repercussions come his way... but when players do exactly the same thing to young women, everyone just turns the other way. Sure, every once and a while you get a Kane situation and there's a bit of public attention paid to it, but it largely all gets swept under the carpet.

Heck, this is a league where some people still admire Bobby Hull, a guy who might be one of the biggest pieces of human garbage ever to lace skates in this league, but he was good at hockey so no one ever talks about it.

Sad that it took an exec doing this for it to get any attention in the league, and even sadder that however the Lee situation plays out, it won't change anything when players continue to be perv-bags, because they're somehow exempt from it.

So a 20 something year old guy hitting on a 20 something year old gal ---> perv-bag... What happens at these singles bars now a days .. I mean do people who just meet dance... touch a bit... get provocative... try to get laid .... this sort of interaction must still go on without being pervs no?

A 56 year old team official hitting on a 19 year old shuttle driver while attending a team function same thing really... no real cause for alarm except the complaints

 

[BonkTastic]

So a 20 something year old guy hitting on a 20 something year old gal ---> perv-bag...

Come on SoA, that's not what I said at all.

A 56 year old team official hitting on a 19 year old shuttle driver while attending a team function same thing really... no real cause for alarm except the complaints

That's also not at all what I said.

Come on, man. You're way too good a poster for this.

 

[FlyingJ]

Really looking forward to seeing Randy Lee front and center at the Dev camp this year.

Especially when much of the Ottawa media simply doesn't bring it up, regardless of if he's found guilty or not. The organization has already positioned itself to keep him with the "not a criminal charge" portion of its statement. I expect the vast majority of the Ottawa media will follow suit even if he is found guilty.

 

[FlyingJ]

The sad double standard here isn't along the lines of sexual preference, it's along the lines of salary and job descriptions.

NHL players get away with this kind of behavior. All. The. Time. Pro athletes and pervy behaviour go hand in hand like bread and butter. If it ends up that Lee is guilty of what he is accused of doing, then he certainly deserves whatever repercussions come his way... but when players do exactly the same thing to young women, everyone just turns the other way. Sure, every once and a while you get a Kane situation and there's a bit of public attention paid to it, but it largely all gets swept under the carpet.

Heck, this is a league where some people still admire Bobby Hull, a guy who might be one of the biggest pieces of human garbage ever to lace skates in this league, but he was good at hockey so no one ever talks about it.

Sad that it took an exec doing this for it to get any attention in the league, and even sadder that however the Lee situation plays out, it won't change anything when players continue to be perv-bags, because they're somehow exempt from it.

This is really worth mentioning. I won't list specific examples here because they are all rumours, but man, you do not have to ask around much to hear a ton of horror stories about various Sens and 67s in this town. The Sens teams immediately after the 04-05 lockout come up most often in my experience.

These guys are used to having their peers worship the ground they walk on from the time they are 16 years old, all because they have a chance of making the NHL. Would it really surprise anyone to hear they have warped perceptions when it comes to these issues?

And yes, it's by and large swept under the rug. All to maintain the league's image, especially with guys like Cherry constantly harping on how NHL players are "good guys" compared to the other big leagues in North America. No, Don, hockey players are just better at covering it up.

 

[Qward]

So a 20 something year old guy hitting on a 20 something year old gal ---> perv-bag... What happens at these singles bars now a days .. I mean do people who just meet dance... touch a bit... get provocative... try to get laid .... this sort of interaction must still go on without being pervs no?

A 56 year old team official hitting on a 19 year old shuttle driver while attending a team function same thing really... no real cause for alarm except the complaints

There is a youtuber called Lindsey Doe. She does a good job of answering this.
I am at work or I would find the link for you. It is along the lines of when is it appropriate to "hit on" someone.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Person on tweeter saying like “can’t wait for Lee’s lawyer to win the case and then people starting taking how it’s proof he’s innocent”.

What is happening to people. One allegation makes this the unequivocal truth but a long court proceeding is no proof of anything....

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Like... Offensive in general?

Yes. But it’s not trying to be. Therefore I shall keep it to myself as I do not have he proper words. But when I do I shall reveal.

 

[slamigo]

NHL players get away with this kind of behavior. All. The. Time. Pro athletes and pervy behaviour go hand in hand like bread and butter. If it ends up that Lee is guilty of what he is accused of doing, then he certainly deserves whatever repercussions come his way... but when players do exactly the same thing to young women, everyone just turns the other way. Sure, every once and a while you get a Kane situation and there's a bit of public attention paid to it, but it largely all gets swept under the carpet.

My issue is that NHL players are not paid to mentor and develop young women and are not in a position of authority directly responsible for their future employment. The dream of playing in the NHL isn’t hanging over their sexual advances like the sword of Damocles. What if a 19 year old prospect believes that pleasuring Randy is how you get ice time? Or by saying “no” how can he be sure he hasn’t just killed his chance to play in the NHL.
The crappy behaviour by athletes towards women is horrible but Randy Lee’s alleged behaviour is abhorrent.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Come on SoA, that's not what I said at all.
That's also not at all what I said.
Come on, man. You're way too good a poster for this.

"NHL players get away with this kind of behavior. All. The. Time. Pro athletes and pervy behaviour go hand in hand like bread and butter. If it ends up that Lee is guilty of what he is accused of doing, then he certainly deserves whatever repercussions come his way... but when players do exactly the same thing to young women, everyone just turns the other way. Sure, every once and a while you get a Kane situation and there's a bit of public attention paid to it, but it largely all gets swept under the carpet."
Yes I may have stretched it a bit to make a counter point... I do not agree with any parallels between young 20 something hockey players hitting on young women and what Randy Lee did. Lets take the young players. There are degrees there.. disrespectful, inappropriate, and beyond sometimes. If what is going on is over the edge or if it approaches harassment or something worse I would hope the victims would report it and that the perpetrator would be held to account for his actions. I don't think this is rampant or we would hear more charges against players. Some pro athletes are marks as well. Where are these pervy acts taking place? Are they at a bar with alcohol involved all around? I doubt if they are at the grocery store. We have to assume Kane was innocent of the charges against him and we really do not know exactly what went on.. but the accusations against him went beyond debatable impropriety. I would not consider that in the normal sphere. You don't have to be a pro athelete to be disrectful, loud, lewd... immature 19-24 year old men in a crowd with alcohol .. is a good enough recipe for it.

 

[Micklebot]

My issue is that NHL players are not paid to mentor and develop young women and are not in a position of authority directly responsible for their future employment. The dream of playing in the NHL isn’t hanging over their sexual advances like the sword of Damocles. What if a 19 year old prospect believes that pleasuring Randy is how you get ice time? Or by saying “no” how can he be sure he hasn’t just killed his chance to play in the NHL.
The crappy behaviour by athletes towards women is horrible but Randy Lee’s alleged behaviour is abhorrent.

Has Lee been alledged any of this behaviour towards prospects? Apparently there are some tweets from a former CTC employee, did he do any of this towards people he was in a position of authority over? I haven't read the tweets tbh.

 

[FlyingJ]

O

Has Lee been alledged any of this behaviour towards prospects? Apparently there are some tweets from a former CTC employee, did he do any of this towards people he was in a position of authority over? I haven't read the tweets tbh.

To the best of myy knowledge, no. But given the nature of the claims against Lee, these questions are likely to come up.

I'll say it again: let him have his day in court. But the organization should have still suspeneded him while the case was ongoing.

And if he's found guilty? Whoo-boy, those questions are going to brought up a lot more. If that happens and the team doesn't fire him, I can't say I'd want my kids anywhere near the Senators if I were a parent.

 

[Micklebot]

I'll say it again: let him have his day in court. But the organization should have still suspeneded him while the case was ongoing.

I think suspending him only makes sense if the risk of him repeating the offence or similar ones increases by him continuing to do his job. So long as he's not exposed to situations where further incidence could occur, there's really not much logic to suspending him imo. I guess from an optics perspective, you could argue the org looks good suspending him, but what if he's then found innocent, and the whole thing was made up? I think the org needs to do it's due diligence and mitigate risks, but I'm not sure suspending him really accomplishes that. They certainly should investigate and interview any staff to see if there are other credible incidents

 

[FlyingJ]

I think suspending him only makes sense if the risk of him repeating the offence or similar ones increases by him continuing to do his job. So long as he's not exposed to situations where further incidence could occur, there's really not much logic to suspending him imo. I guess from an optics perspective, you could argue the org looks good suspending him, but what if he's then found innocent, and the whole thing was made up? I think the org needs to do it's due diligence and mitigate risks, but I'm not sure suspending him really accomplishes that. They certainly should investigate and interview any staff to see if there are other credible incidents

The guy's job literally involves working with guys aged 18 and 19. Not to mention the fact that the Sens' process for the 2018 draft is still ongoing! Hell, I'll go out on a limb and say that's why the team didn't suspend him: they're so thin on staff they can't afford to lose as assistant GM a month away from the draft.

And yes, it's atrocious optics for an organization, especially one that just went through multiple town halls in a desperate attempt to improve its image.

 

[Pangu]

Has Lee been alledged any of this behaviour towards prospects? Apparently there are some tweets from a former CTC employee, did he do any of this towards people he was in a position of authority over? I haven't read the tweets tbh.

I think the critical thing here from a Sens perspective was that Lee did harass this young man at the man’s place of work while Lee was on a business trip. Moreover, Lee has power over other young men at his place of business. I don’t think it’s necessary that we need to know that he harassed CTC employees or players to say that the organization should take precautions and be public that harassing people in their places of work is not acceptable.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Sens are getting so many black marks against they they are starting to look like Gerry Cheevers' mask. I think he should have been put on limited duties or suspended with pay until the case has been heard. I can understand them believing in Lee and showing that thru their actions or non actions. The problem to me is less about guilty or innocent. Its the image of the team. Its just too public and the public imo isn't going to ignore it or forget regardless of the outcome. imo Most people with figure its just some fancy lawyering that got him off a minor legal charge... but...its highly unusual. I have never heard of a NHL team official being charges with this type of harassment. The next college free agent that needs to be signed .. do we sent Randy down to meet with him?
They will now wait until the verdict is in. I really think they should be either letting him go or changing is duties from being a public face of the franchise and anything to do with recruiting, working with or evaluating players.

 

[coladin]

I have a hard time believing Lee will be anywhere in the public eye. They may not have suspended him, but can't see him being out and about as this is obviously a huge black eye to the team and to him , personally. Goes without saying that if the allegations are true that I feel for the man who was affected.

I'm sure Melnyk's legal team explained everything to him on how to proceed with this situation. Firing him or suspending him then having charges thrown out or being acquitted, legally, the costs associated with wrongful dismissal would be humongous. No easy way to adjudicate this, but innocent until proven guilty still means something to me. But it is tough sometimes to have the resolve to stick to core values in the face of allegations of this nature.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

That tiny chicken scratch at the top .. is actually Daly's response

 

[Rand0m]

That tiny chicken scratch at the top .. is actually Daly's response

For those with human eyes:

We have jurisdiction over and the ability to discipline all Club employees. We are aware of the Randy Lee situation and will monitor how it proceeds and plays out. At this point, we are treating it as a Club matter and we will rely on Sens to treat the matter with appropriate seriousness, which I believe they have done.

 

[Qward]

I have a hard time believing Bill Daley after his "Hill we will die on" comment during the CBA negotiations. Cause you know, 8 it close to 5.

 

[maclean]

This organization is maybe one moderately significant negative story away from being discussed in the history books of ineptitude and shame of poorly run pro-sports teams, if not there already.

Given that the NHL Draft is a week and a half away and free agency less than three weeks away, I trust we have the right people running things to get us etched in.

This hyperbole is one superlative away from being discussed in the history books of exaggeration bordering on sheer ignorance

 

[Micklebot]

I think the critical thing here from a Sens perspective was that Lee did harass this young man at the man’s place of work while Lee was on a business trip. Moreover, Lee has power over other young men at his place of business. I don’t think it’s necessary that we need to know that he harassed CTC employees or players to say that the organization should take precautions and be public that harassing people in their places of work is not acceptable.

Is suspending him going to affect the likelyhood of him repeating the offense? No, it likely won't. What exactly are these precautions going to accomplish? I don't think it's wrong for the team to offer for him to take some administrative time off till this is settlled, but at the same time, if you suspend him , it's got to be because you feel there is a risk of further damage before the trial can be settled. Once the trial is done, they can go forward with both sides of the story, rather than just allegations from one side.

Besides, as @coladin said, Lee is probably doing background stuff right now, he's likely doing a desk job until this goes to court. The level of precausions here seem appropriate; minimize the amount of contact he has with public, and players/prospects until court. The outrage over whether he is suspended or not to me seems a bit manufatured by those who have already made up their minds about his guilt. The true test of the organisation will be what they do if Lee gets off on a legal technicality. Then, if they keep him on knowing he did it, but got off on a loophole, they are complicit. If they fire him anyways, they show they hold their employees to an appropriate standard.