OT: Raise the Jolly Roger: Tis the off season, Pirates are in port

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DJ Spinoza

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Aug 7, 2003
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Just tuned in and good lord Cruz crushed a line drive up the middle that nearly killed the pitcher and then was hit so hard that the shortstop was directly behind him and still unable to get his glove down to make the play.

edit here's the video:

 
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Empoleon8771

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Aug 25, 2015
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Castro and Bae have both had strong games today to help justify being the starting 2B. Castro just had a moonshot HR and Bae had multiple hits with an RBI.
 

td_ice

Peter shows the way
Aug 13, 2005
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Just tuned in and good lord Cruz crushed a line drive up the middle that nearly killed the pitcher and then was hit so hard that the shortstop was directly behind him and still unable to get his glove down to make the play.

edit here's the video:


Good lord. Pitcher probably saw his life flash before him. Glad he escaped that hit ball.
 

DJ Spinoza

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This is moderately surprising but I guess going with Heineman or Delay is essentially the same thing. Kinda figured he'd have the backup spot due to experience and being close with Hill.
 

DJ Spinoza

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I don't totally get this usage of late, but it could be explained in a few ways. The one I am leaning towards is that they see Swaggerty as an up/down defensive guy who comes off the bench and rarely plays, whereas they see CSN as having more upside as a regular starter. If this is the case, then it does make sense to max his playing time, because presumably if you decided to keep him, you would want him getting regular ABs and then that would possibly mean making other decisions like optioning Joe or the more radical jettisoning Choi in order to move Joe to more of a backup IF/1B role.

That might be the wrong read of the situation, but it's definitely the case that this front office has never seemed to think much of Swaggerty. When he got called up last year, I think he faced a couple of tough LHPs over a handful of games and that was pretty much it.

My guess at their assessment of him might speak to an accurate assessment, I really have no idea, but just from a tools perspective, I'd like to see Swaggerty get a little bit of run as the 3.5/4th OF on this team. CSN has really impressed but as I've said a few times I would want to see him go down to AAA and see if he can maintain the elite plate discipline while adding at least average pop. If he does that, then given the depth, he will easily force his way back onto the team by mid-May or so (and if my assessment guess is right, then cynically you could say that it's better to manipulate CSN's service to guarantee the 7th year of control).
 

MrBrightside

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It could be 100 million or -20 million. Nobody at Forbes has any more clue than the guy that works at your local walmart deli. The numbers just arent made public
I mean, Forbes obviously doesn't know EXACTLY but this is grossly overstated. National media rights are well known. Local media rights have been identified by several sources. Ticket sales are known. Concessions and other stadium revenue can be fairly estimated. The formula for revenue sharing payments is known. Payroll is known, and operating expenses can likewise be projected. This doesn't require a Rosetta Stone to evaluate, and why people would give the benefit of the doubt to owners like Nutting is just bizarre.

Regardless, the problem we have is that this IS the revenue source for the owner. Most other sports owners make their money doing something else and ALSO happen to own a sports franchise. The newspaper industry is in its death throes. He sold his properties. He basically owns the Pirates and a small time whisky company. If you're not willing to deficit spend ever despite the real money in owning a franchise coming from the appreciation of the asset, it's a problem. But here we are.
 

WheresRamziAbid

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1. Forbes has consistently been incorrect anytime there number have been compared to actual financials that get leaked ect.

Problems with your assumption

1. Local media rights are guesses, they are unknown and reports often vary sometimes wildly.

2. Ticket sales are not know. Neither in total amount or actual amount sold for. Marlins were notorious for inflating their attendance by giving away tickets or selling them way below market value in the Loria/Sampson days. Not to mention, say you sell a million tickets (assumption of accuracy). Which ones did you sell? The million cheapest? A mix? Does it meet tour average price?

3. There is no accurate way to measure concessions or the revenue spilt with outside vendors.

4. The rev sharing formula is known but the inputs to that formula are all estimates or guesses.

5. Operating expenses are even harder to estimate as the can very wildly based on 100s of factors.

Why anyone would put an ounce of credibility to random person X guessing at these numbers is mind blowing to me. Seriously go and ask the next person you see what the Pirates profits are and that guy will have just as much of a chance guessing at random than someone estimating without any correct and accurate information.

If you want to make the point that people shouldnt own sports with typical business agenda of make profits, preach brother.

But to assume they are making X dollars because dude at forbes said so is, as my kids would say, sus.
 

Empoleon8771

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Aug 25, 2015
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Who gives a shit about the Pirates profit? This team is in a rebuilding state and spending money on a bad team is pointless. The real question is whether Nutting will spend money on this team when it's ready to be good again. But right now? What's the point?

The only way I want to see this team spend money on players right now is with a Reynolds or Cruz extension.
 

DJ Spinoza

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Aug 7, 2003
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It's not like this is a surprise to anyone, but I don't really like it nonetheless. The overall drafting/development card, though early, is not a very strong one. We drafted Davis because he had an advanced approach at the plate and while he's had injuries, starting in AA is not a good look. The only way I can see it making some kind of sense is if we're really committed to everyday reps and Endy isn't going to just be held in Indy until after Super Two clears.

I think you can just look around and see all kinds of other players whose stock is much different than the guys the Pirates have taken. Too early for fully firm conclusions, but at the same time it's not too much of a stretch to think that Davis and Mayer are going to debut in MLB relatively close to one another.
 

ChaosAgent

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May 8, 2018
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I'm posting on the Discord now.

But I recall posting they would deliberately wait till near Opening Day to get the uptick in vibes, interest and ticket sales. Nice to be right.
 

DJ Spinoza

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Looks like Skenes absolutely shoved vs. Arkansas today. 7 IP, 2 H, 1 ER, 3 BB, 12 Ks so far. Haven't seen anything other than clips, but that's a pretty remarkable showing vs. a very good offense.
 
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WheresRamziAbid

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Scandale du Jour

JordanStaal#1Fan
Mar 11, 2002
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www.angelfire.com
No, a writer at Forbes guesses they made 54 million.

Its not impossible they made that amount but the guys/gal that wrote the article has no more insight to the amount than your butcher
I guess their estimates are at least "in the ballpark".

It is not that hard to estimate operating costs + source of revenues. Especially considering that a lot of the data is publicly available (players salaries, TV contracts, revenue sharing, etc).

It is a guess, but it is a rather educated guess.
 

td_ice

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Aug 13, 2005
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Looks like Skenes absolutely shoved vs. Arkansas today. 7 IP, 2 H, 1 ER, 3 BB, 12 Ks so far. Haven't seen anything other than clips, but that's a pretty remarkable showing vs. a very good offense.
They are in the 10th inning right now. Not sure how many IP Skenes ended up with.
 
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