Lafleurs Guy
Guuuuuuuy!
- Jul 20, 2007
- 75,183
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Props when props is due
- Thread starter Kriss E
- Start date
If you cared watching the game, you'd see that Murray has been invaluable in quite a number of games.
And Briere's season has been a steady creshendo.
Mistakes are always more subtle when nothing majorly negative come from them.
PK does a big turnover leading to goal, and the bad positioning of Bouillon goes unnoticed.
Murray is bad because he's bad at playing defense. What he's good at is pushing people. He's not a good Dman.
To me that's how you really determine how good a coach is. How the team does despite suffering key injuries.
Andrei79
Registered User
- Jan 25, 2013
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He's a big game player. He's stepped it up nicely lately and he's done well considering how he's been treated. With the other guys MB added, Murray primarily, the Habs aren't getting physically abused, liberties aren't taken like they used to. In the last 20 years, I've only seen the 03-04 play like a team, and this edition. They're not great players, but they fit the team concept much more than other alternative out there, they cost no asset, they're on short term deals. I liked the signings then, I still do now.
Lafleurs Guy
Guuuuuuuy!
- Jul 20, 2007
- 75,183
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Yeah... right.
We could've done this with a player who can actually play hockey. As for Briere - 4 mil for another midget who we don't play... yeah, that makes sense. Good thing we don't need that cap space to try to keep Vanek or re-sign Subban.
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So you do NOT actually watch the game. You just spew stupidities, made up your mind months in advance, and have no idea what is actually going on with this team?
Thanks for confirming that
Sorinth
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- Jan 18, 2013
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DAChampion
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- May 28, 2011
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Lafleurs Guy
Guuuuuuuy!
- Jul 20, 2007
- 75,183
- 45,007
You're right - he's a superstar. Thank GOD we signed him. Where would we be without this guy? And Murray's up for the Norris this year right? And let's not forget HOFer Parros - what a find!
I mean what were the odds that we'd find ALL three available? How the **** were we so incredibly lucky to go out and get Briere for the bargain basement price of four ****ing million dollars and a no movement clause! The way he leads the league in empty net goals certainly makes that one worth it.
The three points in 14 games he's had this month certainly bolster what you're saying too. Holy **** has this guy been on fire. We might as well nickname him the molten man he's so ****ing hot. Four million and a no movement clause? Geez... too bad we didn't sign him for eight. That way we could you know hand him the ****ing torch EVERY YEAR.
Holy crap man...
DAChampion
Registered User
- May 28, 2011
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Nope, but Bergevin started his career in an ideal situation. He benefits from both Gauthier's failings and strengths.
Reasons why Bergevin started his career in an ideal situation:
- A third overall draft pick in a year when that yielded Galchenyuk;
- A full cupboard of inherited draft picks, including an extra three 2nd rounders combined in the 2013 and 2014 drafts;
- Two buyouts meaning an excellent salary structure to start with... could have done better buying out Bourque instead of Kaberle but whatever;
- A number 1 goalie;
- A number 1 dman;
- A relatively young forward corps;
- A decent farm/youth system that included Eller, Bournival, Gallagher, Beaulieu, Tinordi;
- The budget and support to hire as many staff as he wanted;
- The previous seasons' Habs had statistically under performed, nearly guaranteeing automatic improvement;
- Several players had been removed or had expiring contrasts, allowing Bergevin to immediately put his touch on the team. There were empty roster spots due to Gomez, Kaberle, Kostitsyn, Gill;
Really, a dream position from which to start a career as GM.
Pierre Gauthier should go down in history for keeping Price instead of Halak. Trading Halak after he was held as the best goalie in the league, his complete aversion to what the media had to say should be an example to any future GM. Certainly the best move this franchise had in 20 years.
dackelljuneaubulis02
Registered User
- Oct 13, 2012
- 11,560
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You're right - he's a superstar. Thank GOD we signed him. Where would we be without this guy? And Murray's up for the Norris this year right? And let's not forget HOFer Parros - what a find!
I mean what were the odds that we'd find ALL three available? How the **** were we so incredibly lucky to go out and get Briere for the bargain basement price of four ****ing million dollars and a no movement clause! The way he leads the league in empty net goals certainly makes that one worth it.
The three points in 14 games he's had this month certainly bolster what you're saying too. Holy **** has this guy been on fire. We might as well nickname him the molten man he's so ****ing hot. Four million and a no movement clause? Geez... too bad we didn't sign him for eight. That way we could you know hand him the ****ing torch EVERY YEAR.
Holy crap man...
yeah that's exactly what PricePKPatch was saying. Come on. You make it sound like he's saying that Weise is Gretzky and Weaver's Coffey.
Murray HAS had moments where he's definitely helped but there are times where he's made some awful decisions with the puck in our end. I truly believe he's been a deterrent a lot of the time for other teams trying to push us around. When was the last time we've seen a team bully us?
Briere isn't what he once was and is overpaid but that doesn't mean he hasn't been a solid player for us. He's scored some key goals and now seems to be anchoring a 3rd line that has some of our favourite whipping boys on it and is actually making it work. It's a nice luxury to have a player of his caliber on a 3rd line. If that 3rd line can keep it up for the playoffs, you can't measure how huge that is for us.
Parros has been more bad than good but even he had his moments but he was definitely an adventure in his own zone. We freed up a prospect roster spot to get him so really who cares.
I think a lot of people were too 'I told you so' when DD was floundering and Briere was being benched every other game. Now it would just be too much an about face to admit maybe we overreacted. I think it's just stubbornness on a lot of people's parts.
Bergevin's done a very astute job in patching up the holes in our line up.
As far as inheriting a good situation, well he kind of did. That 3rd overall pick and the plethora of 2nd round picks looks to be a huge boon for our prospect pool. Plus we got Vanek because of it. But that doesn't mean he hasn't done a good job with what he inherited.
We weren't as bad as our bottom 3 finish in 11-12 but I still think MB has made some great strides in making us better. Don't see why it can't be both that MB came into a better than it looked situation AND he also made good decisions with what he had. Everybody wants to just support their own narrative of what they've acted out on here instead of really seeing what's going on.
MB's done a damn fine job so far.
hockeyfan2k11
Registered User
- Jun 11, 2011
- 12,150
- 6
Habs fans gotta be just as temperamental as teenaged girls. Bergie went from being an incompetent to a god in a few weeks. But if we get smoked in the playoffs hell go right back to incompetent. Bergir made some good moves but also a lot of blunders. A good move doesn't cover up 5 bad ones. Hopefully he makes some good ones this off season and ices a bigger nastier team. The teams record means nothing to me. There are still many things that need to be fixed. Brian Murray went from god to incompetent in just a season. Its all about sustainability. Everyone knew ottawa was a mirage except their delusional fans. Will this team be able to sustain their success into the future? We shall see. But 5 on 5 scoring is a massive problem. You're not winning anything if you can't score 5on 5 with regularity.
WhiskeySeven*
Expect the expected
- Jun 17, 2007
- 25,154
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Yeah but he was vegan and Jaro Spacek told Dave Stubbs, off the record of course, that he didn't quite like that he was informed of his trade before it was official... so Gauthier's the worst, actually.
dackelljuneaubulis02
Registered User
- Oct 13, 2012
- 11,560
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I don't see the real bad ones though. Parros okay but he's a goon that's dressed in like 20 games and cost us nothing. Murray is debateable, he's had his good and his bad but he cost us 1.5 million and bought us time to further develop Tinordi and Beaulieu. Same with Cube.
Other than that and Briere being overpaid by 1.5 million and a year what else has really been that bad? The DD signing seems to be working out. Weise was a great pick up. So was Weaver.
MB went from incompetent to God because everybody was at his throat within 10 games of the season.
You have to look at his moves in context of the Vanek trade. You can't just disregard that move and concentrate on the others. Briere's overpaid for a 3rd line center but so what? He's a great luxury to have and can be pivotal in the playoffs.
The PK bridge deal allowed us to have Vanek and Briere fit in under our cap. The cap will be going up big time so he'll be making that big time money when we have the room where it won't matter.
MB's not beyond reproach but all his moves seem to be making a lot more sense now then they did 5 months ago.
Habs Icing
Formerly Onice
His good moves DO make up for his bad ones if he's learned from his mistakes and has since improved. It's all about the learning curve with Bergevin. I look at him the same way I look at any rookie -- good potential, early screw-ups and learning his position. Yeah, he's made some dumb signings, but I'll bet he won't repeat them. His bad moves were done early and his good moves recently -- even without Vanek, which was a major coup. That's all we can hope for -- a guy who knows when to be cautious, when to be bold, and who improves the team regardless of outside distractions. Bergevin is showing signs he can do that. We'll see...
habtastic
Registered User
Bergevin has always said he's learning and trying to get better.
Coming in, I saw him as very shrewd.
Midway through, I was beginning to doubt.
Since the start of the season, he's impressed me, and the moves IN season, impressed me even more. MT has been the bigger problem, even if the team is currently winning.
We have to consider what this team is constantly up against:
- making sure we don't lose any more prospects for a much poorer player
- getting FAs to come here
- building a team that, even if it's through Price, are good enough for the playoffs (moving towards becoming less dependant on him; and moving towards contending for the Cup)
- becoming more robust, but not at the cost of quality hockey
Murray, Briere, Weaver -- all terrific signings given the climate. I'm not saying Murray is a complete D -- I am terrified when he's on the ice at times, but in the trade off game (skills vs physical presence), I'm often very glad that he's there. I don't see us as getting pushed around at all anymore. Very different team from last year, even though it's been minor tweaks. Not only that, but going forward, we are getting bigger and tougher.
With Bergie, it's all about the progression and I think we are doing just fine in terms of bringing players (vets, prospects and in-betweens) just fine from a GM perspective. Coaching...mmmm...I have my issues.
People are saying, "oh well, see what happens in the playoffs". We have the team we have. There's nothing new coming. It's now going to be about coaching and execution. We have a very good team, that Bergevin is responsible for building/not wrecking. It's now up to MT to corral this into its maximum potential. If Eller can get going and if we can be firing on all cylinders, and if Gorges and Prust return fully healthy -- I can't say that Bergevin didn't set us up for what our best case scenario was for 2013-2014.
Lots of goodness if we develop our players properly. That I put on Bergevin and therein lies our key to that Cup window. I suggest he start by getting Vanek signed.
Hard to bash the signing of Daniel Brière, who is a bonafide goal scorer with lots of experience. I just don't get the hate.
Coming in, I saw him as very shrewd.
Midway through, I was beginning to doubt.
Since the start of the season, he's impressed me, and the moves IN season, impressed me even more. MT has been the bigger problem, even if the team is currently winning.
We have to consider what this team is constantly up against:
- making sure we don't lose any more prospects for a much poorer player
- getting FAs to come here
- building a team that, even if it's through Price, are good enough for the playoffs (moving towards becoming less dependant on him; and moving towards contending for the Cup)
- becoming more robust, but not at the cost of quality hockey
Murray, Briere, Weaver -- all terrific signings given the climate. I'm not saying Murray is a complete D -- I am terrified when he's on the ice at times, but in the trade off game (skills vs physical presence), I'm often very glad that he's there. I don't see us as getting pushed around at all anymore. Very different team from last year, even though it's been minor tweaks. Not only that, but going forward, we are getting bigger and tougher.
With Bergie, it's all about the progression and I think we are doing just fine in terms of bringing players (vets, prospects and in-betweens) just fine from a GM perspective. Coaching...mmmm...I have my issues.
People are saying, "oh well, see what happens in the playoffs". We have the team we have. There's nothing new coming. It's now going to be about coaching and execution. We have a very good team, that Bergevin is responsible for building/not wrecking. It's now up to MT to corral this into its maximum potential. If Eller can get going and if we can be firing on all cylinders, and if Gorges and Prust return fully healthy -- I can't say that Bergevin didn't set us up for what our best case scenario was for 2013-2014.
Lots of goodness if we develop our players properly. That I put on Bergevin and therein lies our key to that Cup window. I suggest he start by getting Vanek signed.
Hard to bash the signing of Daniel Brière, who is a bonafide goal scorer with lots of experience. I just don't get the hate.
You're right - he's a superstar. Thank GOD we signed him. Where would we be without this guy? And Murray's up for the Norris this year right? And let's not forget HOFer Parros - what a find!
I mean what were the odds that we'd find ALL three available? How the **** were we so incredibly lucky to go out and get Briere for the bargain basement price of four ****ing million dollars and a no movement clause! The way he leads the league in empty net goals certainly makes that one worth it.
The three points in 14 games he's had this month certainly bolster what you're saying too. Holy **** has this guy been on fire. We might as well nickname him the molten man he's so ****ing hot. Four million and a no movement clause? Geez... too bad we didn't sign him for eight. That way we could you know hand him the ****ing torch EVERY YEAR.
Holy crap man...
Just so you are informed: Briere has been centering our 3rd line for a few games now, and has been doing a very good job at it so far.
Not the best signing EVAR, but it's not a trainwreck by any measure of the term. If anything, it's subpar, but it's still a move that makes us currently a better team.
When is the last time you remember seeing Murray in the offensive zone?
Ya, he doesn't get bullied and can step in with rough stuff, sure. He's also stuck in our zone more often than not struggling to get the puck up, and when he does, it's rarely a tape to tape pass.
Murray is a very bad Dman. We don't need to lie to ourselves about this. Would be like arguing Gill was physical.
So you agree with Lafleur Guy that we don't play Briere and thus is a total waste of Cap Space?
I didn't mention Briere, so I don't see where you got that..
Briere is playing exactly how I thought he would. The 3rd line he's centering has been pretty decent. I have no issues there.
But if I have to qualify it, I wouldn't call the Briere signing a good move. It was stupid, and still is.
