Speculation: Predicting the Opening Day Lineup - PART 2

[IranCondraAffair]

Maybe, they also do it when they think players are playing well.

We can't be naive or sentimental here.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Interesting. For formenton dorion says “better players made it. “

For brown he says “close”.

 

[Sweatred]

Interesting. For formenton dorion says “better players made it. “

For brown he says “close”.

In fairness we should expect Pacquette and Paul to be ahead of Form.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

In fairness we should expect Pacquette and Paul to be ahead of Form.

Not sure about paquette but whatever.

 

[Clayonator]

In fairness we should expect Pacquette and Paul to be ahead of Form.

Yeah Paquette has been a solid bottom 6 player for years now, and is only 27. Paul finally broke the door down last year.

 

[Answer]

If Formenton can't beat out anyone in our bottom 6 then it's sad to say the least

 

[Korpse]

Yeah Paquette has been a solid bottom 6 player for years now, and is only 27. Paul finally broke the door down last year.

Yeah he was a regular on one of the best teams in the league over the past 6 seasons. Not sure why a player with one year of pro experience should be better.

 

[NyQuil]

If Formenton can't beat out anyone in our bottom 6 then it's sad to say the least

Shocking to me.

During the off-season (before Stutzle) I maintained that he was the rookie with the best chance of playing the most games given his skillset which can be valuable anywhere in the line-up.

 

[Boud]

Totally agree with your post but just wanted to add on this. I hope that DJ is aware that this style of play will occur in more injuries and PP goals against.

I'm not saying we shouldn't play hard, but there's also a perfect balance with skill and finesse that you need to find.

He might be in line for a rude awakening. Hopefully I'm totally wrong and the Sens are totally competitive within the North division.

I don't disagree with what you're saying but at the same time we've seen many teams take that route successfully in the last few years. Boston, LA and St-Louis always had ''tougher'' teams and were very hard to play against. Some other teams like CBJ and NYI have also seen success with that style of play even though they haven't necessarily won the cup. I would say that these teams likely took more penalties than others but it never stopped them from being successful. I also think that playing physical and on the edge will often generate penalties from opposing teams as they get frustrated of getting hammered all night without it generating PP time for them. Obviously, and as you mention, these teams also have a lot of talent but their motto was having guys that play the right way and that play hard every game and the talent will inevitably show itself within that system. Talented players are talented players, even if we play a different style we will still see that talent on a nightly basis (EX: Barzal in NYI). Some of the ''tougher'' guys will get pushed out in the next year or will have reduced roles on the team with the younger guys taking on more resposibilities. This year is still a rebuilding year and looking at Montreal for example... We know they'll be hard to play against and we need to have that feisty element to ensure that the younger guys play freely, at least until they establish themselves and their confidence. Once that confidence is obtained and the playing style desired by DJ Smith is clearly understood, I think we will see less of these goons in primary roles (ex: Gudbranson).

I look at our roster and I think there is a very good balance of skill and grit. Norris, Tkachuk, Stutzle, Batherson are all very talented players that play hard. You have Chabot, Wolanin, Brannstrom and Dadonov who are also some of those skilled guys, although they might not play just as hard as others do. Then adding guys like Formenton, Pinto and Sanderson towards the end of the year will definitely add to that group of players I just mentionned, guys that play hard and are skilled at the same time.

I think people are a bit too carried away this season. I think the addition of Murray, Dadonov and then some other guys gave the fanbase a sense of false hope that we'll be a great team this season and IMO that's not what'll happen.

 

[Korpse]

If Formenton can't beat out anyone in our bottom 6 then it's sad to say the least

That's not how player development works. Most players aren't just good, they become better. There was a time Mark Stone didn't beat out Colin Greening and Erik Condra either.

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

Shocking to me.

During the off-season (before Stutzle) I maintained that he was the rookie with the best chance of playing the most games given his skillset which can be valuable anywhere in the line-up.

I felt he was the rookie with least chance. He developed his hands and offensive touch nicely in the A last year, he is still quite raw. Last year he scored the 2nd highest goal total of his life. I think they'd want him to continue developing his new found offensive potential and being comfortable with his offensive game so it's more easily transitional.

 

[Micklebot]

Shocking to me.

During the off-season (before Stutzle) I maintained that he was the rookie with the best chance of playing the most games given his skillset which can be valuable anywhere in the line-up.

He also plays very much the style we seem to want to play. Hard nosed, fast paced and in your face.

 

[bert]

If Formenton can't beat out anyone in our bottom 6 then it's sad to say the least

He doesnt have one full pro season under his belt and they didnt play a single exhibition game. Relax.

That's not how player development works. Most players aren't just good, they become better. There was a time Mark Stone didn't beat out Colin Greening and Erik Condra either.

Thank you.

 

[foggyvisor]

He also plays very much the style we seem to want to play. Hard nosed, fast paced and in your face.

And they have been pumping him since he was drafted. I wonder if he showed up to camp in bad shape? That's the only explanation...

 

[BondraTime]

And they have been pumping him since he was drafted. I wonder if he showed up to camp in bad shape? That's the only explanation...

The explanation is that he’s still very young, and the team brought in copious amounts of bodies taking up space on the roster right now.

He should be getting games, but him in the AHL isn’t something that should he considered strange.

 

[cudi]

If Formenton can't beat out anyone in our bottom 6 then it's sad to say the least

Im hoping it isnt a Dan Fritsche situation.

Made Columbus as an 18 year old who was just drafted in round 2. Got sent back to junior after a bit. Fans had super high expectations because of cracking the roster at 18 but never lived up to the hype. Played 256 games though in the NHL.

Formenton is a better prospect than Fritsche was I think though personally.

 

[Boud]

He doesnt have one full pro season under his belt and they didnt play a single exhibition game. Relax.


Thank you.

People are way too carried away with the younger guys needing to absolutely take a role on the team as soon as they're drafted, otherwise "they aren't good players". Other than elite guys, which clearly Formenton is not, most guys take a couple years to adapt to the pro game and even more time to become effective and legitimate NHLers. I feel like you can easily see people who understand this when you see people complaining about L.Brown and Formenton not on the team. If the team was run by some guys on this board we wouldn't have anyone over 22 on the roster and any prospect that is not full time in the NHL by that age would be a bust.

Yet, when guys like Lazar, Ceci, Cowen struggle ... then these same people complain that they were rushed. Can't have it both ways but a lot of people think this way not necessarily realizing how hard it is to become a NHL player and how the very vast majority of prospects that are drafted ultimately fail to become NHlers.

If the coaching staff feels like these players need to take more steps to not only survive, but thrive, in their role in the NHL I think that's completely understandable. Our coaching staff has been good giving chances to pretty much all of our prospects, and then sending them back to the AHL to process what they've learned and then apply it in a setting where they play more and can become more confident in their game.

 

[NyQuil]

People are way too carried away with the younger guys needing to absolutely take a role on the team as soon as they're drafted, otherwise "they aren't good players". Other than elite guys, which clearly Formenton is not, most guys take a couple years to adapt to the pro game and even more time to become effective and legitimate NHLers. I feel like you can easily see people who understand this when you see people complaining about L.Brown and Formenton not on the team. If the team was run by some guys on this board we wouldn't have anyone over 22 on the roster and any prospect that is not full time in the NHL by that age would be a bust.

Yet, when guys like Lazar, Ceci, Cowen struggle ... then these same people complain that they were rushed. Can't have it both ways but a lot of people think this way not necessarily realizing how hard it is to become a NHL player and how the very vast majority of prospects that are drafted ultimately fail to become NHlers.

If the coaching staff feels like these players need to take more steps to not only survive, but thrive, in their role in the NHL I think that's completely understandable. Our coaching staff has been good giving chances to pretty much all of our prospects, and then sending them back to the AHL to process what they've learned and then apply it in a setting where they play more and can become more confident in their game.

I guess the question is whether we get looks at any of these guys.

Playing a few games in the NHL isn't rushing anyone. They can be sent down after ~1-9 games and still retain their status.

 

[Boud]

To add a bit on the Logan Brown situation, we also need to consider that there are many prospects that never turn out to be as good as they were supposed to be. I can think of a guy like Juolevi who was supposed to be as good, if not better, than Chabot. He has barely played any NHL games and that's because he hasn't shown that he is ready. Maybe he takes a step forward and becomes that player but odds are stacked against him at this point. Being ready is also not entirely about putting up points in the AHL. A ton of failed NHLers were some amazing AHL players with great offensive input and they "had nothing more to prove at the AHL level". Otherwise we'd see guys like Reid Boucher and Daniel Carr thriving in the NHL but as we know they are still in the AHL and chances that they develop into legitimate NHLers is minimal.

Very similarly to Logan Brown, Carr was producing well in the AHL and fans from Montreal had high expectations for him, especially that he started his NHL career on a high. He had good NHL stats for a younger guy. MTL fans were calling for Carr to make the team in the same way some are doing for L.Brown. Looking back at it now, we know he wasn't ready ... And he never ever was ready.

It doesn't mean that Brown will be Daniel Carr, but it's something to consider when asking for the team to put these guys on the roster when the team doesn't feel they're ready. This team hasn't really let go of any significant talent in the last years due to failed opportunity. Whenever guys didn't get opportunities it's because they weren't ready and ultimately they never became NHLers, See Shane Prince and Matt Puempel. People were livid when Prince got traded for a 3rd, now he's playing in the KHL. Da Costa is another great example.

Let's relax a bit a trust our coaching staff. If there's one thing not to trust in this organization it's the pro scouting, but the management of younger guys has been good. If Logan Brown was ready he would've been on the team last year and definitely this year. Let's see if he gets other chances, he might figure it out, but the team has earned my trust in handling younger players in the last couple years. The day we'll let go of a player that becomes a legitimate NHLer due to failed opportunity I'll change my mind but it's not the case.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Nice praise for sokolov

 

[Gil Gunderson]

 

[Alf Silfversson]

 

[Sweatred]

Yawn ... any line up news?

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

If things remain the same as in practice today, we're gonna start the season with 7 players on the ice/bench who the team drafted.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

I thought we had heard that very thing before.
I think he's lying both times

"I'll go on record to say on this today I feel the best decision I've made as general manager was picking Guy Boucher"

I love that expression "on this today"

"When I look back on my career I believe hiring DJ Smith will be one of the best things I have done"

I agree hiring someone that knows so much more about hockey and is so much better at their job was a great achievement for him both times.