Running with two guys that young down the pipe is EXACTLY satisfaction in continued losing seasons! You can't see that, I honestly can't help you. Perhaps someone in the mental health profession. What an odd statement man.
Please, Chia, please gut this core.
- Thread starter Up the Irons
- Start date
Running with two guys that young down the pipe is EXACTLY satisfaction in continued losing seasons! You can't see that, I honestly can't help you. Perhaps someone in the mental health profession. What an odd statement man.
I am the Liquor
ABK
- Oct 15, 2008
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Well there was a time not too long ago when the same argument being made for keeping Nuge was being made for keeping Gagner.
There is a lesson there somewhere.
Up the Irons
Registered User
he got that as 1c, with 1c ice time and 1st PP unit. He wont get near 60 as 2c. this is what you guys are missing. On almost every team in the league he wouldnt be the 1c, but he got to be that on this team.
Up the Irons
Registered User
KeithIsActuallyBad
You thrust your pelvis, huh!
Yeah, run RNH out of town and have McDavid/Drai be our top 2 centers and watch them get eaten alive by the likes of Doughty...
I am the Liquor
ABK
- Oct 15, 2008
- 40,455
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Sammy G is one of only four Flyers to post a positive +/- at the moment
He plays on the fourth line and has 5pts. Looks like we just didn't know how to use him properly. I'm sure when he recovers from falling on his face and returns to the lineup he will work on moving his +/- back to where it should be.
I certainly wasn't on that side of the argument.
The only lesson I am taking from this thread is that playing chess against pigeons is a fruitless exercise. No matter how many thoughtful or reasoned moves I make, the damned things are just gonna knock all the pieces over and **** on the board. I mean seriously, Sam Gagner. All over again.
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That's a false comparison because statistically Gagner was never as good as RNH. The two situations are completely different so the fact they have the same result (people arguing to keep them) is merely correlation without similar causation. You could also just apply this argument to Hall if you felt like it, "Some people wanted to keep Gagner so the fact some people want to keep Hall means they are in denial and he should be traded" obviously its nonsensical.
I am the Liquor
ABK
- Oct 15, 2008
- 40,455
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No, it wouldnt apply to Hall. He can hold his own physically. The other two not so much. I know you wont be able to find that in your encyclopedia of Fibonacci numbers so I guess you'll just have to take my word for it.
So true, tbh I don't see Nuge getting any better. Trade him while he's got value, enough holding on to this core for dear life. We are 30th ****ing place for the 5th straight year by December, give your heads a shake. Make a trade from our core and watch the team improve leaps and bounds. Too soft is the core
Isn't this the ..................???
Isn't this the Jeff Petry scenario all over again?...........with people wanting to get rid of RNH, Eberle, Yakupov, etc.............???
And then when they are gone and have success with a better team........everybody will be all over the GM for making such a trade.
Isn't this the Jeff Petry scenario all over again?...........with people wanting to get rid of RNH, Eberle, Yakupov, etc.............???
And then when they are gone and have success with a better team........everybody will be all over the GM for making such a trade.
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Up the Irons
Registered User
I wouldn't say completely different. Quite similar, really. both small Cs, both high draft picks, both expected to produce offense.
Only difference is Nuge is better. but not way better. Nuge is not Eric Stahl or Ansi Kopitar or David Backes.
I mean, maybe I'm coming off a bit too harsh. RNH is a good player. A solid 2C. But in no way shape or form is he anywhere near good enough to be considered untouchable or a keeper at all costs.
He's just too small to impose his will, and not gifted enough to rely on straight finesse. If he was, then, even in a slump, you would actually see him create more offense.
Look at Hall; he is in a bit of a mini slump, but he still creates a scoring chance almost every shift. the second he gets the ice the puck moves into the offensive zone. Your eyes see this happen.
So much wrong with this I don't know where to start except to say...it's wrong. Like wayyyyy wrong. Dead wrong. Absolutely and utterly wrong. Unequivocally, undeniably, unfathomably wrong. Please stop.
P.S. read this and then re-read your post. http://www.tsn.ca/trade-ryan-nugent-hopkins-really-1.403545
bombers15
5-14-6-1
- Mar 17, 2008
- 6,630
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Trade our first round draft pick right now while we're in the basement (presuming that McDavid will improve the team when he comes back). Teams will value it extremely high, and we should be able to get good value for it. Package that pick with Eberle and/or RNH, and you have yourself some badly needed defense.
Goaltending will be fine if the D is competent. The first two lines will be fine so long as McDavid, Drai, and Hall (or equivalent) are there.
But the bottom six desperately needs to be addressed. It truly blows my mind how this hasn't been fixed. It shouldn't be that hard to find a decent bottom-6. It really shouldn't be that hard.
Goaltending will be fine if the D is competent. The first two lines will be fine so long as McDavid, Drai, and Hall (or equivalent) are there.
But the bottom six desperately needs to be addressed. It truly blows my mind how this hasn't been fixed. It shouldn't be that hard to find a decent bottom-6. It really shouldn't be that hard.
bombers15
5-14-6-1
- Mar 17, 2008
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Someone else said this earlier, but I realize that the only reason I don't want to trade Hall or RNH (hell, throw in Eberle or Yakupov too) is because I truly fear seeing them succeed somewhere else. It's like not breaking up with a cheating girlfriend because you don't want to see her dating that guy.
Yet you think continuing with the current blueline, goaltending situation, and overall composition of this roster is geared to be competitive, despite years of evidence to the contrary? How do you expect glaring issues with this roster to be addressed without making a relatively significant trade? You have to give to get, and if you keep waiting for a miracle trade to fall into your lap, you're going to be waiting forever, and miss several good deals while you wait for the great one.
Numerous off-seasons have proved that big fish aren't going to come to Edmonton via UFA unless they are paid absolute top dollar, so that's not a super reliable approach to finishing off the rebuild and balancing the roster either.
This whole thing reminds me of a development project - an abandoned building waiting to be torn down, with a big banner hanging on the side, showing an artist's rendering of a new condominium, and big letters reading "COMING SOON", and underneath is written "www.<condoproject>2013.com". Most people who were interested in the project have given up on it, but some people are still supportive and excited about the whole thing.
And about the mental health comment - critical thinking and common sense here, bub. Park the hope and faith in Santa Claus and take a minute to reflect on what has been done to date and what the results have been. I'm not going to fling any sort of abusive pejoratives back your way, because this site has rules. Maybe you could explain to all of us what you are seeing, and what you think the answer is? If trading a high-value asset like RNH for a high-value return in defense isn't a helpful move in your mind, how do you propose to change the makeup of this team? Please, do tell.
In the meantime, try not to let the many voices of reason you refer to as "HFOil Logic" bother you. Common sense isn't for everyone.
Billy Barou
Registered User
- Mar 4, 2011
- 222
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Came to post a link to the same article, should be reposted often to reiterate the colossal mistake that would be trading RNH...and he's only 22!
"Voices of reason" "critical thinking" "common sense" "logic" = run a top-6 center combo w/ combined age <40 and expect to win. This should work really well! I mean, come on, we have one injured center and our depth is STILL atrocious.
"faith in Santa Claus" = let's use other assets (highly valued draft picks, scoring wingers, basically futures; NOT your only tough matchups veteran C) to improve this team without gutting the center depth we have desperately needed for over a decade.
You don't get fair value for players like nuge anyways, why not postpone it a year or two (which, if you read and considered other posts thoughtfully, would be abundantly apparent to you as my position).
Nice "logic" there "bub." Your spot at the children's table is set for dinner.
That shouldn't be the determining factor here. This team needs to get better, and if a reasonable deal comes along that helps balance out the roster in a way that improves out team, it has to be done. Can't be afraid of how player X will do elsewhere; we'll sit on our hands and stay bad if that's the case.
Billy Barou
Registered User
- Mar 4, 2011
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You can't just say "regardless of the return" because that is fantasy. You will never get full value on that trade.
So, you're saying to trade Eberle? Yakupov? The 2016 first round pick? What makes you so sure you'll get what you deem to be "fair value" for one of those assets, but not for RNH? Seems awfully presumptuous, with really no basis for such a statement.
As for the combined age <40 comment, the Penguins managed 47 wins with Crosby/Malkin having a combined age under 40, while playing in a stronger division than the Oilers currently find themselves in. Sure they also had Staal, but was Staal an untradeable asset? No. Should he have been? No. Are the Penguins able to win games without Jordan Staal? Yes.
Is all this overzealous nonsense re: RNH related to the Bruins/Stars Seguin trade, or something? I understand the Oilers did hire the GM that made that deal, but just because that deal was lopsided, doesn't mean a deal has to be lopsided (also RNH value isn't close to Seguin value).
Regarding the other garbage in your post - how many ignore lists are you on?
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Saying unequivocally that you won't get full value is also fantasy. It's all fantasy.
