Players you have watched that get no press historically

[IafrateOvie34]

Mike Krushelnyski is a name that comes to mind for me.

Craig Simpson had some really strong seasons early in his career until his back gave out.

Others that pop into mind are:
Kelly Kisio
Darryl Sydor is starting to feel like he's somewhat forgotten.

The Stars basically stole him from the Kings too. Krushelnyski and Kisio seem to be long forgotten, but they were good players. Simpson was insane during the late 80s. As for Clark, injuries really were an issue, but man was he one tough player.

 

[Bexlyspeed]

Then The Rangers got him but neglected to get anyone to get him the puck and he disappeared. he had like 3 or 4 straight 50 goal seasons

 

[jkrx]

I'm just going to mention some players that aren't close to stars but that were big in their roles.

Joey Kocur
Mike Eagles
Ray Ferraro
Tony Amonte
Patrick Poulin
Ed Olczyk
Dallas Drake
Peter Zezel
Kenny Jonsson
Todd Gill
Calle Johansson
Guy Hebert
Mark Tinordi

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Seeing his name also get neglected in this thread, I am going to go ahead and say Mike Gartner and Dale Hawerchuk are the two most overlooked stars from the 80s through early 90s.

Gartner had an astonishing record 17 seasons of scoring 30+ goals, with nine of them being 40+ goal seasons. Then you have Hawerchuk who scored 100+ points in six of his first seven years in the NHL, followed by six consecutive seasons 80-90+ points. He retired rather early at 33, but his numbers were stellar through out his 16-year career.

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

how about lorne chabot? he's a name that kicks around here and there, and someone who was vaguely familiar to me from reading hockey history books as a kid. but i was shocked to learn last year that he isn't in the hall of fame. i get that he played eighty years ago, but he has to be pretty high if not at the very top of the list of greatest goalies not in the hall of fame list. and yet year after year we only hear about vachon and barrasso, and now richter and joseph.

EDIT: just noticed that this qualifies under the "no press historically" part of the thread but, obviously, not the "players you have watched" part.

 

[Hawksfan2828]

Tony Mckegney. http://www.hockey-reference.com/players/m/mckegto01.html

Always a solid player, never spectacular but still a good player who hardly gets any press.

I was going to say him as well.

Al Secord would be another one, along with Doug Wilson and Steve Larmer.

Neal Broten and Brian Bellows as well.

Murray Bannerman is another one, Mike Liut to boot.

 

[Hawksfan2828]

I'd like to add Joe Murphy as well.

 

[patsypostal]

Tonelli might be somewhat under-rated, but I think most casual fans still know who he was and know that he was a good two-way player and grinder.

Bob Bourne and Stefan Persson, on the other hand, were huge contributors on that team who have been almost completely forgotten. Bourne scored 73 points in 73 games in those 4 playoffs, and Persson is incredibly anonymous considering he was the #2 defender on a dynasty.

Persson was my favorite player growing up. Great skater, very good defender, played all special teams, probably averaged 25-26 minutes a game. He wasn't afraid to hit people when he needed to, and would even occasionally fight when he had to (not very well usually). Think of a larger version of Brian Rafalski. If someone can think of a better comparison I would like to hear it
He set a record at the time for most assists by a rookie defenseman, yet he wasn't even in the top 5 for the calder.
He may have been the best player in the most important series the Isles played (1980 finals)
He was never an all star ! HUH!! ( BTW I would be curious to know who the best players post-expansion who never made an all-star).
I will never understand other than the anti-swedish bias that was rampant in that time period in the NHL, (look at all ofthe swedes rightfully on this list) why he was so underrated
Sorry for the rant, but I was just thinking about this about 20 minutes before I read this

 

[Axxellien]

Val Fonteyne:

..Val Fonteyne...In His unique way, an amazing player with an incredible record!

 

[BubbaBoot]

..Val Fonteyne...In His unique way, an amazing player with an incredible record!

1034 regular and playoff NHL and WHA games......only 38 total PIMs!!!!!

That is incredible indeed!

 

[Axxellien]

..Val Fonteyne:

..Downright extraordinary!..LOL

 

[VanIslander]

Curt Fraser
Bengt Gustafsson
Steve Payne
Tomas Sandstrom
Kelly Kisio
Michal Pivonka
Randy Burridge
Vyacheslav Kozlov

They were much bigger stars in my eyes than those of the press who so often ignored their great play in games in favour of more famous linemates/teammates.

 

[Sadekuuro]

Brian Propp, unless the topic is losing in the Stanley Cup Finals (or the Chelios incident)

 

[VanIslander]

Brian Propp

He sure has gotten a lot of attention during the Internet Age though. You'd think he was a HHOFer.

 

[VanIslander]

I'm just going to mention some players that aren't close to stars but that were big in their roles.

Ray Ferraro
...
Patrick Poulin
...
Kenny Jonsson
...
Calle Johansson
Guy Hebert
...

On these we agree fully.

 

[Hardyvan123]

Seeing his name also get neglected in this thread, I am going to go ahead and say Mike Gartner and Dale Hawerchuk are the two most overlooked stars from the 80s through early 90s.

Gartner had an astonishing record 17 seasons of scoring 30+ goals, with nine of them being 40+ goal seasons. Then you have Hawerchuk who scored 100+ points in six of his first seven years in the NHL, followed by six consecutive seasons 80-90+ points. He retired rather early at 33, but his numbers were stellar through out his 16-year career.

How can 2 HHOF guys qualify for this thread. Gartner for one gets plenty of attention on these boards and most of it is negative.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

How can 2 HHOF guys qualify for this thread. Gartner for one gets plenty of attention on these boards and most of it is negative.

I don't see their names mentioned much when discussing top offensive players from the past, we see the usual cast of names such as Gretzky, Lemieux, Sakic, Yzerman, Modano, Roenick, Bure, Selanne, Hull, Robitaille, Messier, etc. And why would Gartner get negative criticism from posters? Is it because he never played for a Stanley Cup?

 

[seventieslord]

Persson was my favorite player growing up. Great skater, very good defender, played all special teams, probably averaged 25-26 minutes a game. He wasn't afraid to hit people when he needed to, and would even occasionally fight when he had to (not very well usually). Think of a larger version of Brian Rafalski. If someone can think of a better comparison I would like to hear it
He set a record at the time for most assists by a rookie defenseman, yet he wasn't even in the top 5 for the calder.
He may have been the best player in the most important series the Isles played (1980 finals)
He was never an all star ! HUH!! ( BTW I would be curious to know who the best players post-expansion who never made an all-star).
I will never understand other than the anti-swedish bias that was rampant in that time period in the NHL, (look at all ofthe swedes rightfully on this list) why he was so underrated
Sorry for the rant, but I was just thinking about this about 20 minutes before I read this

Persson's reputation seems to be more that he was a PP guy, not necessarily a "great defender".

You are right that he did play all special teams, but in his career he was on the ice for three times as many PPGF as PPGA, so there's a definite major slant towards offensive duties there.

Scouting reports during his career said this about his non-offense skills:

"lean but strong..."

"doesn't hit hard but gets the job done by pokechecking and interfering... "

"uses brains instead of brawn... won't knock anyone over with a check but gets the job done... adept penalty killer... doesn't allow himself to be intimidated by bigger players... "

"efficient defender... seldom makes giveaways or errant passes... checks his man well... difficult to beat one on one... "

so it looks like he was fairly efficient defensively but you're probably overstating his physicality. You're definitely overstating his fighting though. Dropyourgloves.com has him with 9 career fights.

I do agree that he deserved more calder consideration than he received.

anyway, as for the part that actually caught my eye - ice time. You said that he probably averaged 25-26 minutes per game. Estimates based on GF/GA suggest he was closer to 20.05 minutes a game in his career, peaking at 22.5 in the 1984 season.

I'm only telling you this to correct your estimate, not to downplay Persson. Getting top minutes is toughest of all to do when you are on a great team.

Here's why he was never an all-star: he was never one of his team's best two defensemen. It is impossible to be voted top-4 in the league if you're even 3rd-best on your own team, and impossible to get in the top-10 if you're even 4th on your own team. This is where he ranked in total and ES icetime per game among Isles defensemen in his career:

1978: 4th, 6th
1979: 3rd, 7th
1980: 6th, 6th
1981: 3rd, 6th
1982: 3rd, 7th
1983: 5th, 5th
1984: 2nd, 3rd
1985: 4th, 4th
1986: 4th, 6th

Now in terms of points scored (mostly on the PP), absolutely, he was their #2 defenseman. But in terms of how much Arbour put him out on the ice, he was a #3-6 guy throughout his career, depending on the year, and depending on whether you consider total icetime or ES icetime as a more appropriate determining factor.

 

[85highlander]

Rick Middleton -- fantastic player and playmaker

 

[Canadiens1958]

Bob Dillabough

1034 regular and playoff NHL and WHA games......only 38 total PIMs!!!!!

That is incredible indeed!

Bob Dillabough was similar in many regards but Fonteyne was an ideal dept forward - able to play each of the forward positions equally, an elite penalty killer as well. Fonteyne was one of the better pure skaters of his time.

 

[Shootmaster_44]

Glenn Anderson is someone who jumps to mind for me. Really, most of the dynasty Oilers not named Gretzky, Kurri, Coffey, Messier or Fuhr, don't get the accolades they deserve.

I also think Luc Robitaille is a largely forgotten player. Yes he is the all-time leading scorer for LW and whatnot. But nationally, he was always the forgotten one in LA. He was always third or fourth banana on the Kings team behind Gretzky, Kurri and Hrudey. Once those guys were gone, he'd be forgotten behind Rob Blake and then late in his career it was Anze Kopitar.

 

[jkrx]

On these we agree fully.

I would say that it's a good result.

 

[seventieslord]

I also think Luc Robitaille is a largely forgotten player. Yes he is the all-time leading scorer for LW and whatnot. But nationally, he was always the forgotten one in LA. He was always third or fourth banana on the Kings team behind Gretzky, Kurri and Hrudey. Once those guys were gone, he'd be forgotten behind Rob Blake and then late in his career it was Anze Kopitar.

When Robitaille played with Kopitar, he was 39 and was nothing more than a bit player.

And was he really ever "behind" Kurri when the two were in LA? He was the guy scoring 36% more points per game during the time they were both there.

And Hrudey? Was an average-to-above-average goalie really more popular/recognized in LA than a guy who was consistently a top-5 LW in the league for a dozen years?

Obviously it was right for him to be recognized behind Gretzky, because he was nowhere near as good. (although, in the 1993 season he outpointed Wayne on a per-game basis) And same with Blake in the post-Gretzky era. There was nothing unfair about this. Blake was a top-5 blueliner in the league by then.

I think his career goal and point totals tend to overrate him, as a casual observer would make the connection between that, and him being a top-5 LW of all-time, which, when all eras are considered, just isn't the case. But don't get me wrong. I am a Lucky Luc fan, and I don't consider him just a compiler - he was top-25 in points a remarkable 11 times, eight of those times top-15.

Here are some other top wingers of the last two generations (guys whose careers overlapped Robitaille's fairly significantly) and the number of times they were top-25 and top-15 in points:

Jagr: 13, 12
Robitaille: 11, 8
Hull: 11, 5
Selanne: 10, 9
Recchi: 9, 7
Kurri: 8, 7
Tkachuk: 8, 4
Alfredsson: 7, 4
St. Louis: 6, 6
Iginla: 6, 5
Goulet: 6, 5
Kariya: 6, 5
LeClair: 6, 5
Bure: 6, 5
Fleury: 6, 4
Mogilny: 6, 3
Larmer; 6, 1
Kovalchuk: 5, 5
Shanahan: 5, 4
Kerr: 5, 1
Hossa: 4, 4
Naslund: 4, 3
Ciccarelli: 4, 2
Elias: 4, 2
Amonte: 4, 2
Propp: 4, 1
Andreychuk: 4, 1
Hejduk: 3, 2
Gartner: 2, 1
Neely: 2, 0
Bellows: 1, 1

Notice that a lot of guys who may be known as better "pure snipers" show up well below Robitaille when you focus on total points and not just goals. For a guy known as a one-dimensional goalscorer, he sure showed the ability to pile up assists, unlike players like Neely, Gartner, Andreychuk, Ciccarelly, Kerr, Kovalchuk and Bure. He and Selanne are both incredibly underrated as playmakers historically.

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

God, that list really hammers home what a joke Ciccarelli's induction was. Elias and Propp have simialr regualr season offensive peaks and both were far better overall players and playoff performers.

Alfredsson's consistency really shows through.

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

When Robitaille played with Kopitar, he was 39 and was nothing more than a bit player.

And was he really ever "behind" Kurri when the two were in LA? He was the guy scoring 36% more points per game during the time they were both there.

And Hrudey? Was an average-to-above-average goalie really more popular/recognized in LA than a guy who was consistently a top-5 LW in the league for a dozen years?

Obviously it was right for him to be recognized behind Gretzky, because he was nowhere near as good. (although, in the 1993 season he outpointed Wayne on a per-game basis) And same with Blake in the post-Gretzky era. There was nothing unfair about this. Blake was a top-5 blueliner in the league by then.

I think his career goal and point totals tend to overrate him, as a casual observer would make the connection between that, and him being a top-5 LW of all-time, which, when all eras are considered, just isn't the case. But don't get me wrong. I am a Lucky Luc fan, and I don't consider him just a compiler - he was top-25 in points a remarkable 11 times, eight of those times top-15.

Here are some other top wingers of the last two generations (guys whose careers overlapped Robitaille's fairly significantly) and the number of times they were top-25 and top-15 in points:

Jagr: 13, 12
Robitaille: 11, 8
Hull: 11, 5
Selanne: 10, 9
Recchi: 9, 7
Kurri: 8, 7
Tkachuk: 8, 4
Alfredsson: 7, 4
St. Louis: 6, 6
Iginla: 6, 5
Goulet: 6, 5
Kariya: 6, 5
LeClair: 6, 5
Bure: 6, 5
Fleury: 6, 4
Mogilny: 6, 3
Larmer; 6, 1
Kovalchuk: 5, 5
Shanahan: 5, 4
Kerr: 5, 1
Hossa: 4, 4
Naslund: 4, 3
Ciccarelli: 4, 2
Elias: 4, 2
Amonte: 4, 2
Propp: 4, 1
Andreychuk: 4, 1
Hejduk: 3, 2
Gartner: 2, 1
Neely: 2, 0
Bellows: 1, 1

Notice that a lot of guys who may be known as better "pure snipers" show up well below Robitaille when you focus on total points and not just goals. For a guy known as a one-dimensional goalscorer, he sure showed the ability to pile up assists, unlike players like Neely, Gartner, Andreychuk, Ciccarelly, Kerr, Kovalchuk and Bure. He and Selanne are both incredibly underrated as playmakers historically.

to my eyes, luc was very well loved in LA and was often their most visible player after wayne. i'll bet that today, more people in LA would recognize robitaille's name than dionne's. he has remained visible with the organization, at charity events, and he was always popular with the celebs which doesn't hurt.

you could argue that earlier in his career jimmy carson had a higher profile. and dionne at the very beginning of course.

in '93, when gretzky was out for most of the regular season, it seemed like luc got much more credit than kurri. they were excellent carrying the team together and if anything it's kurri's '93 year that is underrated historically.

later in his career, robitaille was usually the focal point, even after his prime. part of it was because of what he had done and what he meant to the franchise. and part of it was he was scoring 35 goals from the second line. i guess you could say he was eclipsed for a while by palffy, but palffy was legitimately a top player in the league for a bit. and at the very end, luc seemed to get more press than then-young hotshot frolov, who at that point was carrying him.

he never played a game with kopitar, by the way.