GWT: PL Matchweek (mostly) 3

[Adele Dazeem]

You also don't win games against Liverpool by pushing up with a back 3 that contains Luiz and Holding. He played it safe, we got dominated, but with Laca and Auba up front all it takes is an attack or 2 to grab a goal.

Who said anything about going full attack with the back-3?
But when you start a Xhaka-Elneny midfield and expect the ball to magically move up the field, you're gonna be sorely disappointed.

 

[Chimaera]

I just don’t quite get why he went how he did. Maybe some of the guys he didn’t pick lack fitness. Maybe he figured the experience would help. I don’t think Holding was terrible, at least not in the second half.

I just felt they couldn’t string 5-6 passes together without Liverpool getting it back. That’s also what I feel Klopp was alluding to about being a good performance. If that effort is there, to the point to where the other team can’t even hold possession, Liverpool will be fine. That was a level of will Liverpool haven’t really shown since the peak of last year. He can work on sharpness and integration. But seeing the effort and desire out of everyone was the big point.

 

[Adele Dazeem]

Keita had his best game in a Liverpool shirt.

 

[robertmac43]

Who said anything about going full attack with the back-3?
But when you start a Xhaka-Elneny midfield and expect the ball to magically move up the field, you're gonna be sorely disappointed.

You are complaining about the lack of offense and possession.. I just don't see how Arteta drastically changes that with the personal. Even if he started Ceballos at the start it's not liek the possessoin would be much higher, we would have just had a more creative ball going forward.

At the end of the day I see benefits to both Ceballos and Elneny in this game. Ceballos showed his benefits, but he was less active without the ball in front of the back line. Elneny was solid in cutting passing lanes down and getting some interceptions. It comes down to how much protection do you want the backline to have?

 

[Adele Dazeem]

You are complaining about the lack of offense and possession.. I just don't see how Arteta drastically changes that with the personal. Even if he started Ceballos at the start it's not liek the possessoin would be much higher, we would have just had a more creative ball going forward.

At the end of the day I see benefits to both Ceballos and Elneny in this game. Ceballos showed his benefits, but he was less active without the ball in front of the back line. Elneny was solid in cutting passing lanes down and getting some interceptions. It comes down to how much protection do you want the backline to have?

That's fine, I understand your reasoning. I still feel he could've approached the game with more effort/hope? I don't know if those are the right words.
I would've went with a 4-3(2-1)-3; same back line; Elneny-Xhaka; Ceballos; same front three.

 

[robertmac43]

That's fine, I understand your reasoning. I still feel he could've approached the game with more effort/hope? I don't know if those are the right words.
I would've went with a 4-3(2-1)-3; same back line; Elneny-Xhaka; Ceballos; same front three.

It's a tough one, we could have just as easily got blown out if we played a more progressive game of football. The security we played with gave us a fighting chance in the long game.

I don't think Arteta trusts Luiz in a back 4 an maybe didn't want to expose Gabriel to Liverpool playing alongside Holding.

 

[Adele Dazeem]

It's a tough one, we could have just as easily got blown out if we played a more progressive game of football. The security we played with gave us a fighting chance in the long game.

I don't think Arteta trusts Luiz in a back 4 an maybe didn't want to expose Gabriel to Liverpool playing alongside Holding.

Holding had a decent showing. I would like to see him paired with Gabriel asap.

 

[Live in the Now]

I think when it comes to game by game, that people should just look at performances against Liverpool for what they are. A team like Arsenal is a team of good players playing against a team that has no bad players, and the team with no bad players also has players who would come straight into the opponents team. The club has really outdone themselves this time. The manager has an utterly absurd amount of good players to choose from and is primed to lay down the benchmark once again.

 

[HoseEmDown]

Ok fine, would you prefer I say clubs that won't realistically be fighting relegation? There are many others I'd have ahead of Villa at this point. Maybe Villa isn't fighting relegation this season, but there are many clubs that I'm surprised didn't make a real effort to get Grealish since it seemed like he'd be moving on after last season. Everton would've been smart to go for him, but maybe he's holding out for one of the big 6.

I don't think any of the non big 6 could afford what Villa wanted and most of the big 6 didn't need him. Arsenal seems like the best bet since they don't have a 10 as good as him but I have seen no interest from them. As for Everton they're a step up but I don't think a big enough one, they really aren't a consistent Europa league team or anything just a more consistent mid table team. From what a read what Grealish new contract is i don't know if he'd be making much more financially either. I think the premier league is a better league when Villa is a top half club and a guy like Grealish is willing to stay instead of going to a big 6 to be a rotational player.

 

[Chimaera]

I think when it comes to game by game, that people should just look at performances against Liverpool for what they are. A team like Arsenal is a team of good players playing against a team that has no bad players, and the team with no bad players also has players who would come straight into the opponents team. The club has really outdone themselves this time. The manager has an utterly absurd amount of good players to choose from and is primed to lay down the benchmark once again.

It’s a bit more than this. He has better players sure. But he has guys who will run through a wall. The effort of players who are talented is off the charts. I’m always reminded of Chris Wilder from Sheffield United talking about how guys who are world class give everything to win back a lost ball. Every loose ball, every 50/50, it felt like Liverpool will win it. If guys like Mane, Salah and Firmino will lay it out like they’re trying to save their jobs, what choice does Jota have but to come buy in? If I’m Jones, I know I have to be ready to put every once out there if I want to get on the pitch.

there are more talented lineups in the past, I think, sure, but effort isn’t at the same level at the time.

 

[Cassano]

20+ lead by Christmas.

 

[S E P H]

I was feeling down from that match, but holy shit this had me in tears...

I really, really hope that if Arteta has a bad season, that your board holds onto those two meaningless wins against Liverpool as justification for him not being sacked. Emery got a point against Liverpool when they were actually trying to win the title and I don't see anyone ever bringing that up.

I said in the past they were meaningless games, but a win against a very good team is still a win no? Here's the ting, nobody is calling Arteta a world class manager, he's far too young to ever be labelled that and simply doesn't have the experience nor his players. Every single bloke he had on the pitch today is the same club that you lot beat the same way with Emery last year or whateva. I don't think Arteta properly had a good match in personnel decisions nor tactics tonight, but to say he sucks because he couldn't beat a team who never loses at home is just strange to me.

Holding had a decent showing. I would like to see him paired with Gabriel asap.

Mate, watttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttt?

 

[les Habs]

Anyone who wants to have a go at Keane I’m all for. If it happens to be a Liverpool manager ever better. Keane got run out of town trying to manage.

Say whatever you want, but Klopp clearly overreacts here. He didn't even get what Keane said right and from what I understand was wrong in what he himself said to boot.

 

[Live in the Now]

Say whatever you want, but Klopp clearly overreacts here. He didn't even get what Keane said right and from what I understand was wrong in what he himself said to boot.

Incorrect

 

[les Habs]

Incorrect

LOL, an 8 second clip? As bad as it is to actually post that to Twitter considering how it's barely representative of what Keane said, imagine re-posting it. Well I suppose you don't have to imagine since you actually did re-post it.

He didn't get what Keane said right because he likely didn't hear everything Keane said and Keane clarified, and that was after the host said as much himself. Keane clearly was referencing Arsenal's goal and another chance. Keane said "they were sloppy one or two occasions at the back, but job done and good start to the season for them." To take that a step further, Carragher followed that with "a bit sloppy at times at the back." Having only seen the "short version" of the highlights, I'd say to say Liverpool were sloppy at the back on one or two occasions is pretty spot on since they were indeed sloppy on Arsenal's only goal which it should be noted put Liverpool behind.

Back to what Keane said though, Keane also said:

"Liverpool were by far the better team."
"Overall Liverpool certainly deserved the victory."
"They're like a machine."
"They've got great quality going forward."
"They look obviously one of the fittest teams around."
"They kind of suffocate teams."

And all of that was before Klopp came on and before Keane praised their pressing saying "it's brilliant" and "it's great to watch".

So if Liverpool weren't sloppy on one or two occasions at the back, if it wasn't a job well done, if they haven't had a good start to the season, if they weren't by far the better team, if they didn't certainly deserve the victory, it they're not like a machine, if they haven't got great quality going forward, if they don't look obviously one of the fittest teams around, if they don't suffocate teams, if their pressing isn't brilliant and if their pressing isn't great to watch, then by all means, Keane's analysis is sloppy and he's out of his depth on his game analysis.

 

[Live in the Now]

LOL, an 8 second clip? As bad as it is to actually post that to Twitter considering how it's barely representative of what Keane said, imagine re-posting it. Well I suppose you don't have to imagine since you actually did re-post it.

He didn't get what Keane said right because he likely didn't hear everything Keane said and Keane clarified, and that was after the host said as much himself. Keane clearly was referencing Arsenal's goal and another chance. Keane said "they were sloppy one or two occasions at the back, but job done and good start to the season for them." To take that a step further, Carragher followed that with "a bit sloppy at times at the back." Having only seen the "short version" of the highlights, I'd say to say Liverpool were sloppy at the back on one or two occasions is pretty spot on since they were indeed sloppy on Arsenal's only goal which it should be noted put Liverpool behind.

Back to what Keane said though, Keane also said:

"Liverpool were by far the better team."
"Overall Liverpool certainly deserved the victory."
"They're like a machine."
"They've got great quality going forward."
"They look obviously one of the fittest teams around."
"They kind of suffocate teams."

And all of that was before Klopp came on and before Keane praised their pressing saying "it's brilliant" and "it's great to watch".

So if Liverpool weren't sloppy on one or two occasions at the back, if it wasn't a job well done, if they haven't had a good start to the season, if they weren't by far the better team, if they didn't certainly deserve the victory, it they're not like a machine, if they haven't got great quality going forward, if they don't look obviously one of the fittest teams around, if they don't suffocate teams, if their pressing isn't brilliant and if their pressing isn't great to watch, then by all means, Keane's analysis is sloppy and he's out of his depth on his game analysis.

Oh dear, another essay you wasted your time writing. If you agree that he said it at one point and agree that Klopp heard him say it, that's what he was responding to. I posted the tweet based on the video solely. I like that he defended his team. End of. It's like when someone praises Messi and subsequently says something bad about a decision he made, and you only see the bad part and respond to it. You have experience with that so I'm sure the analogy makes sense to you, and it's nice for supporters when someone defends anyone's club of choice.

 

[les Habs]

Oh dear, another essay you wasted your time writing. If you agree that he said it at one point and agree that Klopp heard him say it, that's what he was responding to. I posted the tweet based on the video solely. I like that he defended his team. End of. It's like when someone praises Messi and subsequently says something bad about a decision he made, and you only see the bad part and respond to it. You have experience with that so I'm sure the analogy makes sense to you, and it's nice for supporters when someone defends anyone's club of choice.

I was spot on. Like I said originally, Klopp overreacted, he didn't get what Keane said right and Klopp was wrong himself to boot.

Go ahead and provide these Messi examples. Hilarious coming from you btw.

 

[Live in the Now]

I was spot on. Like I said originally, Klopp overreacted, he didn't get what Keane said right and Klopp was wrong himself to boot.

Go ahead and provide these Messi examples. Hilarious coming from you btw.

I’m hardly going to waste my time looking for them. There’s nothing wrong with having done that in any case.

 

[Chimaera]

Say whatever you want, but Klopp clearly overreacts here. He didn't even get what Keane said right and from what I understand was wrong in what he himself said to boot.

Maybe, maybe not. But I don't have a problem with Klopp taking a pop at Keane. He's a meh commentator (at best), and I don't really think there needs to be much explanation as to why a Liverpool supporter might not like him all that much.

 

[les Habs]

I’m hardly going to waste my time looking for them. There’s nothing wrong with having done that in any case.

Well it would be a waste of your time because you're wrong.

Maybe, maybe not. But I don't have a problem with Klopp taking a pop at Keane. He's a meh commentator (at best), and I don't really think there needs to be much explanation as to why a Liverpool supporter might not like him all that much.

Well you should if you like Klopp because he didn't come off looking good there. Defending your team is one thing, and more power to Klopp for doing so at the right time, but getting someone's commentary wrong and getting your own analysis wrong doesn't look good.

Dislike him or not, but he very often gives Liverpool a lot of credit just as he did after today's match. He of course gets it wrong as well, like when he and Carragher picked a best combined XI with the current Liverpool side and the 99 United side and he's Keane's reasoning for including Giggs was lazy to say the least, but generally I'd say he gets it right where Liverpool are concerned based on what I've seen. You're free to your opinion, but it doesn't look good when the full context is put forward.

And for the record, I didn't read this thread and seek out the video. YouTube forwarded a video, a Sky video that is the typical sensationalism we see all the time these days and which I find annoying to say the least, and then I came to the thread a while afterwards.

 

[TheMoreYouKnow]

Klopp wasn't born yesterday; he knows by now that the Man U faction on Sky like to throw shade at his team at every given opportunity. After a top notch win vs a good team he wasn't going to have it. Not like Roy Keane, the man who more often than not ends professional relationships via a falling out, could ever complain about someone overreacting.

 

[YNWA14]

Yeah I've no problem with Klopp there. He wasn't even disrespectful, he asked a question then went on to describe how he felt the team played (which was right, they were incredible) and then said he'd go back and watch it if he'd heard it wrong. Klopp is great.

 

[les Habs]

Klopp wasn't born yesterday; he knows by now that the Man U faction on Sky like to throw shade at his team at every given opportunity. After a top notch win vs a good team he wasn't going to have it. Not like Roy Keane, the man who more often than not ends professional relationships via a falling out, could ever complain about someone overreacting.

The "Man U faction on Sky"? You mean Keane and Carragher? OK. Like to throw shade at his team at every opportunity? Yeah, watch the video I posted and tell us about all the shade being thrown.

 

[S E P H]

Klopp was very disrespectful during the end of the game, he celebrated with ten blokes of his team down to the ball boy while Arteta was waiting to shake his hand. I'm sorry but you should have more respect in the losing side, Mikkel wanted to get the feck out of there as fast as possible and Klopp was celebrating with Casper the Ghost. Don't worry because that will bite him back in the arse for the future. FTR, I have no problem with celebrating at all, but do it after you shook the opposing managers hand first.

 

[PeteWorrell]

Klopp being passionate is how he wins over fans, his staff and players which has made him succeed at the highest level. The fact that it triggers thin-skinned opponents is a nice bonus.