Salary Cap: Pittsburgh Penguins Salary Cap - Wakin' up too early

[Ryder71]

I want Saad.

Bjugstad + our 1st is fair value for him, no?

I think so. That looks about right to me. I suggested that very same scenario and if the Hawks don't want to keep Nick, they could just trade him for another pick/asset.

 

[Ryder71]

Beyond the absurd amount of injuries to key players the issue I'd be concerned with is that we haven't had many games against the elite teams in the east. After we play the Caps, Lightning and Bruins I think we'll have a better idea as to how we'll fare. I think we can compete against anyone, but we still have eight games against these teams and haven't played the Canes yet and still have two more with the Leafs.

 

[Ryder71]

I honestly believe the Pens management think so highly of Saad that they may give up more than he's worth including Kahun. It doesn't matter what we think... sadly it's what Pens management and GMJR think and they have seemed enamored with Saad. At the beginning of the season, that wasn't the case with Kahun. Plus Kahun at 1m is not the same as Kahun at 3-4m. He's on pace for a decent raise soon enough.

Wait, why are they trading Kahun? That's counter intuitive to what we're trying to do here. You want to add Saad but not subtract such a player as Kahun. I'm not following here.

 

[OswaldBates]

I honestly believe the Pens management think so highly of Saad that they may give up more than he's worth including Kahun. It doesn't matter what we think... sadly it's what Pens management and GMJR think and they have seemed enamored with Saad. At the beginning of the season, that wasn't the case with Kahun. Plus Kahun at 1m is not the same as Kahun at 3-4m. He's on pace for a decent raise soon enough.

well Kahun at 3 or 4 million is Better than Saad at 6 million

 

[OswaldBates]

Wait, why are they trading Kahun? That's counter intuitive to what we're trying to do here. You want to add Saad but not subtract such a player as Kahun. I'm not following here.

because some people are nucking futs ?

 

[Tom Hanks]

How about Galchenyuk for Clifford? Only reply if you’re in agreement.

Deal

EDIT: I was talking about the book

 

[Riptide]

What if JR goes full Shero 2013 deadline? With this roster, with how they are performing, he would go down as one of the biggest power moves in Pens history. I don't know if anyone will ever top Patrick with the Ronnie and Ulf deal.

I think the only way he could do that is if he went after someone like Hall (or someone close to that caliber). I don't think going after guys like Saad, Kerider, etc would qualify. Nor do I think JR would go that route. 2013 was special in the sense that effectively there was no salary cap due to how contracts pro-rated over the shortened season. We won't have that this year, and thus everything needs to be close to dollars in, dollars out. We have leeway due to Guentzel's 6m hit but that's only going to go so far.

I think the more success the team has the more brazen is he going to be.

I could see that being reflected in the players he acquires, but not the same quality/quantity that Shero did in 2013.

 

[Ryder71]

Gotta say, the value that JR extracted from EDM and CHI in the Marino and Kahun/Maatta deals was phenomenal. One more such move like that would be tremendous. lol

 

[Gurglesons]

I would love Kyle Clifford instead of ZAR on the 4th line tbh. Issue is it probably means ZAR is on L1.

 

[Ryder71]

because some people are nucking futs ?

I skimmed through the thread and didn't see the logic behind it or thought maybe I missed a post. Yeah, I don't get that at all.

 

[Riptide]

Gotta say, the value that JR extracted from EDM and CHI in the Marino and Kahun/Maatta deals was phenomenal. One more such move like that would be tremendous. lol

Same with the McCann/Brassard deal. And the Sprong MP deal. In fact most of the trades Rutherford has done, have been very very good. It's only the FA signings where he hasn't been great. And even those it's hard to really judge given that you don't know what he's being told by the agent and other GMs (I assume they do in fact talk candidly prior and after FA opens). I know many on HF judge GMs all the time based on the contracts they give out... but if most here were GMs they wouldn't be signing anyone, because "so and so" is only worth 2m in their opinions and not a penny more.

 

[pokey10]

Same with the McCann/Brassard deal. And the Sprong MP deal. In fact most of the trades Rutherford has done, have been very very good. It's only the FA signings where he hasn't been great. And even those it's hard to really judge given that you don't know what he's being told by the agent and other GMs (I assume they do in fact talk candidly prior and after FA opens). I know many on HF judge GMs all the time based on the contracts they give out... but if most here were GMs they wouldn't be signing anyone, because "so and so" is only worth 2m in their opinions and not a penny more.

Cullen and Tanev are equally as good as some of his bad FA contracts have been...

 

[Riptide]

There's a real strong possibility you'd end up with the worse player in that trade. They can have Simon if they want, but if they want Kahun, the + is on their side and not ours.

Not to mention you'd then have to go get another top 6 winger anyway, which kind of defeats the point...

I'm not even sure I'd do that. We don't have a lot of skilled players on the wings who can make plays with the puck (and I'm not entirely sure Saad replaces that). Not that Simon is great or a top 6 guy... but with Guentzel out, we really can't afford to be moving the few guys we have that can do that.

 

[Peat]

Same with the McCann/Brassard deal. And the Sprong MP deal. In fact most of the trades Rutherford has done, have been very very good. It's only the FA signings where he hasn't been great. And even those it's hard to really judge given that you don't know what he's being told by the agent and other GMs (I assume they do in fact talk candidly prior and after FA opens). I know many on HF judge GMs all the time based on the contracts they give out... but if most here were GMs they wouldn't be signing anyone, because "so and so" is only worth 2m in their opinions and not a penny more.

Tanev and the Unexpected Resurrection and Redemption of Jack Johnson evens up the FA scale a lot tbf (although he's got to ensure we're not around for any sequel entitled The Expected Demise and Destructiveness of Jack Johnson to really get good marks there).

 

[Turin]

How about Galchenyuk for Clifford? Only reply if you’re in agreement.

Would probably be fine with that. Don’t know why LA would bother, but I guess it’s not like they need Clifford either. Clifford’s contract is up this year too right?

 

[wgknestrick]

I honestly believe the Pens management think so highly of Saad that they may give up more than he's worth including Kahun. It doesn't matter what we think... sadly it's what Pens management and GMJR think and they have seemed enamored with Saad. At the beginning of the season, that wasn't the case with Kahun. Plus Kahun at 1m is not the same as Kahun at 3-4m. He's on pace for a decent raise soon enough.

Saad CHI 1920

Saad is a great player, no doubt, and they are right to covet him for his 5v5 impact. His metrics are also pretty impressive considering he plays for CHI. He makes everyone significantly better when he's on the ice with them. Saad is considerably better than Kahun currently but I admit they are on different trajectories.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I wouldn't do Galchenyuk for Clifford because Clifford doesn't have the speed I want out of a bottom-6 defensive forward. If you're going that route, I think you go after Rodrigues out of Buffalo.

I'll add that I'm not super interested in getting another speedy defensive forward, because I think the Penguins need to acquire offensive talent for their wings, but I don't think JR agrees with me. I think Galchenyuk for Rodrigues is a pretty reasonable suggestion for what JR would target, I just don't see where they'd play another speedy defensive winger. I don't see this team lacking a bottom-6 forward unless they're going to play Simon on the top line, which I don't want them to do.

 

[Jacob]

Would probably be fine with that. Don’t know why LA would bother, but I guess it’s not like they need Clifford either. Clifford’s contract is up this year too right?

Yeah. I figure they probably prefer futures for their UFAs but I don’t think Clifford will fetch a high pick or good prospect anyway so they might wanna take a chance that Galchenyuk fits and re-signs rather than getting a 3rd round pick.

 

[chethejet]

GMJR has a good idea who or what will be available for trade discussions. But it still comes down to cost and short and longer term fit for the team. Saad at 6 million is to much for 2021. Now can he be moved after this year yes, but at what return and will the Pens eat some salary? Or they decide he helps say more than Bjugstad and move him. In any event, GMJR will make the deal that helps the team this year and possibly next as well.

 

[Gurglesons]

I wouldn't do Galchenyuk for Clifford because Clifford doesn't have the speed I want out of a bottom-6 defensive forward. If you're going that route, I think you go after Rodrigues out of Buffalo.

I'll add that I'm not super interested in getting another speedy defensive forward, because I think the Penguins need to acquire offensive talent for their wings, but I don't think JR agrees with me. I think Galchenyuk for Rodrigues is a pretty reasonable suggestion for what JR would target, I just don't see where they'd play another speedy defensive winger. I don't see this team lacking a bottom-6 forward unless they're going to play Simon on the top line, which I don't want them to do.

He’s faster than ZAR. And he brings a lot of what ZAR does but better.

Not to mention he can go toe to toe with Wilson.

 

[WayneSid9987]

Instead of acquiring a top LW, I wonder if a 4C would be enough. That would let Blueger be 3C and move McCann to the vacant LW spot.

Why not both:
Saad+Glendening

McCann/Kahun-Sid-Saad
McCann/Kahun-G-Rust
Tanev-Bleuger-Horny
Simon/ZAR-Glendening-Bjugs
or
ZAR-Glendening-Simon/Lafferty/Aggs/Blandisi, etc.

Had one wish for the bottom 6/4th line, it would be more help at the dot.
Saad+Glendening both PK too so you wouldn't need to dress ZAR.
You could throw more offensive options like Simon or more speed like Lafferty.

PK'ers:
Bleuger-Tanev
Glendening-Rust/Saad
with Sid in here and there as usual.

 

[wgknestrick]

It kills me with everyone clamoring on about Jack Johnsons "great" year where instead of being an outright dumpster fire, he's merely average (with a 35+ contract, and a high cap hit). He's been equivalent to Riikola who makes almost 1/4th as Johnson. BFD! He is still an ongoing issue and if you can move him before the deadline, you shoot IMO. He is at "peak" JJ.


Dumo, Letang
Pets, Marino
Riikola, Schultz
Ruh

 

[Empoleon8771]

He’s faster than ZAR. And he brings a lot of what ZAR does but better.

Not to mention he can go toe to toe with Wilson.

But they're not scratching ZAR and most likely not trading him, either. They're not actively looking to upgrade the 4th line I think.

It kills me with everyone clamoring on about Jack Johnsons "great" year where instead of being an outright dumpster fire, he's merely average (with a 35+ contract, and a high cap hit). He's been equivalent to Riikola who makes almost 1/4th as Johnson. BFD! He is still an ongoing issue and if you can move him before the deadline, you shoot IMO. He is at "peak" JJ.


Dumo, Letang
Pets, Marino
Riikola, Schultz
Ruh

1. He does not have a 35+ contract
2. $3.25 million is not a high cap hit
3. He's been a really solid fringe #4/5 this year
4. Riikola is not an "equivalent player" to him, they're vastly different players. Riikola flat out can't do what JJ does, just like JJ flat out can't do what Riikola does

Your entire post is just completely wrong

 

[Andy99]

He’s faster than ZAR. And he brings a lot of what ZAR does but better.

Not to mention he can go toe to toe with Wilson.

on that note, I'd rather have Blake Coleman for L4 in place of ZAR...

 

[WayneSid9987]

It kills me with everyone clamoring on about Jack Johnsons "great" year where instead of being an outright dumpster fire, he's merely average (with a 35+ contract, and a high cap hit). He's been equivalent to Riikola who makes almost 1/4th as Johnson. BFD! He is still an ongoing issue and if you can move him before the deadline, you shoot IMO. He is at "peak" JJ.


Dumo, Letang
Pets, Marino
Riikola, Schultz
Ruh

I wish they'd phase him out as well but it is what it is.
They DID favor Olli over him.
Can they get to the point of favoring Riiko over him?
Possibly...