Salary Cap: Pittsburgh Penguins Salary Cap Thread - Hungry for Change

[ZeroPucksGiven]

This whole Johnson trade/no trade situation just makes me wish we had some answers from the Penguins on a couple of questions:

- What do the Penguins actually want to get out of trading Johnson? Is it cap space, clearing out some expensive and expendable depth or getting rid of a bad player? Or is it a combination of 2 or all 3 of those? Seeing how they were willing to swap Johnson for Rask in a potential Kessel deal, I'm not sure they're gunning for cap space here.
- Why has Johnson not been traded yet? Is the asking price to take him too high or is JR refusing to add any significant assets or retain salary? Or is JR just targeting a return that isn't feasible for Johnson?
- Is there any situation where the team is ultimately fine with keeping Johnson or happy to keep him? Or is he 100% a dead man walking in their eyes?

This whole situation just seems weird. If they really wanted to just trade Johnson, I think they could do it in an afternoon. If they just want to clear out an expensive defenseman since they're super deep on D, you can probably trade Johnson for a similarly expensive forward. If they want to clear out cap space by moving Johnson, that's going to be painful but also doable. The big question I have is this: if the team wants to trade Johnson as much as it appears to want to, why have they not bitten the bullet on moving him yet?

Why doesn't the team just bench him, like they did for Game 1 of the playoffs?

I'd prefer he's traded so Sully isn't tempted to do something stupid, but i'm fine with him just in the press box not actively hurting this team's chances of winning the freakin game.

 

[ZeroPucksGiven]

Or maybe, Hornqvist is playing with Crosby because when they get together magical things happen?

Sid vehemently disagrees with you, but I and most of the board does.

 

[SHOOTANDSCORE]

Why doesn't the team just bench him, like they did for Game 1 of the playoffs?

I'd prefer he's traded so Sully isn't tempted to do something stupid, but i'm fine with him just in the press box not actively hurting this team's chances of winning the freakin game.

Maybe someone is interested in him but wants to see a little more before they commit. We better hope he has the game of his life.

 

[pokey10]

What would have been a better deal? Zucker and Rask for Kessel and JJ or Kessel for Chucky and POJ but we keep JJ?

I want the later. POJ could be something beautiful.

 

[66-30-33]

I want the later. POJ could be something beautiful.

Could be, still got no idea if we are keeping Chucky beyond this season. Geno might price him out of town. Then it's Kessel for POJ vs JJ and Kessel for Zucker and Rask. Rask has like 2? more years and Zucker 5?

 

[ZeroPucksGiven]

Maybe someone is interested in him but wants to see a little more before they commit. We better hope he has the game of his life.

People know who JJ is by this point and time- he's got 800+ NHL games under his belt. This "showcasing" rationalization that people are throwing out is pure BS

 

[pokey10]

Could be, still got no idea if we are keeping Chucky beyond this season. Geno might price him out of town. Then it's Kessel for POJ vs JJ and Kessel for Zucker and Rask. Rask has like 2? more years and Zucker 5?

If Gally stays in the 6m or less range we should be okay.

 

[Ms Maggie]

Seems to me there are 3 possible outcomes assuming JJ is one the 2nd line:

He's good: thank you Jesus, miracles do happen!

He's awful: he's benched.

He's meh: this is the worst option. Still plays.

Are lynch mobs still a thing?

In any event, let's go Pens!!!

 

[Riptide]

I love Debrincat.

6.4mil is a lot, though.

He scored 41g/76pts. And he did it without the benefit of having Crosby as his center, and he did it sooner then Guentzel did (2nd pro season vs 3rd). 6.4m is a bargain for what he can do.

 

[Peat]

What would have been a better deal? Zucker and Rask for Kessel and JJ or Kessel for Chucky and POJ but we keep JJ?

Really hard to call. Both have a fair amount of risk and a fair amount of potential reward. If you take the point that JJ and Rask are as bad as each other, and a POJ level asset would be required to be rid of either most times, it's probably Zucker vs Galchenyuk - Zucker's a safer bet to be better and has better cap certainty but lacks Chucky's ceiling; a second bad season from Zucker and maybe he's a hard contract to move while you can deffo get your money back on Chucky if things go pear shaped. Plus the Arizona deal was kinder on the cap this year.

People know who JJ is by this point and time- he's got 800+ NHL games under his belt. This "showcasing" rationalization that people are throwing out is pure BS

Maybe it's BS to you, but I'm not sure it's BS to the org.

Also there's been a fair amount of variation in JJ's career over the years. Last year was particularly rancid. Proving he's not that bad would probably change his valuation a fair amount.

 

[SHOOTANDSCORE]

People know who JJ is by this point and time- he's got 800+ NHL games under his belt. This "showcasing" rationalization that people are throwing out is pure BS

It makes as much sense as anything right now, and you have no idea what some other GM might want to see. Players change over the years. If the "people know who he is" theory held water, teams would hardly bother to send pro scouts around the league to scout anyone beyond their first few years.

I'd say it's less rationalization than it is logic. JR is actively trying to trade him. JJ played the preseason on the bottom pair and was clearly on the outs. Now after failing to move him, he's paired up with Schultz and we're carrying 9D.

That seems to me like they want him to look good and at the same time they want to be prepared to need an extra D. Now maybe that isn't what is going on but you can't just toss it out as "pure BS." It's as good a theory as any.

 

[Riptide]

Adam Larsson to LTIR. Wonder if there are any spare unwanted defensemen around the Oilers might want

The puck he took didn't look too bad when I was watching that game lastnight - and he still played most of the game. Either way I don't see them having any more interest to bring in a D like JJ then they did 2 days ago.

 

[canadianguy77]

So I guess Crosby lost all of the"authority" he's had in previous seasons and is being "forced" to play with Hornqvist again. Riiigghhht.

 

[Ms Maggie]

It makes as much sense as anything right now, and you have no idea what some other GM might want to see. Players change over the years. If the "people know who he is" theory held water, teams would hardly bother to send pro scouts around the league to scout anyone beyond their first few years.

I'd say it's less rationalization than it is logic. JR is actively trying to trade him. JJ played the preseason on the bottom pair and was clearly on the outs. Now after failing to move him, he's paired up with Schultz and we're carrying 9D.

That seems to me like they want him to look good and at the same time they want to be prepared to need an extra D. Now maybe that isn't what is going on but you can't just toss it out as "pure BS." It's as good a theory as any.

It's not a great theory, but the only one that makes sense given what is known.

 

[molon labe]

So apparently leaving a terrible D Corps in place, while bringing in/icing a handful of forwards who can't finish - isn't a recipe for success?

ZAR is the new later-years' Kunitz. I've said it about a half dozen other times, but that guy is a whole lot of nothing. Always 'there' - never finishing...never CLOSE to finishing. Quick to throw his entire soul into a play and get some Corsi numbers by hacking a puck into the side of the net.

Tanev is promising - but when he shoots into the chest of a goalie after a great dish from Geno, looks like we just have Hagelin on a 6 year deal (nothing wrong with that, but pretty much a speedy penalty killer and disrupter).

Kahun who? Seriously invisible player.

Schultz was abysmal. If we didn't already have a terrible defense I'd be looking to salvage some value out of him.

 

[Jacob]

I’ve switched gears on the Johnson thing... there’s no showcasing to be done. He could play lights out for a month and that won’t change his league-wide value with 4 years still left on the deal. Everyone knows what he is and what he will be in the years to come.

Just start icing the best team possible.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

People know who JJ is by this point and time- he's got 800+ NHL games under his belt. This "showcasing" rationalization that people are throwing out is pure BS

Not only that, but "showcasing" implies he might do something to raise his stock, which history shows us will not happen. The only thing that happens when JJ is in the line-up is that we become a worse team.

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

Good to see we’re making sweeping definitive statements about the team after game 1.

 

[molon labe]

I’ve switched gears on the Johnson thing... there’s no showcasing to be done. He could play lights out for a month and that won’t change his league-wide value with 4 years still left on the deal. Everyone knows what he is and what he will be in the years to come.

Just start icing the best team possible.

Our team just isn't that good. Until Schultz can get to a 40+ point pace, Galchenyuk produces 50-60, Hornqvist produces 50, and Bjugstad chips in with 15-20 goals or so we're going to be a fringe wildcard.

Defense is not good, and forward group consists of one wing who can finish (Guentz), and two wings who might be able to finish (PH / Gally). The rest of the offense starts and stops with Sid/Geno.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

So apparently leaving a terrible D Corps in place, while bringing in/icing a handful of forwards who can't finish - isn't a recipe for success?

ZAR is the new later-years' Kunitz. I've said it about a half dozen other times, but that guy is a whole lot of nothing. Always 'there' - never finishing...never CLOSE to finishing. Quick to throw his entire soul into a play and get some Corsi numbers by hacking a puck into the side of the net.

Tanev is promising - but when he shoots into the chest of a goalie after a great dish from Geno, looks like we just have Hagelin on a 6 year deal (nothing wrong with that, but pretty much a speedy penalty killer and disrupter).

Kahun who? Seriously invisible player.

Schultz was abysmal. If we didn't already have a terrible defense I'd be looking to salvage some value out of him.

He was lights out all preseason.

What could have changed...

 

[molon labe]

Good to see we’re making sweeping definitive statements about the team after game 1.

That's an easy thing to say, I know.

But is it not fair to A) Expect more from a home/season opener following a first round sweep, and/or B) Expect more with the turnover we had?

Zero inspiration outside of Geno's line - and it appears all the moves we made did absolutely nothing. Bunch of forwards who don't even come close to finishing and defense who don't do much at all for us. If this was November then I wouldn't care - this was the statement game that said a lot.

You don't see other teams saying this stuff, so why does Pittsburgh get a pass for being absolutely terrible?

 

[molon labe]

He was lights out all preseason.

What could have changed...

Well outside of the obvious (Preseason is no indication of anything...you're playing against PTO guys / playing some minutes with JJ last night) - - even when Schultz got the puck in prime positions he didn't seem to distribute it well nor look for any offense (outside of the final minute). Idk what his deal is tbh.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Well outside of the obvious (Preseason is no indication of anything...you're playing against PTO guys / playing some minutes with JJ last night) - - even when Schultz got the puck in prime positions he didn't seem to distribute it well nor look for any offense (outside of the final minute). Idk what his deal is tbh.

His problem is playing with JJ, a bad player who brings everyone down and not coincidentally hadnt played with all preseason.

Put him back with Pettersson and witness a miraculous turnaround.

 

[Jacob]

Schultz was bad and some of the things that stood out couldn’t be blamed on his partner... like bad outlets and getting shots blocked or letting someone get in behind him. That’s on him.

Not overly concerned though because he’s been able to bounce back since he’s been here... either from injury or the occasional bad game.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I didn't think Schultz was that bad yesterday in the first place, but it seems incredibly lazy to just say "he played with Johnson!!!!!" as a reason for why he played badly.

Schultz looked very noticeable in the offensive zone, so even with a couple of turnovers when trying to move the puck, I don't think he was Letang or Gudbranson level bad yesterday.