Toggle sidebar

OT: Philadelphia Eagles (NFL): Playoffs - Eagles Still Pick Sixth, They Have A Coach

Status
Not open for further replies.
LegionOfDoom91

LegionOfDoom91

Registered User
Jan 25, 2013
82,055
140,030
Philadelphia, PA
BrokenStix said:
Sucess probability and player worth.

I really don't understand the value of players and picks in the NFL. The NHL is relatively straight forward.

Centres
Defenseman
Wingers
Goalies

In that order.

1st rounders are three, maybe four times more valuable than 2nd rounders outside the top 10 picks.
Click to expand...

Yeah there’s a lot more positions. QB is obviously by far & away the most valuable then you have some form of pass rusher & OT probably next. Not counting special teams your probably least valuable position is RB & LB given the shorter shelf life those guys generally have. In between them you can probably more so debate value on IOL, IDL, WR/TE, DB, etc. by more of a player basis.

For the most part the top group positions generally get pushed up the draft board & involve more of the higher profile trade ups especially QB.

So that kind of changes the success rates of picks. You pretty much have to get a QB in the first round if you’re looking for one as the best prospects naturally get pushed up draft boards. That can push value at other positions down draft boards as well.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: CanadianFlyer88 and BrokenStix
Elvis P

Elvis P

You ain't nothin but a hound dog
Dec 10, 2007
23,965
5,709
Graceland
Which QB had the best career and why?

1. Dan Marino
2. Jim Kelly
3. Fran Tarkenton
4. Dan Fouts
5. Slingin Sammy Baugh
6. Sid Luckman
7. Warren Moon
8. Randall Cunningham
9. Steve McNair
10. Philip Rivers
 
philly_28

philly_28

Valar Morghulis
Apr 9, 2007
1,483
969
Hawkman said:
Which QB had the best career and why?

1. Dan Marino
2. Jim Kelly
3. Fran Tarkenton
4. Dan Fouts
5. Slingin Sammy Baugh
6. Sid Luckman
7. Warren Moon
8. Randall Cunningham
9. Steve McNair
10. Philip Rivers
Click to expand...

Dan Marino

Put up insane numbers in an era when defenders were pretty much allowed to mug the receivers.

And did so while having little run support (when the running game still mattered way more than today).
 
  • Like
Reactions: JXC, Hawkman and Schwarbomb
Elvis P

Elvis P

You ain't nothin but a hound dog
Dec 10, 2007
23,965
5,709
Graceland
Ironically in the pre-Marino 70s with Csonka, Morris, and FB Kiick they had arguably 3 of their top 5 backs all time.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: JXC
Tripod

Tripod

I hate this team
Aug 12, 2008
78,855
86,248
Nova Scotia
Moon.....since you said career.

Moon played 6 years in the CFL winning 5 Championships, 2 MVP's, and in the HOF.

Imagine if he had those extra years in the NFL instead to increase stats. When he retired, he was top 5 in TD's, Yards and completions in the NFL.

Combined NFL/CFL, he passed for 70,553 yards and 435 TD's. He has had 2 careers in 2 leagues.

Crazy that he is in the HOF in both leagues.
 
  • Like
Reactions: JXC and Hawkman
Elvis P

Elvis P

You ain't nothin but a hound dog
Dec 10, 2007
23,965
5,709
Graceland
Good post. Kelly is the only QB in history to go to 4 straight SBs. Thomas and Reed made a good offensive trio and Bruce Smith is a top 5 all time pass rusher.
 
Elvis P

Elvis P

You ain't nothin but a hound dog
Dec 10, 2007
23,965
5,709
Graceland
"The 23rd ranked Hurts has a 2021 salary that's 3.4 percent the size of 35th ranked Wentz's. Philadelphia signed Wentz to a four-year, $128 million contract extension in 2019 that kicks in for the 2021 season. The deal includes nearly $70 million guaranteed. Next season Wentz will count nearly $35 million on the Eagles salary cap, good for 17 percent of Philadelphia's total cap space. Don't forget either that the cap is expected to dip next year due to Covid expenditures, so that percentage will likely increase." Wentz's contract gives Eagles worst QB situation in NFC East.

In 2019 I said how many playoff games has he won.
 
deadhead

deadhead

Registered User
Feb 26, 2014
49,215
21,617
While he has Hurts too high, he also has a valid point, a lot of current starting QBs are at the end of their careers, if you're rebuilding for 2023, they're not viable candidates. And while it's nice to say that a top ten pick will outplay Hurts, go look at the track record of QBs taken in the top 10 the last decade, the odds are against you.

Hurts is an unknown, he's played in a number of college playoff games, he finished his career putting up numbers similar to the last two QBs taken #1 in the draft, I mean he's not chopped liver. He doesn't have a cannon arm, but he's got better arm strength than Deshaun Watson. He needs to learn how to read a NFL defense, but that's true of just about every college QB playing a spread or RPO, including the top draft picks.

Hurts is in a close to ideal situation, a coaching staff with proven QB developers, a solid OL (doubtful they have the same string of injuries), they'll probably add at least one top receiver if not more in the draft (Chase/Pitts and . . . ). Of course, this would also work for Wentz.
 
  • Like
Reactions: renberg
DancingPanther

DancingPanther

Foundational Titan
Sponsor
Jun 19, 2018
32,055
70,005
I said it before and I'll say it again: if all it takes to render you useless is a middle linebacker spying you, you stink
 
Hollywood Cannon

Hollywood Cannon

I'm Away From My Desk
Jul 17, 2007
86,528
156,946
South Jersey
deadhead said:
While he has Hurts too high, he also has a valid point, a lot of current starting QBs are at the end of their careers, if you're rebuilding for 2023, they're not viable candidates. And while it's nice to say that a top ten pick will outplay Hurts, go look at the track record of QBs taken in the top 10 the last decade, the odds are against you.

Hurts is an unknown, he's played in a number of college playoff games, he finished his career putting up numbers similar to the last two QBs taken #1 in the draft, I mean he's not chopped liver. He doesn't have a cannon arm, but he's got better arm strength than Deshaun Watson. He needs to learn how to read a NFL defense, but that's true of just about every college QB playing a spread or RPO, including the top draft picks.

Hurts is in a close to ideal situation, a coaching staff with proven QB developers, a solid OL (doubtful they have the same string of injuries), they'll probably add at least one top receiver if not more in the draft (Chase/Pitts and . . . ). Of course, this would also work for Wentz.
Click to expand...

You mean the game where he had a 50% completion percentage and ~50 yards against Washington? Or the following game where he was sub 50% and had over half of his yards came from one pass to a wide open OJ Howard (68/131)? Or the following year where he was benched at halftime of the National Championship for completing 3 passes for 21 yards? Or that time against LSU where he once again had a sub 50%?

Those games? They're mighty impressive if you ask me.

The guy started in five playoff games and was halfway decent in ONE of them.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Striiker, Cody Webster and DancingPanther
LegionOfDoom91

LegionOfDoom91

Registered User
Jan 25, 2013
82,055
140,030
Philadelphia, PA
LegionOfDoom91 said:
Yeah there’s a lot more positions. QB is obviously by far & away the most valuable then you have some form of pass rusher & OT probably next. Not counting special teams your probably least valuable position is RB & LB given the shorter shelf life those guys generally have. In between them you can probably more so debate value on IOL, IDL, WR/TE, DB, etc. by more of a player basis.

For the most part the top group positions generally get pushed up the draft board & involve more of the higher profile trade ups especially QB.

So that kind of changes the success rates of picks. You pretty much have to get a QB in the first round if you’re looking for one as the best prospects naturally get pushed up draft boards. That can push value at other positions down draft boards as well.
Click to expand...

I should also add now a days you basically have hybrid positions essentially since it’s such a pass heavy league. So for example essentially your pass rushers are called EDGE’s now a days. As you can have a DE with this hand in the dirt or a LB stand up rushing the passer as well depending on scheme. Like Clay Matthews for example is/was listed as a LB on the official depth chart or whatever but rushed the passer in a 3-4 formation (3 DL & 4 LB). You also have a STAR position which is essentially like a SAF/LB/CB hybrid role. Malcom Jenkins essentially was that for the Eagles despite being listed as SAF.

Your traditional run stuffing IDL or ILB types are pretty much valueless in this league if they can’t impact the pass game. Same with blocking TE’s. They’re basically end the of the draft in drafted free agent types now a days. When perhaps 20+ years ago they were going in the first three rounds with the heavily emphasis on the run.
 
  • Like
Reactions: JojoTheWhale and Young Sandwich
deadhead

deadhead

Registered User
Feb 26, 2014
49,215
21,617
Hollywood Couturier said:
You mean the game where he had a 50% completion percentage and ~50 yards against Washington? Or the following game where he was sub 50% and had over half of his yards came from one pass to a wide open OJ Howard (68/131)? Or the following year where he was benched at halftime of the National Championship for completing 3 passes for 21 yards? Or that time against LSU where he once again had a sub 50%?

Those games? They're mighty impressive if you ask me.

The guy started in five playoff games and was halfway decent in ONE of them.
Click to expand...

And Lawrence looked like crap in a couple championship games with great offensive talent.
The only QB who impressed me this year was Jones, and he had a huge talent edge (especially OL).
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Ad

Latest posts

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad

Top Bottom