OT: Philadelphia Eagles: It’ll Take More Than A Few Bounces To Knock Our Crown Off Part Eight

[OrangeAndBlackMetal]

because foles is extremely decisive with the ball.

Idk it’s that he’s more decisive. I think it’s that he’s calmer and is making his reads quicker. Something we’ve seen wentz do, tremendously. He just didn’t do it this year, and you’re kidding yourself if you think his health had nothing to do with that.

 

[Rich Nixon]

Alcohol is better for you.

 

[Jtown]

What did I do!? Lol

you must've done something. you're on the list.

 

[Rebels57]

Turns out the kick was tipped.

Parkey is exonerated.

 

[Hurricane28]

Wentz is the guy long term. The offense was better when he was on his tear, playing at an MVP caliber level. He was never fully healthy this year.

 

[achdumeingute]

That’s a key part of the debate. Wentz got the daylights beaten out of him this year. Foles hasn’t. Why? is the magic question.

umm foles has been getting hit hard too. Haaaard.

 

[achdumeingute]

Found this around. Apparently it was from midseason and making the rounds again.

 

[JXC]

because foles is extremely decisive with the ball.

I tend to agree. I think guys run better routes for him, too.

 

[usahockey22flyers]

What a win.

 

[MorgantiDrinksBlood]

If Foles doesn’t get signed Philly should riot. He’s better than Wentz, It’s just the reality. The guy is f***ing money when the lights are the brightest.

 

[flyguy]

That’s a key part of the debate. Wentz got the daylights beaten out of him this year. Foles hasn’t. Why? is the magic question.

Foles has taken hits this year though. Bruised ribs at the end of the Redskins game ring a bell? He even took quite a few hits in this game too.

I would guess an entire season worth of those hits would wear on Nick as much as the have on Carson.

The whole Foles vs. Wentz debate is tough because we don't know what Carson would do in these playoff games, and we don't know how Foles would look playing more games throughout the year, with opportunity for more wear, as well as more tape for defenses to prepare against him.

In my opinion, Wentz is still the future of this team (he's only 26!) and it's been great that Foles has come in back to back years and done the job needing to be done. We are lucky as Eagles fans for this, but to write Wentz off is premature.

 

[ponder719]

Found this around. Apparently it was from midseason and making the rounds again.

Yeah, that was from the Bears-Lions game, where Parkey shanked 4 FG attempts.

 

[Here4ThaLids]

(Hey, Bat-Dad)

I DIDN'T HEAR NO BELL!

 

[Flyers Faithful]

Did anyone else notice all the hickeys on Carson wentz neck tonight?

 

[Flybynite]

Turns out the kick was tipped.

Parkey is exonerated.

Maybe if it wasn't tipped it would have been pushed wide and went 10 yards wide of the upright and never even hit it

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

 

[JojoTheWhale]

because foles is extremely decisive with the ball.

The playcalling is also much more conservative with Foles. Part of the huge jump that Wentz made last year was not requiring babysitting like that. It shows in depth of drop, depth of target, RB targets, etc etc etc. I know the broadcast had some stat about Foles vs Zones, but that's really missing the point entirely. Before yesterday, they moved to Base 12 to get to those situations. Their TE talent will slaughter single High from 12, so you force teams to play softer and get Foles into his bread and butter YAC production.

Yesterday's game plan called for Foles to do more against Man and he really couldn't do it. The Bears play almost entirely Zone. The reason they ran so much 11 was to get them into Man, which is where you start to need more zip, especially downfield. When you don't have it, you end up with hospital balls and plays like the second pick.

I thought he struggled presnap in ways I didn't expect too, as he's generally very good there. There were a couple of times it looked like he wasn't seeing that the guy over the Slot was the SAM and checked to a run. That's unusually sloppy for him.

 

[Jtown]

The playcalling is also much more conservative with Foles. Part of the huge jump that Wentz made last year was not requiring babysitting like that. It shows in depth of drop, depth of target, RB targets, etc etc etc. I know the broadcast had some stat about Foles vs Zones, but that's really missing the point entirely. Before yesterday, they moved to Base 12 to get to those situations. Their TE talent will slaughter single High from 12, so you force teams to play softer and get Foles into his bread and butter YAC production.

Yesterday's game plan called for Foles to do more against Man and he really couldn't do it. The Bears play almost entirely Zone. The reason they ran so much 11 was to get them into Man, which is where you start to need more zip, especially downfield. When you don't have it, you end up with hospital balls and plays like the second pick.

I thought he struggled presnap in ways I didn't expect too, as he's generally very good there. There were a couple of times it looked like he wasn't seeing that the guy over the Slot was the SAM and checked to a run. That's unusually sloppy for him.

the problem this year is that wentz of last year never showed up, and people were unwilling to admit that. The reason why the playbook may have expanded with Wentz was his ability to extend the play and look for more agggressive options. That ability that made him so special last year is also what limited him so much this year. Wentz was a statue back there and because of his willingness to extend plays and look for bigger plays he got sacked, and fumbled quite frequently. Meanwhile Foles gets rid of if it in a decisisve fashion. That is the biggest difference between these two. Wentz hasn't adjusted to his own limitations yet. Foles on the other hand is much more aware of what he can and can't do on the football field. The 2nd pick was bad, but they were going against the best defense in the league. I take that performance all day everyday .

Your criticism is fair, but the reality is this team has looked significantly better with Foles playing qb this year. Everyone sees it, and is willing to acknowledge it. I and @Cody Webster have been begging this team to play foles all season after Wentz really struggled. Once Foles starting playing, this team resembled the juggernaut of last season. Foles is going to have to play better going forward, and I have no doubt that he will knowing that there is not another defense like that left in the playoffs. Now we won't be as one dimensional. Hopefully we can really start opening the playbook up once we get the running game going and kill teams with play action in which foles is great at.

 

[FatTugboatFlahr]

Begging for Foles was hilarious and always will be.

Especially when you put emotions aside.

 

[Jtown]

Begging for Foles was hilarious and always will be.

Especially when you put emotions aside.

Hilarious to a fool. Yet 100 percent the correct decision. And there is ample proof to back this up, such as the current win streak this team is on after the change in quarterbacks.

 

[BM14]

I tend to agree. I think guys run better routes for him, too.

I think its because there's less improvisation on the QB's part and the WRs can stick to the pre-planned routes.

 

[Rich Nixon]

I don't know how there's even a debate. Nick Foles is the greatest QB in NFL history, bar none. Upon his retirement (later this year, after winning his second straight Super Bowl MVP honors) the sport will be henceforth "Folesball" and the league will become the "National Folesball League." Quarterbacks will become "Folesgods" and the Lombardi Trophy will be renamed "The Big Nick" (and slightly reshaped).

 

[JojoTheWhale]

the problem this year is that wentz of last year never showed up, and people were unwilling to admit that. The reason why the playbook may have expanded with Wentz was his ability to extend the play and look for more agggressive options. That ability that made him so special last year is also what limited him so much this year. Wentz was a statue back there and because of his willingness to extend plays and look for bigger plays he got sacked, and fumbled quite frequently. Meanwhile Foles gets rid of if it in a decisisve fashion. That is the biggest difference between these two. Wentz hasn't adjusted to his own limitations yet. Foles on the other hand is much more aware of what he can and can't do on the football field. The 2nd pick was bad, but they were going against the best defense in the league. I take that performance all day everyday .

I'm in a bit of a weird spot with Wentz. I thought he needed a ton of work coming out and was massively overrated as a rookie and to start last season, which also meant I feel like he didn't get enough respect for what he turned into from the Arizona game forward. That was a quantum leap.

At least in the circles I travel, the argument was more along the lines of that stretch earning him the right to play through his struggles this year than arguing he was the same guy. I'm still pretty on board with that, but there was definitely a regression. I do wish they reined the offense in a little more for him to ease him back, but there was so much turnover that the staff needed some time to find itself too.

Your criticism is fair, but the reality is this team has looked significantly better with Foles playing qb this year. Everyone sees it, and is willing to acknowledge it. I and @Cody Webster have been begging this team to play foles all season after Wentz really struggled. Once Foles starting playing, this team resembled the juggernaut of last season. Foles is going to have to play better going forward, and I have no doubt that he will knowing that there is not another defense like that left in the playoffs. Now we won't be as one dimensional. Hopefully we can really start opening the playbook up once we get the running game going and kill teams with play action in which foles is great at.

They're still nowhere close to last season's peak. They were blowing the doors off of teams. The biggest change from the middle of the season to now is the defense. That's not Nick Foles.

 

[BigToe]

All this rational thought is bothering me.

 

[onlylordsvsmorebp]